Availability & marketing of alcohol

C

Chamar

Guest
I speak as a relatively young person who enjoys a drink as much as the next man but I have a real problem with the way alcohol is treated in this country. I don't think anyone would argue that Ireland has a serious drink problem - don't really know what you can do about that per se but I really don't think the fact that drink is shoved in your face AT EVERY TURN is going to help anyone.

Like, walk into a supermarket and there is just drink everywhere - crates of beer/cheap wines/spirits etc. All these special offers. Promo leaflets dropped in your letterbox. You have the supermarkets advertising themselves on their latest wine and beer deals. Then you have the drinks companies themselves - blatantly using nothing but sex to sell their beers, making people look popular by drinking, sponsoring every damn sporting event or festival under the sun. Then go into a nightclub and more often than not there'll be free pints/bottles/shots of something being promo'd.

What happened to just off-licenses selling drink? When did people start buying CRATES of beer as opposed to a 6-pack? Aren't supermarkets supposed to be where you buy your food as opposed to aisles and aisles of wines? Next time you're in one take a look round and check out the people beside you in the queue. Every basket has a couple of bottles of wine it seems.

Don't get me wrong, I drink. Probably a little too much even (although its hard to say given our attitudes). But I happen to think that alcohol is not how it's marketed and destroys many, many lives in many different ways. Personally, I'd love for them to ban the ads, the supermarket selling, the sponsorships, the crates and the promo.
 
Or perhaps people could just exercise their freedom of choice and personal responsibility and maybe go easy on the sauce from time to time?
 
Yeah you're right. Sure there's no problem, it's not like the stuff is addictive or anything!
 
Correct. Alcohol is not addictive for the vast majority of people and widespread availability and advertising doesn't make it so either. I never said that there is no problem by the way. Obviously some people have a problem with alcohol but many could sort that out through their own volition and not by expecting others to do it for them. As for what other people buy in their local supermarket, I consider that their own business myself.
 
Have to say I'm with Clubman on this one. Surely we don't need a nanny state to legislate our attitudes on everything? As the sale of alcohol is legally confined to adults, why can't we just be adult about it?
 
Chamar said:
Don't get me wrong, I drink. Probably a little too much even
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Are the advertisements and promotions forcing you to overindulge or is this just a personal choice?
 
In fairness,the drinks industry has had it all their own way-little by the way of regulation re their advertising.. they say that advertising doesn'tmake people drink more, so why do they bother to market their product at all??The govt. have been ,shall we say, overly timid in their approch to the drinks industry..maybe its someting to do with the amount of TDs who also happen to be publicans..

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It will be like cigarette advertising then when people were encouraged to smoke. Now people are suing the tobacco companies, soon they will be suing the alcohol makers. It's not as simple as saying people should exercise control, some people have gone past that stage and are addicted. Why do the companies advertise in the first place, to get people to drink. Every social occassion is held at a pub ( at least around here where I live) we dont stand a chance, with booze all around us.What do people do who want to give up drinking? Not a hope!!
 
Swallows said:
It's not as simple as saying people should exercise control, some people have gone past that stage and are addicted.
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Yes. That's why I said some people have a problem but many could deal with this through choice. Self confessed overindulgers (like Chamar for example) as opposed to addicted alcoholics was what I had in mind.
Why do the companies advertise in the first place, to get people to drink. Every social occassion is held at a pub ( at least around here where I live) we dont stand a chance, with booze all around us.What do people do who want to give up drinking? Not a hope!!
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Nobody is forced to attend functions that are held in pubs if they don't want to.
 
Nobody is forced to attend functions that are held in pubs if they don't want to.
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Swallows didnt say he/she was forced to attend or that anyone is forced to attend, he/she said that that every social occasion takes place in a pub, (I assume birthdays, parties, work events etc) basically that there is no choice or at least the choice is pub or not socialize with friends/family/work peers at all (which is a bit extreme).

Just out of interest, are there supermarkets in Ireland that dont sell alcohol? In switzerland there are supermarkets that sell alcohol (like at home) and then there is also a large chain that doesnt sell or advertise alcohol so you have a choice which one you want to shop in.
 
