evicting an unregistered tenant

I think the suggestion that the tenants utility bills were being paid by the previous landlord is a bit of a fairytale. Perhaps you were a little too friendly in your approach to them. Id be bringing a lease to them straight away and getting an appropriate deposit upfront. Whatever went on before you were the owner is history. If they havent produced a lease then they are chancing their arm. If they dont like the new rules give them their notice and tell them you want the place emptied and keys back on x date.
 
Hi again, sale not yet closed due to the Xmas break.

Received a phone call from an anonymous caller today, asking me if I had bought said property, i have no idea how this person got hold of my phone number but they would not identify themselves, they demanded to know who i was from the start, i did not answer those questions as i never identify myself before the person calling does first

They did reveal however that they carried out work on the property in the past and that they would be putting a charge on it, obviously i was taken aback but the conversation confirmed nothing in terms of the identity of the person or my own, i suspect they know mine as they managed to get hold of my phone number.

I phoned my solicitor afterwards and while they thought it very strange intimidating behaviour, they said the individual would find it difficult to get a charge on the property?

Having read a number of articles online, it appears a creditor can get a garnishee order which allows a creditor to seek - collect a debt from a third party who owes money to the debtor.

While on the surface horrifying, how enforceable is such a charge in practice, i know charges have a shelf life so provided an innocent party like myself holds on to the property, can much be done in real terms?

There was no reference to this creditor in the contract for sale so my solicitor did not miss anything, the main lender was the only title charge referred to
 
galway_blow_in said:
Having read a number of articles online
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You know better than to do that! ;)

They'd need a judgement, and then attach a charge to the property. Ask your solicitor what the current timelines are in your court area for that.

A garnishee only kicks in after a judgement - they could go after his salary from employer.
 
If they were genuine, why bother ringing you? If they were able to put a charge on the property, then just do it.

Sounds to me like they were chancing their arm.
 
Thirsty said:
If they were genuine, why bother ringing you? If they were able to put a charge on the property, then just do it.

Sounds to me like they were chancing their arm.
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i suspect they are trying to spook , perhaps a messenger for the perhaps aggrieved previous owner ?

perhaps an attempted shake down ?

its always my desire however to develop my understanding of the legal system , i had never heard of a garnishee order before within this context . add to that you sometimes wonder if all solicitors are on top of their game , my sister is a solicitor but lives and works in dublin , she doesnt do conveyancy herself but was bothered by data breach ( GDPR ) when i rang her this evening ? , how this person ended up with my number , havent a clue myself how they might have got it
 
RedOnion said:
You know better than to do that! ;)

They'd need a judgement, and then attach a charge to the property. Ask your solicitor what the current timelines are in your court area for that.

A garnishee only kicks in after a judgement - they could go after his salary from employer.
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if they managed to get before a judge and slap a charge on the property .

1. can i attempt to block them getting a garnishee order ? ( presumably not as i dont own it yet as sale not yet closed )

2. if i cant block and they succeed in getting it and slap a charge on the property ( surely the pre closing searches my solicitor would undertake would highlight this new charge ? ) , would i still be bound to purchase , would that not be grounds for the sale not going ahead ? ( charge showing up )



i will ask my solicitor tomorrow anyway but curious to hear opinions .
 
@galway_blow_in

I'm not a legal person, so don't do anything based on what I say!

Re number, They might have dropped into the property and got your number from tenants?

The garnishee order would have nothing to do with you - you don't owe money to the original owner.

Getting a judgement takes time. They must give 10 days notice of claim. Then they go to court. Then debtor has 28 days to respond. Then the real process starts. Assuming it's less than 15k it's district court. Even if they managed to get judgement, it'd rank behind the banks charge. So it's useless to them. If he goes to a solicitor, they'd advise him not to do it.
 
RedOnion said:
@galway_blow_in

I'm not a legal person, so don't do anything based on what I say!

Re number, They might have dropped into the property and got your number from tenants?

The garnishee order would have nothing to do with you - you don't owe money to the original owner.

Getting a judgement takes time. They must give 10 days notice of claim. Then they go to court. Then debtor has 28 days to respond. Then the real process starts. Assuming it's less than 15k it's district court. Even if they managed to get judgement, it'd rank behind the banks charge. So it's useless to them. If he goes to a solicitor, they'd advise him not to do it.
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This guy who rang me claims to have carried out works on the property and was presumably unpaid.

If he did manage to get a charge on the property prior to the sale being closed

1. Would this make the auction contract signed three weeks ago illegitimate?

2. If not and the sale closes but the charge is on the property, can he follow me for the money ( garnishee order) or is it just a case of ignoring the charge and allowing it to expire after twelve years?

Suppose what I'd like to know is worse case scenario could i have to pay this guy for fitting a kitchen or whatever he's owed for

Why would he contact me unless it's me he plans to follow?
 
Reading this just reinforces my view that the law isn't working on behalf of landlords. Everything is skewed in favour of the tenants.

Just one point whoever rang threatening placing a charge is trying his/her arm.
You bought the property and you said from a receiver surely any outstanding creditors must contact the receiver regarding this.

