Had the misfortune of going for a pint after work in the IFSC last night and seeing the results of the latest murder. How do we stop these scumbags or are we so desensitised that we just accept these events as a fact of life. I am totally against the death penalty but having seen first hand the respect that these people have for human life, it does make me wonder..... Now we have mothers and innocent kids doing a days work getting caught up in it. Depresses me
Gangland Killings
- Thread starter Sunny
- Start date
I share your depression and (maybe naive) but I cannot believe what's going on, and allowed to go on.
There is something gone so wrong with our justice system when there are this many murders- the last few months have been just off the scale.
Mr mc dowell- stand up....we're all ears..
There is something gone so wrong with our justice system when there are this many murders- the last few months have been just off the scale.
Mr mc dowell- stand up....we're all ears..
Maybe it's because I'm at a distance from it now, but I figure most all of us grew up hearing daily of murder, punishment beatings, bombings, arrests since the 70's, and after a government blind eye murder of a gangland leader (Cahill) we have the mess we're in today. It's easy to blame drugs, but how many posters have indulged in "soft drugs"? Whn doing so has anyone wondered where they're produced? Who is controlling the flow etc? When I was last in Ireland for a prolonged period I had the chance to teach in my local 2ndary school, where, during my time there, I arrived into work on a Monday 3 times after a weekend local murder, the 3rd time was the uncle of 2 of my students, all drug or crime related.
We've just come out (in a way) from a 20-odd year civil war, the means of funding that violence are now coming back to bite us, and so long as we continue to ignore facts on the ground then this is not going to go away.
We've just come out (in a way) from a 20-odd year civil war, the means of funding that violence are now coming back to bite us, and so long as we continue to ignore facts on the ground then this is not going to go away.
Who is blaming the politcians?
ubiquitous
Registered User
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Legalise drugs? I am not so sure about this one myself, but I haven't heard it mentioned once in press, radio or TV. I think it is worth debating though. Of course you would need to look at the experience of other countries EG. Switzerland who have done this to see if gang crime is lower there. We would also need a mature political attitude, which is something I can't see happening any time soon.
Memories are short. We had an exact similar situation in the mid-90's with similar debate.
Unfortunately it took the high profile murder of a high profile journalist to act as an immediate catalyst to fast-track change in legislation and initiate preventative action. This change could have been initiated at any stage previous to this as the writing was on the wall.
Unfortunately it took the high profile murder of a high profile journalist to act as an immediate catalyst to fast-track change in legislation and initiate preventative action. This change could have been initiated at any stage previous to this as the writing was on the wall.
Markjbloggs
Registered User
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- 384
Yeah - internment without trial worked really well the last few times it was used in this and other jurisdictions!
Maybe not internment, but constant, oppressive surveilance. Watch their every move until they make a mistake, then wade in big.
Yeah - internment without trial worked really well the last few times it was used in this and other jurisdictions!
I know. Was just being flippant. It just amazes me that everyone who gets killed seems to be known to Gardai and I assume they are getting killed because they are up to no good so either they are too smart to get caught or the guards don't have the powers to touch them. Its like the guy in Finglas earlier in the week. Everyone in the Guards and even the Press knew he was one of the County's biggest drug dealers and yet they couldn't touch him.
In my opinion legalisation of drugs would be a massive step forward, maybe it's time to recognise that this prohibition policy introduced in the 30's (?) is a not working - don't we all look back at US prohibition and think, what a disaster that was. The major advantages/benefits would be:
1. Remove the supernnormal profits for the dealers, no longer any incentive for criminals to get involved and put their lives at risk for a few euro.
2. Ensure the quality of the product - this would save lives of the users.
3. Reduce petty crime by users trying to fund their habit.
4. Bring in revenue for the state which could be used for education on the dangers of various substances.
I don't know how this would work, presumably through the pharmacy network in some form, but any new system could not be worse than the current situation. We have to realise that just because something is available, it does not mean that the people are going to go out and use these substances to extemes, some will obviously, but they currently do anyway, at any rate, it is time for a grown up debate on this, not just here, but throughout Europe (no point in involving the US as they got us into this mess in the first place).
