BBC Programme "The Day the Immigrants Left" 24.2.2010

[cork]

The BBC programme last night on British people not taking up jobs on farms, factories and restaurants was interesting.

The Day the Immigrants Left
BBC 1 at 9:00pm

Having any job is better than no job.

 

[BillK]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

Unfortunately, over here in UK if the job is low paid, people may well be better off claiming benefits.

 

[mathepac]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

I'm not sure how representative of unemployed operative level / skilled / semi-skilled workers the people featured on the programme last night were, but almost to a man (there was only one female working and she didn't feature much) they came across as lazy, xenophobic whingers, fit only for the dole queue or some government-sponsored re-education programme, suggested working title, "Welcome to 2010, 1910 is long gone".

 

[sunrock]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

In the U.K. a lot of these type of jobs are done thru agencies at minimum wage rates. Also this work is boring tedious and hard work and one might not get a full weeks work ,maybe only 2 or 3 days a week. Say someone got 6£ an hour for 3 days work ..thats £144 for the week to live on. Also the travel time and costs to and from work add up.Someone on the dole and getting their accomadation paid would not be interested in this work if thet weren`t coming out with anymore than what they were getting in benefits.That is why this work is done by immigrants who don`t qualify for dole .A similiar situation exists in Ireland...You don`t find many benefit claimants tempted to work in mushroom factories or harvesting cabbages in the fields.
Also the farms/factories/restaurants etc here and in the U.K. exploit their workers in various ways. One way to avoid paying the minimum wage is by deductions for food/accomadation etc.

 

[mathepac]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

@sunrock I take it from your generalised comments that you didn't see the programme in question.

 

[Capt. Beaky]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

Saw the programme and as expected the immigrants worked harder and earned more than the local yahoos and whingers. The waiter could have gone the distance but his in-bred mindset got in the way.

 

[RMCF]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

I think it is just similar to the debates we have had recently in this country.

It highlights that the benefit system is all wrong if it is better to be unemployed rather than employed. Surely it should be possible to make it better to work?

If not, then we will just continue to breed generations of people who have no interest in working as it won't pay them. We need to get out of this cycle, although I think it might already be too late.

 

[mathepac]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

... It highlights that the benefit system is all wrong if it is better to be unemployed rather than employed. Surely it should be possible to make it better to work? ...

I take it you didn't see the programme either.

In it the property developer stated that pre-boom he was paying skilled plasterers £150 / day; post boom he's still paying skilled plasterers £150 / day, the only differences now are their accents, the fact that they show up and finish a job and the quality of the work.

On the asparagus farm, some of the hard-working eastern European workers were earning £140+ / day. I don't know what benefits are like in the UK but I doubt if an unemployed plasterer or asparagus picker would get more than £700 / £750 per week.

In the restaurant only 1 of the 4 British volunteers bothered to show up for work; in the potato factory only 2 of the 3 British volunteers up and they were both late. Wages in the restaurant and potato factory were not discussed.

 

[cork]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

Saw the programme and as expected the immigrants worked harder and earned more than the local yahoos and whingers. The waiter could have gone the distance but his in-bred mindset got in the way.

He was sort of thrown in the deep end. I tought if it was an general type of restaurant he would have done better.

But If you say loose your job and take up a job in a restaurant - would a future employer see this as messing up your CV?

 

[sunrock]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

Granted I didn`t see the programme. However I am sure the property developer would have no problem getting skilled tradesmen for £150 a day or indeed £100 a day.This programme highlights what a few selected workers maybe working very long hours make.Of course immigrants have more incentives as they are there to make as much as possible to save and take home to their home countries.

 

[Caveat]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

But If you say loose your job and take up a job in a restaurant - would a future employer see this as messing up your CV?

I wouldn't say so, not given the times we are in.

 

[mathepac]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

Granted I didn`t see the programme. ... This programme highlights what a few selected workers maybe working very long hours make....