I think it all comes down to education and culture! The drink is there available for you (or me) to get it, but you have the choice. Just because everybody is drinking it doesn't mean you have to. Many many times I've been asked if there is a reason for me not to drink on a night out, even asked if I was pregnant!!! The only reason was I didn't want to.....I was the only one sober on a night out with friends, they stayed with us, and the morning after they were all dying with a hang-over, but not me, because i chose not to drink !! Don't get me wrong, I do have a drink from time to time, but not to get plastered, what seems to be the usual these days.
Now, Swallows is right about every single social ocassion happening in the pubs...not much choice out there, but still, if you want to held a party and the pub is the only place it can be done, people can still go for the no drink option....(easier said than done maybe)
 
casiopea said:
Swallows didnt say he/she was forced to attend or that anyone is forced to attend, he/she said that that every social occasion takes place in a pub, (I assume birthdays, parties, work events etc) basically that there is no choice or at least the choice is pub or not socialize with friends/family/work peers at all (which is a bit extreme).
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Of course there are choices. If people decide to hold these events on licensed premises then that's their prerogative. If some people don't like the idea then they are free to do otherwise. In all cases nobody is obliged to attend these events.
Just out of interest, are there supermarkets in Ireland that dont sell alcohol? In switzerland there are supermarkets that sell alcohol (like at home) and then there is also a large chain that doesnt sell or advertise alcohol so you have a choice which one you want to shop in.
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Not quite supermarkets (yet) but there are many Muslim run stores that stock a wide range of groceries and obviously don't sell alcohol in case that's of any use.
 
Nobody is forced to attend functions that are held in pubs if they don't want to.
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True in a literal sense, and I rarely do for some of the reasons outlined above. But a lot of social bonding in Ireland seems to be centred around alcohol. Not just consuming it in the pub, but sharing in the collective experience of a "good night" staggering home drunk with barely a recollection of how you got there or what you did on the way.
 
MugsGame said:
True in a literal sense
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As opposed to what other sense!? :confused: If people want to inform their actions/decisions by social norms rather than personal responsibility and freedom of choice then that's their prerogative. But it's a bit hypocritical to then bemoan the results...
 
True in the literal sense that nobody physically forces you to go to the pub or to consume alcohol while you are there. But there is a lot of social pressure to go. Opting out of that marks you as a weirdo in many circles. Doesn't bother me, since people with those attitudes are generally the people I don't care to connect with anyway. But I can see how people could feel forced to drink by that social pressure. As for bemoaning the results, I agree. It irks me to hear politicians complaining about under-age drinking when 1) they probably engaged it in themselves 2) the existing laws on selling to minors aren't enforced.

I don't particularly care what drugs people choose to consume and I don't think increased regulation would help. Though I do wonder about the effects on the health service of so many damaged livers.
 
MugsGame said:
....and I don't think increased regulation would help....
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I agree, however addressing this question doesnt necessarily mean increasing regulation, increased choice would help.

The supermarket example, being able to go out and shop with your family and not have alcohol and alcohol offers thrown at you.

Perhaps targetting under age drinkers and younger children giving them facilities and initiatives around sport and outdoor activities, encouraging the concept of socialising in that manner rather than just hanging out with mates and beers on a friday.
 
MugsGame said:
True in the literal sense that nobody physically forces you to go to the pub or to consume alcohol while you are there. But there is a lot of social pressure to go. Opting out of that marks you as a weirdo in many circles. Doesn't bother me, since people with those attitudes are generally the people I don't care to connect with anyway. But I can see how people could feel forced to drink by that social pressure.
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Maybe we should lobby for legislation to control/circumscribe "social pressure" so? Or people could just exercise their freedom of choice...
casiopea said:
The supermarket example, being able to go out and shop with your family and not have alcohol and alcohol offers thrown at you.
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Supermarkets normally restrict the stocking/sale of alcohol to one area of the store which can easily be avoided by those who so choose. If alcohol is displayed in different parts of the store then complain to the management and ask them to keep it all in one place. Most stores also have "no alcohol" checkout lanes. Nobody is forcing anybody to buy alcohol or anything else that they don't want to buy in any supermarket.
 
ClubMan said:
Yes. That's why I said some people have a problem but many could deal with this through choice. Self confessed overindulgers (like Chamar for example) as opposed to addicted alcoholics was what I had in mind.

Nobody is forced to attend functions that are held in pubs if they don't want to.
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I happen to think alot of people have a problem. Some people have a problem when you compare us against ourselves but contrast our drinking to other countries and/or definitions of binge drinking and I'd say most people drink too much. Thankfully, I don't think I'm one of them, certainly not by our standards. The only point I'm trying to make is that drink destroys many, many lives in many different ways yet it's sold everywhere, advertised everywhere, promoted everywhere in ways which I think are irresponsible. You keep talking about personal choice, and I agree with you, but it's naive to think that constantly forcing people to make that choice isn't going to result in people drinking when maybe they ordinarily wouldn't. What about cigarettes? Do you think that if fags were advertised and promoted in the way drink is there would be no more people smoking? And please don't tell me drink is not addictive because it is.

Ireland tops the polls when it comes to drink, which is fine - somebody has to - but maybe it's not such a good thing and maybe it's not so harmless as the ads like to make out.
 
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