Corrib Gas Gardai story

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Unless i missed something Only one woman has publically revealed and that was because she came forward. She claims her details were leaked to journalists but again there is no evidence of this. Strange how the other woman managed to stay out of the papers but this one claimed she couldn't.

By the way, stop stealing lines from spiderman!
 
"18 per cent of those polled believed they should be sacked." Indo

Unbelievable, nearly 20% want to destitute the Gardai and their families!!

Talk about a balanced society.
 
monagt said:
"18 per cent of those polled believed they should be sacked." Indo

Unbelievable, nearly 20% want to destitute the Gardai and their families!!

Talk about a balanced society.
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I think it shows 82% don't believe they should be sacked.
 
Bronte said:
What exactly does everyone want? What punishment do they think is appropriate for 5 men making a very rude dirty joke in private?
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I think you are missing the point that many people are making. A "joke" about rape is not a "rude dirty joke". A joke about sex might be rude & dirty....and a joke.

It's entirely different. Sex and rape have as little to do with eachother as love and domestic violence.

If you want to read someone else's view on what rape actually does to its victims, I suggest you read this.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/09/city-of-joy-congo-women-rape
 

I don't think anyone needs to be lectured on the impact of rape. I doubt those guards need to be lectured on the impact of rape. They have probably seen the affects of rape on victims first hand and not through the pages of a newspaper.

Again, you are assuming that because they made those comments, they in some way lacked proper understanding or empathy with rape victims. I don't see how. If everything I ever said in jest was to be held up as an inidcator of my views on certain subjects , I would probably be seen as a sexist, racist homophobic, intolerent fashist pig. And only a couple of things are true!

They were guilty of a lack of a judgement and deserved to be reprimanded. They didn't derserve to be portrayed as some sort of cheerleaders for rape.
 
"I don't think anyone needs to be lectured on the impact of rape"

Totally agree with Sunny's comments, the post by Moneyhoney smacks of arrogance and talking down to people.

People don't not need to be lectured on what rape is or its effects on the victims and their families.
 
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We seem to be talking at cross-purposes here. Sunny et al, your right nobody needs to be lectured on rape, and that wasn't my intention. Having said that we know rape isn't about sex, its about domination and power.

These were gardai speaking of women in their power. It was intended as a private conversation. Okay, then the issue is whether it's acceptable for anyone to "joke" like this when acting officially. Given their jobs, they have a particular need to exercise caution and sensitivity, and this incident suggests at least a strange viewpoint and perhaps points to a skewed view of women in the force. It could be a one-off, but not neccessarily.

It was "gallows type humour": unfortunate, mistaken, ill-advised. Perhaps it was this, nonetheless, given the Gardai's special position in society, it needs to be and is being addressed.

It was equivalent to any other edgy comments, jokes, asides others might make. Perhaps, but again a rape joke by a Garda about a women in their power is not the same.

Corrib Gas protesters are exploiting it. Most likely they are. Again, it's not relevant whether it was about Mother Teresa or these women, or whether the "victims" are protestors, it should not have been joked about.

Gardai hold a special position in our society. The internal culture of the organisation should not permit this. Apparently a cited Sargeant was present, he should have nipped this in the bud, he didn't.
 
[QUOTE Eeny, meeny, miny, moe,
Catch the nigger by the toe.
If he squeals let him go,
Eeny, meeny, miny, mo QUOTE]

My cousin who is black was adopted from an orphanage in cork 40 + years ago. He was so unusual (race wise, in Dublin) that when neighbours kids called over the fence: "Nigger Nigger Nigger", he used to call back Nigger Nigger Nigger; as he had no idea what they were talking about.



At the risk of either stating the obvious, or creating a bigger row, I would respectfully point out that the gut response to this issue may will be divided across gender lines.

The reaction of women to rape is very different to that of men. Men (I think) consider rape akin to a lesser offence than murder and probably sometimes, depending on the violence of the offence, to a lesser offence than a serious physical assault. To women, it is an extremely emotive issue. I would almost never leave my house worried that I might be robbed, beaten or murdered, but I would almost always (on a night out for example); be aware of the threat of rape. It is so omnipresent in all of our subconcious that we almost consider it normal.

We say to each other and to our wives, daughters, friends: Don't take a taxi home on your own. Don't walk home alone. Don't leave the party without your friends. We don't verbalise it but we are aware that the threat is constantly present.
There are thousands and thousands of reported rapes every year. They are the ones which are reported - officially considered to be less than a third of the actual number which occur. There aren't 3 or 4 rapists in Ireland commiting all these rapes. It is more commonplace than we like to admit or confront.

I would prefer ( if that's a suitable term) to be assaulted for my handbag and end up with a couple of broken ribs or a broken jaw than to be raped. Do men get this? Rape goes to the very core of your physical and bodily and mental integrity and right to exist as a person and not as someone's whim.

And men do not in general live under this constant unspoken and practically 'second nature' threat which limits and controls women's behaviour, without them almost being aware of it.

So if you live with this and you know that it is prevalent in society and you know that if it happens to you and you get the courage of your convictions to report it; then you will be going to the same guys who joke about the subject in what they (rightfully) thought was a private conversation. That is what makes it so much worse.
 
The whole episode was started by a simple laddism conversation. Nobody was going to be raped. Nobody was going to be hurt.

And yet the Bleeding Hearts have blown the whole episode out of all proportion. The Gardaí were the victims here.
 
Quote: "And men do not in general live under this constant unspoken and practically 'second nature' threat which limits and controls women's behaviour, without them almost being aware of it."

>>>>>>>> Sexist and Paranoid.
 
monagt said:
Quote: "And men do not in general live under this constant unspoken and practically 'second nature' threat which limits and controls women's behaviour, without them almost being aware of it."

>>>>>>>> Sexist and Paranoid.
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As women represent the vast majority of rape cases, and as ali is speaking from her own experience and probably that of many women, it is neither sexist or paranoid, it's just plain true from her perspective and she has a valid right to say it. In fact, she has taken considerable time to try and explain why she feels as she feels, and that should not be dismissed, rather it should be understood, which is clearly her intention.

As it happens, and I only mention it because it has been raised by ali, I am a man, but I can fully appreciate her sentiments. The key point made here, again and again, is this is not a trivial matter. I don't want any Garda's head on a plate, or his job, but this is not an issue to be blithely dimissed. And the Garda Commissioner, fair play to him, has been quick out of the traps to say that it won't be. This is definitely my last post on it. Enuf said.
 
monagt said:
Quote: "And men do not in general live under this constant unspoken and practically 'second nature' threat which limits and controls women's behaviour, without them almost being aware of it."

>>>>>>>> Sexist and Paranoid.
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Neither sexist, nor paranoid - it was actually a very well explained post.
 
horusd said:
As women represent the vast majority of rape cases,
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The majority of rape cases are child abuse cases and the victims are as likely to be male as female.


I would prefer ( if that's a suitable term) to be assaulted for my handbag and end up with a couple of broken ribs or a broken jaw than to be raped. Do men get this?
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I think most people do get this and fortunately our laws reflect this. In our court system, rape is almost on a par with murder - rape and murder are tried in the Central Criminal Court and are the only 2 violent crimes that are automatically tried at this level. Rape is considered a more serious crime than manslaughter or serious assaults, which are circuit criminal cases.
 
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