Easter dues - Church - how much?

sloggi said:
What country is it where you declare you allegiance to a particular religion and a tax type thing is taken from your wages on their behalf....or did i dream that one up??
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In switzerland I pay catholic tax. Its one of the indirect taxes.
The concept of religion tax is quite common in most countries. Its one of the good things about Ireland that its up to you to decide do you want to pay easter dues or not.

cas.
 
In my fathers parish they get a box with >52 envelopes in it, each numbered, for the weekly plate collection. Then they also get the usual Easter, All Saints etc envelopes. So not only could one track how much is given by any particular household, but also attendance! That would put me off, I have to say. Although I suppose it could also relate to accountability.
 
The Easter and Xmas collections I thought are referred to as peters pence...i.e. it goes to the priests of the parish? As far as I know, isn't the theory, not often publicised I guess cause of what the reaction would be...that you are supposed to give 10% of your income or something to the church?
 
Church is rich enough to take care of its own. Have got plenty of dues letters in the post complete with address. Haven't returned one yet and am still standing. Got a few direct debits set up for charities and feel thats a better way to get money to those who need it.
 
I don't have a problem with the individual priests,however they represent the morons in Rome & why should anybody be made guilty into contributing.Again Enron springs to mind.An early contributor mentioned amounts being read out in the church(in the 80s!-I was unfortunately dragged kicking & screaming to mass in the 80s,but I definitely don't remember this-is this true?)
 
sloggi said:
What country is it where you declare you allegiance to a particular religion and a tax type thing is taken from your wages on their behalf....or did i dream that one up??
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You have to do that in Germany - if I recall correctly it's about 1%. Loads of people I know just claimed no religion but I was never able to lie about it. Now that I'm taking steps to be officially removed from the catholic church it wouldn't be a problem when I go back to live there (I'll get there one day!) but I will need to have the letter from the church as they'll already have on record that I'm Roman Catholic. If they find out you've lied, incidentally, they will come looking for back taxes. This happened to a couple I know who lived there but came back to Ireland to get married. When they went to inform the town hall they'd gotten married they had to put down where they got married and because they put down the name of the church it went into their records, which said they had no religion so they were investigated and had to pay up their back tax.

Switzerland also has a church tax as far as I know.
 
Janet - I read somewhere else that you can take steps to formally dis-affiliate yourself from the Church. Is this what you are doing - and is it here in Ireland? I would be interested in the details of how to do this!
 
Bit ironic (hypocritical?) the Christian churches accepting taxes collected on their behalf by nation states, eh?

http://www.keyway.ca/htm2003/20030312.htm
Then He said to them, "Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's." (Matthew 22:17-21 RSV)
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Janet said:
Loads of people I know just claimed no religion but I was never able to lie about it
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Are you insinuating that some of them lied in claiming no religion and, if so, on what basis?
Now that I'm taking steps to be officially removed from the catholic church
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Other than excommunication how can one do this? I would be very interested to avoid them claiming me based on my past history of forced indoctrination.
 
ClubMan said:
Are you insinuating that some of them lied in claiming no religion and, if so, on what basis?.
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Yes. On the basis that they told me and also on the basis that they did attend mass while in Germany. So, it's all just hearsay as far as you're concerned - have no proof. Some would have considered themselves to have no religion although technically speaking were still Catholic. Others simply didn't want to pay the tax. When you're a student, sometimes you'll do anything to save a few euro (or Deutschmarks as it was then). Just in case you're wondering no, I never reported any of these people.


ClubMan said:
Other than excommunication how can one do this? I would be very interested to avoid them claiming me based on my past history of forced indoctrination.
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I'd been trying to figure out what to do about this for a while and found this thread on boards.ie recently:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=258984

Seemed like as good a place to start as any. Was pretty certain I'd need to get in touch with priest in the parish I grew up in as a starting point anyway. Hopefully the fact that I was (I'm pretty sure) actually baptised in a different, older church (the parish church I attended as a child was only built the year I was born) and made my communion and confirmation in a different parish (the one my school was in) won't present too many difficulties.
 
Yeah i'm pretty bitter about most deductions from my gross wage, of benefit to me or otherwise, so a religious tax might just send me over the edge altogether! Bit of a lapsed catholic right enough but the faith in "something" keeps me peeping my head through the doors from time to time (read Chirstmas)! Might just get me into heaven, but not if they count up my church contribution in the big old balance sheet of life!!!
 
Vanilla said:
In my fathers parish they get a box with >52 envelopes in it, each numbered, for the weekly plate collection. Then they also get the usual Easter, All Saints etc envelopes. So not only could one track how much is given by any particular household, but also attendance! That would put me off, I have to say. Although I suppose it could also relate to accountability.
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We get the same weekly envelopes, but I believe that they are not checked to see who gives what. The envelopes used to be just opened and discarded, while the money was bagged.
 
Janet said:
Yes. On the basis that they told me and also on the basis that they did attend mass while in Germany. So, it's all just hearsay as far as you're concerned - have no proof.
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Er, I just asked. It was not clear that they had told you and that you had not just jumped to conclusions. Thanks for the clarification though.
Just in case you're wondering no, I never reported any of these people.
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I wasn't wondering and don't really care. Tax evasion in Germany is not really my concern.
 
I think I understand the bit about Germany and Switzerland. On the same basis if the irish government actually reach the .07% target of gnp for overseas aid etc , would this mean that Concern/Trocaire/Oxfam etc would be in difficulties trying to raise donations for overseas aid? wouldn't like to think so. But it appears that in Germany/Switzerland the state 'collects' and then distributes on behalf of the various congregations, so no further collections are made.
 
I think for reasons such as above, you should be allowed to formally leave the church and have baptisms and confirmations undone as they would have been done under duress and without informed consent.
 
Bocade: thats the kind of letter we used to get, but they have stopped it. anyway as I stated above all I did was shift the 'plate' collection to the envelope. same amount donated but it kept them happy.
 
I have read this tread for the first time today and am amazed. I grew up in the sixties when the church still had a little dignity and got respect. I find it hard to believe that they are intimidating people nowadays and harder to believe that people are letting them get away with it. Why pay if you do not want to. The german law does not apply here. DONT PAY and do not let anyone intimidate you into doing so.
I know that there are people who want to pay and that is fine for them but if you feel that you are being bullied into it then make it stop.
 
Am I among the few people who refused to continue contributing towards the planned giving/envelope collection and told the local clery my reasons for doing so.? I think we owe it to ourselves, the church and our community to speak up and be counted when we don't agree with what is being done in the name of religion. "religion hides mischief from suspicion". It is not my intention to offend the sensibilities of those who still hold with all that is done in the name of their religion - but sometimes there is another way.
 
I suppose if you don't give to the Church you shouldnt take from the Church.

I'll outsource my burial so...

BM
 
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