That Latvian woman who was shot dead recently was known to Gardaí but not for any wrongdoing. That young apprentice plumber who was shot dead was not known to the Gardaí.
I agree the drug problem and associated crime and social issues have gone beyond the simplistic 'Victorian' probhibition remedy.
elefantfresh
Registered User
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- 450
Any political party that proposed legalisation of certain drugs (even soft drugs) would be gone so fast they couldn't say boo. I agree that something must be done as what they are currently doing obviously doesn't work. Perhaps some sort of legalisation may be the answer but you can bet your bottom dollar than in this Modern Ireland there are still the old school who will never allow something like that to happen even if it was proved to work. You know the type. Enda Kenny stands up and says lets legalise spamspamspam for this reason and that reason - thats the last we'll see of him - Political suicide unfortunatly. Perhaps in 20 years.
I think you know what I meant. Neither of those murders were so-called gangland killings i.e. one criminal scumbag killing another. They were just innocent victims.
S
sunrock
Guest
Not much will happen until someone important like a t.d., judge , garda or such like..higher ranking person gets murdered.
Then the autorities will pull out all the stops......like going around to all the known top gang leaders and using c.a.b. to confiscate their ill gotten gains.....it`s all a matter of political will.
Criminals killing off each other ... or some unfortunates caught in the crossfire....won`t get the same response.They haven`t forgotten the response ..after the guerin murder
I`M SURE THE CRIMINALS ARE AWARE OF THIS and don`t want to bring serious heat on themselves by doing in an important person deliberately.
Was the apprentice plumber aware he was working in a gang leaders house? AND the latvian woman...was threatened by her ex.. ..were all putting themselves in danger.despicable as these crimes were.
Now decriminalising drugs sounds good..but why decriminalise a dangerous substance,whose use would then escalate. Look at spamspamspam... causes mental illness in many of its users..schizo.etc
There is no point in making it easy for people to get illegal drugs...at least if they buy the drugs from criminals..they know they`re participating in a sordid trade.....anyway its a great way of educating people about our market economy.
As was said the gardai know all the players so there is a lid on this activity..plenty of grasses,and a hierachy of criminals, all getting an oppurtunity to get promoted as other players "leave" the scene.
Then the autorities will pull out all the stops......like going around to all the known top gang leaders and using c.a.b. to confiscate their ill gotten gains.....it`s all a matter of political will.
Criminals killing off each other ... or some unfortunates caught in the crossfire....won`t get the same response.They haven`t forgotten the response ..after the guerin murder
I`M SURE THE CRIMINALS ARE AWARE OF THIS and don`t want to bring serious heat on themselves by doing in an important person deliberately.
Was the apprentice plumber aware he was working in a gang leaders house? AND the latvian woman...was threatened by her ex.. ..were all putting themselves in danger.despicable as these crimes were.
Now decriminalising drugs sounds good..but why decriminalise a dangerous substance,whose use would then escalate. Look at spamspamspam... causes mental illness in many of its users..schizo.etc
There is no point in making it easy for people to get illegal drugs...at least if they buy the drugs from criminals..they know they`re participating in a sordid trade.....anyway its a great way of educating people about our market economy.
As was said the gardai know all the players so there is a lid on this activity..plenty of grasses,and a hierachy of criminals, all getting an oppurtunity to get promoted as other players "leave" the scene.
I believe the garda and their deployment lies within Mr mcdowells role?
I'm open to correction on that.
Ultimately, policing will have to be part of the solution.
Policing currently does not appear to be able to cope with this area, and so it would seem to me that something needs to be done about that....
That's the reason for my comment...
I'm open to correction on that.
Ultimately, policing will have to be part of the solution.
Policing currently does not appear to be able to cope with this area, and so it would seem to me that something needs to be done about that....
That's the reason for my comment...