If you didn't see the programme I don't understand how you can comment on what it highlights or what hours the participants worked. There was no indication during the programme that any of the workers concerned worked longer than usual hours, just that some appeared willing to do a decent day's work for a decent day's pay and others weren't.

... Of course immigrants have more incentives as they are there to make as much as possible to save and take home to their home countries.

Maybe it has a lot to do with their dignity as human beings and their wish to contribute to society and keep their families off the bread-line, rather than exist on benefits at the margins of society and whinge.

 

[sunrock]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

I don`t imagine any asparagus worker is making £140 + a day without working very long hours.If you feel that he is on a 8 hour day..then he is on £17+ an hour .This is incredible as farm workers are typically on minimum wage or in reality less.
I`ve seen these type of "programmes " in the U.K. before whereby they give the impression that unskilled immigrant labour is reasonably well paid and that local unemployed people are not interested in these unskilled jobs.Undoubtedly there are some lazy locals but the reality is that the wages are so low and it is only tempory work in the harvest time etc that locals are afraid to lose their benefits.Also employers prefer immigrant workers who work harder and can be paid less...because they have not the option of the dole.Many east europeans in Ireland were very quick to claim the dole here when they lost their jobs in the recession.
Many middle class people and graduates find themselves drawing the dole during this recession.For un skilled people it is usually harder to get work if they are unemployed and it is easy for those with a secure income to suggest that there is work in I.T. in LOndon or in vegetable farms.

 

[bond-007]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

Also the farm work is seasonal. What would the immigrants do when there is no crops to harvest?

 

[Ham Slicer]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

The c£140 wasn't a typical example but presented more like "a guy once earned £140 in a day". Even still they were paid by weight so the quicker they worked the more they earned.

The English guys doing the jobs collected so little crop that their wages averaged at less than minimum wage and the farmer had to top them up to minimum wage.

Interesting programme.

I don`t imagine any asparagus worker is making £140 + a day without working very long hours.If you feel that he is on a 8 hour day..then he is on £17+ an hour .This is incredible as farm workers are typically on minimum wage or in reality less.

 

[cork]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

I wouldn't say so, not given the times we are in.

But would bar or restaurant work look bad on a CV?

Would it look as if your career was going downhill?

 

[mathepac]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

... Would it look as if your career was going downhill?

It depends on your qualifications and where you are starting from - three of the people asked to work in the restaurant had bar / catering experience.

 

[Yorrick]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

I think the youg waiter was thrown in at the deep end. On day one it is a bit much to be expected to know the contents of all Indian dishes. If he had a week in the kitchens and assisting a waiter he would have been much better.
However the customer who said that they come to an Indian restaurant to get an Indian experience had a relevant point.

Look at all the tourists who come to Ireland and all they meet are East European barmen, waitresses etc. Its hardly the Irish experience.

Most of the other English were useless bar the carpenter. He had worked for eithy yeqars on the continent so he is not a dosser

 

[Capt. Beaky]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

............ He had worked for eithy yeqars on the continent so he is not a dosser

I hope this is a typo. Otherwise this carpenter would, after an apprenticeship, be about 101 years old

 

[MANTO]

Re: BBC Programme on Immigrants last night

If you didn't see the programme I don't understand how you can comment on what it highlights or what hours the participants worked. There was no indication during the programme that any of the workers concerned worked longer than usual hours, just that some appeared willing to do a decent day's work for a decent day's pay and others weren't.
Maybe it has a lot to do with their dignity as human beings and their wish to contribute to society and keep their families off the bread-line, rather than exist on benefits at the margins of society and whinge.

+1 - As stated many a time, when Ireland was going through the 'good times' / 'celtic tiger' - Irish poeple didnt want to know about minimum paid jobs. We Irish are such hipocrates - moaning about 'foreigners' taking our jobs and/or not working.

A lot of them work damn hard and long hours rather than sponge of the state and deserve a lot more respect than they get.