Frankly I'd report it to the guards, it smacks of extortion. Once the sale goes through it's your property and anyone who is a creditor can deal with the receiver. (Unless the law has changed)

Doing the right thing isn't always the best strategy, I speak from experience you bend over backwards to accommodate tenants but they do nothing on their side.
 
Paul O Mahoney said:
I speak from experience you bend over backwards to accommodate tenants but they do nothing on their side.
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I concur and it would seem to me that they are the ones who divulged your number. Have you considered it may be them who are chancing their arm here by using a local buddy ? Of course, if you didn't give the tenants your number then this is not the source.
 
Paul O Mahoney said:
Reading this just reinforces my view that the law isn't working on behalf of landlords. Everything is skewed in favour of the tenants.

Just one point whoever rang threatening placing a charge is trying his/her arm.
You bought the property and you said from a receiver surely any outstanding creditors must contact the receiver regarding this.

Frankly I'd report it to the guards, it smacks of extortion. Once the sale goes through it's your property and anyone who is a creditor can deal with the receiver. (Unless the law has changed)

Doing the right thing isn't always the best strategy, I speak from experience you bend over backwards to accommodate tenants but they do nothing on their side.
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im not a solicitor so learning all the time , one hopes that some auction clause wasnt in there which protects the vendor from any unforeseen circumstance where a creditor crawls out of the woods demanding a slice but its the purchaser who must deal with it ?

solicitor told me before the auction that the title was kosher but strictly for cash buyers. received no warnings other than that , hopefully the solicitor is on top of their game , always a concern for regular folk

was unable to get hold of my solicitor so far today but will ask them to double check everything so as i can head off any potential shenanigans or at least try to do so.

as for reporting to the guards , i dont believe this warrants that kind of action , at least for now , the person made no threats of any kind and i didnt confirm my name or that i had bought the place , if i receive more calls , i will consider that sort of action . it was certainly a brass neck thing to call me up but i imagine not much more than that ? , person who leaked the information was worse .

messy
 
@galway_blow_in

As part of the purchase, does your solicitor not do a search at the last minute to ensure that there is no charge on the property?

Am not the expert but if you pay €5 and look at the folio for my house on the Land Registry website you can find that there is a mortgage with BoI on the property. You can do this yourself online for the property you are buying.
 
NoRegretsCoyote said:
@galway_blow_in

As part of the purchase, does your solicitor not do a search at the last minute to ensure that there is no charge on the property?

Am not the expert but if you pay €5 and look at the folio for my house on the Land Registry website you can find that there is a mortgage with BoI on the property. You can do this yourself online for the property you are buying.
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my sister ( has never deal with property but knows that much ) said a charge would show up in a search but im posing the question if their might be a clause in the contract which protects the vendors from surprise creditors ?

like i said i havent gotten a chance to quiz my solicitor about that , you feel borderline paranoid asking them about every conceivable scenario but it keeps them on their toes you hope .
 
NoRegretsCoyote said:
Don't bother your solicitor, look it up yourself here and download the folio for a €5 fee.
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guy who rang claims to be planning to stick a charge on it so it would not be on it yet ? , my solicitor only referred to the lenders charge pre auction , im wondering if new creditors crawling out are dealt with in the contract , receivers can be sneaky , just how broad can you go with an auction sale ?
 
galway_blow_in said:
guy who rang claims to be planning to stick a charge on it so it would not be on it yet ? , my solicitor only referred to the lenders charge pre auction , im wondering if new creditors crawling out are dealt with in the contract , receivers can be sneaky , just how broad can you go with an auction sale ?
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Send an legitimate outstanding debts to the receiver, it's not your issue once the property is legally yours.
And if others try it get their phone numbers, you genuinely seem to a genuine type who wants to do everything by the book, unfortunately not everyone is like that, some will exploit if they think they can bully you.
Again outstanding debts aren't your issue
 
Paul O Mahoney said:
Send an legitimate outstanding debts to the receiver, it's not your issue once the property is legally yours.
And if others try it get their phone numbers, you genuinely seem to a genuine type who wants to do everything by the book, unfortunately not everyone is like that, some will exploit if they think they can bully you.
Again outstanding debts aren't your issue
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I'm not worried about chancers, it's the legal quirks which concern me, perhaps none exist where a fresh creditor can climb on the new owners property, I'm attempting to try and get clarity on the matter, even he did get a charge on my property, i wouldn't really care if it was only useful in the event of a sale, i wouldn't be planning to resell, in fact I'd probably lease to the local authority down the road for ten years plus, i have that arrangement with Limerick Council on another house and it suits me fine, no dealing with tenants, guaranteed rent

Guy may indeed be a spoofer or working for the guy who lost his property
 
galway_blow_in said:
I'm not worried about chancers, it's the legal quirks which concern me, perhaps none exist where a fresh creditor can climb on the new owners property, I'm attempting to try and get clarity on the matter, even he did get a charge on my property, i wouldn't really care if it was only useful in the event of a sale, i wouldn't be planning to resell, in fact I'd probably lease to the local authority down the road for ten years plus, i have that arrangement with Limerick Council on another house and it suits me fine, no dealing with tenants, guaranteed rent

Guy may indeed be a spoofer or working for the guy who lost his property
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I think you might be right........best of luck hope it works out.
 
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