FAS grants for female apprentices, sexist?

[ClubMan]

I suppose in the same way there are very few blokes in

secretarial work, nursing, librarianship or personel

its just the way it is.

Are you sure about there being "very few blokes" in some of those sort of jobs? In my experience there are quite a few working as nurses, librarians and in HR.

By the way I don't think that anybody has posted the link to the scheme in question already?

 

[ClubMan]

Apprenticeship is just a form of slavery

The only winner is the greedy cowboy employers... it's a joke that it is not covered by minimum wage and that young fellas/cuddies are out there working for less than 200 euro a week for at least a 40 hour week.

I packed in my office job last year to learn myself a trade... I started out with an absolute cowboy of a plumber.

Probably not a good idea to generalise too much from your own individual bad experience?

 

[sandrat]

most men that are librarians are in the higher up managery type jobs so you don't see them in the branches

 

[Diziet]

The thing for me is where do you draw the line at what discrimination is

too fat
too thin
too tall
too short
where you come from
what religion you are
what your name is
how you speak
too ugly
too good-looking (that's my one)
too old
too young
bald
too much hair
face hair
bad dresser
bad breath

I just think it's unfair that there should be grants for employers to get female apprentices, no such grant applies for men to be secretaries or nurses.

You draw the line at what the discrimination legislation says - that's what it is there for.

It is quite legitimate for organisations to create a scheme to create balance in the workforce, provided they don't create a permanent differential in salary for the employees. The comparison with nurses and secretaries is a poor one and comes across as rather emotive. Unless you can provide the data that is.

 

[Purple]

The comparison with nurses and secretaries is a poor one and comes across as rather emotive. Unless you can provide the data that is.

Are you suggesting that there is a gender balance in these two areas?

 

[Diziet]

Are you suggesting that there is a gender balance in these two areas?

Not at all. However, the decision on grant provision as in the example, depends on the extent of the imbalance, not simply the existence of an imbalance.

 

[DavyJones]

Are you sure about there being "very few blokes" in some of those sort of jobs? In my experience there are quite a few working as nurses, librarians and in HR.

By the way I don't think that anybody has posted the link to the scheme in question already?

Thats it, thanks, I would have done it but don't know how.

I have asked this question earlier, If it is acceptable for FAS to offer grants to females only, then is it ok for me to advertise for female apprentices only?
I have a feeling it's a big no-no.

 

[Diziet]

You are acting as an employer, so no. FAS is acting as a training/scheme provider, not an employer. It is an incentive, not a direct payment to the individual apprentice.

Should this be in Letting off Steam, or is it a genuine work question?

 

[DavyJones]

You are acting as an employer, so no. FAS is acting as a training/scheme provider, not an employer. It is an incentive, not a direct payment to the individual apprentice.

Should this be in Letting off Steam, or is it a genuine work question?

I am involved in apprentice training and this scheme struck me as being odd. Because there is a drop in apprentices (atleast in the trade I work), I think it would be a good idea to have a similar grant availible no matter what sex a trainee is.

 

[S.L.F]

FAS is acting as a training/scheme provider, not an employer. It is an incentive, not a direct payment to the individual apprentice.

Yes but FAS is a govt agency paid for with tax payers money, ie both men and women pay tax so why should women be the sole benificiaries.

 

[ClubMan]

most men that are librarians are in the higher up managery type jobs so you don't see them in the branches

There are plenty of "front desk" male librarians in the libraries that I visit regularly (Cabra and Central/ILAC). I recall there being quite a few in Ballymun and Phibsboro when I used to visit a few years back.

Thats it, thanks, I would have done it but don't know how.

contains, among other things, instructions on posting links.

 

[aircobra19]

I guess you could email http://www.equality.ie/ and ask?

 

[ClubMan]

I guess you could email http://www.equality.ie/ and ask?

Now why didn't I think of that?

Maybe ask the the Equality Authority? Perhaps there is some loophole/exemption for this?

 

[S.L.F]

There are plenty of "front desk" male librarians in the libraries that I visit regularly (Cabra and Central/ILAC). I recall there being quite a few in Ballymun and Phibsboro when I used to visit a few years back.


contains, among other things, instructions on posting links.

My wife is a librarian for many years.
She interviews on a regular basis.
I asked her last night for her idea on % of men compared to women from her experience it would be 25% men to 75% women.

If you ask one of the librarians in those libraries they will give you the same general figures.

I'll be going through the posting guidelines myself.

I guess you could email http://www.equality.ie/ and ask?

I might do that.

 

[aircobra19]

Now why didn't I think of that?

I was repeating it for emphasis.

But tbh who cares if it was said before. Its a valid means of communication to repeat something.

..ah go on, go on, go on, go on, go on, go on, go on....

 

[sandrat]

There are plenty of "front desk" male librarians in the libraries that I visit regularly (Cabra and Central/ILAC). I recall there being quite a few in Ballymun and Phibsboro when I used to visit a few years back.

They might not be librarians. Could be library assistants / summer / temporary staff.

I am a librarian and in a higher up grade and you will find for those interviews there are more men going for them percentage wise than the numbers in the lower grade jobs. Better be nice to S.L.F in case I'm going for any jobs soon!

 

[ClubMan]

My wife is a librarian for many years.
She interviews on a regular basis.
I asked her last night for her idea on % of men compared to women from her experience it would be 25% men to 75% women.

Exactly. 25% is hardly "very few".

I suppose in the same way there are very few blokes in

secretarial work, nursing, librarianship or personel

I'll be going through the posting guidelines myself.

Eh?!

 

[Diziet]

Yes but FAS is a govt agency paid for with tax payers money, ie both men and women pay tax so why should women be the sole benificiaries.

Sole beneficiaries is a bit strong IMO. As far as I can see the female apprentices get no extra pay. It simply shifts the entrance balance a little.

Presumably the thinking is that, statistically, employers would be less inclined to offer female apprentice applicants a place (because there are so few in the trades). The relatively small grant is designed to overcome that hurdle.

Why is this worrying you so much?

 

[S.L.F]

You said

By the way I don't think that anybody has posted the link to the scheme in question already?

Davey said

Thats it, thanks, I would have done it but don't know how.

You said

contains, among other things, instructions on posting links.

Then I said

I'll be going through the posting guidelines myself.

Because I could use more knowledge on the ways of using AAM.

............................................................................................

Exactly. 25% is hardly "very few".

Its not half and its only in the last couple of years that it has improved and this was without incentives of any kind.
So why should 1 half of our society get an extra advantage over the other.

Sole beneficiaries is a bit strong IMO. As far as I can see the female apprentices get no extra pay. It simply shifts the entrance balance a little.

Presumably the thinking is that, statistically, employers would be less inclined to offer female apprentice applicants a place (because there are so few in the trades). The relatively small grant is designed to overcome that hurdle.

Why is this worrying you so much?

Its not worrying me.

Re: FAS grants for female apprentices, sexist?

Yes it is!

 

[Purple]

Re: FAS grants for female apprentices, sexist?

Yes it is!

I agree; it is.
I also agree that it's no big deal.