Pedophilia and homosexuality are two separate things.
I have seen a recent program on some UK channel where a priest was also trying to blame the abuse on 'the homosexuals'. This is a very sneaky way of the church to try to offload the blame on one of their pet hate groups.
As I said pedophilia is not homesexuality. What went on in the Irish institutions was perpetrated by perverts. Homosexuals don't go abusing children, perverts do. Try not to be brainwashed by the church as it tries to wriggle its way out of this.
I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here, but you should be aware that anti-Jewish violence is not something that is / was exclusively German.... Germany has it's Jewish shame, America has it's slavery shame, this is Irelands shame
Indeed - and what about the many 'straight' married men who are the best customers for rent boys and gay saunas?What about male rape in prisons - does anyone seriously think these thugs are 'homosexuals'?
My mother, who is in her 70s, once made a telling statement to me about the church she said people didn't worship God back then, they worshipped the priest and to me, that explains why they got away with it for so long. Few dared to question the churches authority. Even those that did ( and in fairness, some did) were given no backing or guidance from those in charge
Any figures here? Any links?Indeed - and what about the many 'straight' married men who are the best customers for rent boys and gay saunas?
I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here, but you should be aware that anti-Jewish violence is not something that is / was exclusively German.
For example, we have had anti-Jewish pogroms in Cork, Limerick and Dublin during the 19th & 20th centuries, there were anti-Jewish riots in Britain soon after the Second World War and pogroms in Poland during and after the Second World War ( by the indigenous Poles, not the invading Germans or their allies).
I have no idea why you have chosen to single America out in relation to slavery, as the bulk of the slaves that wound up in the continental United States were shipped / traded there by colonist Europeans (Britain, France, Belgium, etc.) and the pursuits and endeavours that lead to the use of slave labour (cotton, sugar-cane, etc.) were also established by the self-same colonists. I think its to America's credit that they had abolished slavery within 80 years of independence from Britain.
I have responded to "Irelands shame" in a previous post and I believe some of my comments there are equally relevant here.
The very fact that the church preached against this sort of behaviour and then allowed it to flourish is the sad/illegal thing. Offending priests did use the confessional to elicit information which was later used for their own nefarious purposes. And so, while committing illegal acts, hiding behind the curtain of infallibility (which can be confused with legality). Even in Irish seminaries there have been recent cases of homosexual rings operating. (AFAIK, nothing was said about paedophilia). Michael Ledwith's hasty departure from St. Patrick's College, Maynooth (where he was president) is testament to this. He now "lectures" at a cult headquarters in Washington.Your right on your points re homosexual and paedophila being seperate but the church is not the exclusive breeding ground for perverts. Perverts operated within the church and every other organisation, this is often a discussion that is used to hammer the church which is a bit distasteful really.
Offending priests did use the confessional to elicit information which was later used for their own nefarious purposes.
It is a bit difficult to google on these topics, without getting mired down on dubious sites. Do you reckon that there aren't many straight/married customers of rent boys and gay saunas?Any figures here? Any links?
Sexually corrupt priests using the confessional to find out likeminded people. Many documented cases. Put in a search.How do you mean?
My mother, who is in her 70s, once made a telling statement to me about the church she said people didn't worship God back then, they worshipped the priest and to me, that explains why they got away with it for so long. Few dared to question the churches authority. Even those that did ( and in fairness, some did) were given no backing or guidance from those in charge
The very fact that the church preached against this sort of behaviour and then allowed it to flourish is the sad/illegal thing. Offending priests did use the confessional to elicit information which was later used for their own nefarious purposes. And so, while committing illegal acts, hiding behind the curtain of infallibility (which can be confused with legality). Even in Irish seminaries there have been recent cases of homosexual rings operating. (AFAIK, nothing was said about paedophilia). Michael Ledwith's hasty departure from St. Patrick's College, Maynooth (where he was president) is testament to this. He now "lectures" at a cult headquarters in Washington.
I understand the dilemma. I was just curious as to the origin of thes claims. And any figures to back them up. I would have thought that most married men, who were in a nice loving relationship with their wives, would pass up on the chance of picking up something for the sake of a cheap thrill. I also understand the psychological lure of liaisons dangereux.It is a bit difficult to google on these topics, without getting mired down on dubious sites. Do you reckon that there aren't many straight/married customers of rent boys and gay saunas?
What individual priests did was illegal that is correct. Any high profile cleric that allowed it to go on should also see jail, but the church does not approve nor encourage this behaviour within the organisation.
The curtain of infallibilty is not there as priests have not claimed to be infallible, they don't claim to be different from us. These things happened when men were able to abuse their power with terrible effect, that is hopefully not the case now.
True, but unfortunately this is only part of the story. No cleric will see jail because the church responded to wrong-doing among its ranks by buying off the govt - no names are named, very little recompense is paid to victims. It is precisely this way of operating by the Church that has angered so many. Their first priority has been to protect the organisation rather than the victims.What individual priests did was illegal that is correct. Any high profile cleric that allowed it to go on should also see jail, but the church does not approve nor encourage this behaviour within the organisation.
I really hope so.These things happened when men were able to abuse their power with terrible effect, that is hopefully not the case now.
What individual priests did was illegal that is correct. Any high profile cleric that allowed it to go on should also see jail, but the church does not approve nor encourage this behaviour within the organisation.
The curtain of infallibilty is not there as priests have not claimed to be infallible, they don't claim to be different from us. These things happened when men were able to abuse their power with terrible effect, that is hopefully not the case now.
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