Foreign census contractor

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DavyJones

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I'd like to get peoples opinions on this. I live in Munster and at the moment there is plans for a major road project linking the cities of Limerick and Cork.

You can't drive 200 m without goinig over a taffic counter and now there are Gardai stopping taffic everywhere to facilate a census. My problem is the census company are british. They ask you where you have been and where your going. Its quite funny because they can't pronouce the place however about spelling it.

I understand that the contract went to tender and the best price probably got it but surely since we are in the big "R" the goverment should spend our money on Irish contractors?
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

DavyJones said:
I understand that the contract went to tender and the best price probably got it but surely since we are in the big "R" the goverment should spend our money on Irish contractors?
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I understood that under EU law one cannot discriminate government contracts in favour of one nationality over another.

As an aside, there would be no guarantee that an Irish contractors employees would be able to pronounce the names correctly either, as they could employ nationals and non nationals (and even the nationals might have trouble pronouncing some places!).
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

efm said:
I understood that under EU law one cannot discriminate government contracts in favour of one nationality over another.

As an aside, there would be no guarantee that an Irish contractors employees would be able to pronounce the names correctly either, as they could employ nationals and non nationals (and even the nationals might have trouble pronouncing some places!).
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I don't belive for a second this has anything to do with an EU law as it would be nearly impossible to prove that a contractor was favoured.

Public money imho should remain within the state where ever possible.
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

I wonder why the CSO isn't doing this work?
 
DavyJones said:
My problem is the census company are british.
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Would it be OK with you if they were of some other non Irish nationality?
DavyJones said:
Public money imho should remain within the state where ever possible.
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I think you've missed one of the main points of several decades of membership of the EEC/EC/EU!

How do you know that it was possible in this case? Maybe there was a tendering process and the Brits in question offered the best terms and value for money? If this was the case do you think that the contract should still go to a possible higher cost or less efficient Irish service provider just to keep the money in the country?

Do you also think that the NPRF should only invest in Irish company shares for example?
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

ClubMan said:
Would it be OK with you if they were of some other non Irish nationality?
Of course not don't really get your point

I think you've missed one of the main points of several decades of membership of the EEC/EC/EU!

How do you know that it was possible in this case?
I don't know.
Maybe there was a tendering process and the Brits in question offered the best terms and value for money?
Possibly
If this was the case do you think that the contract should still go to a possible higher cost or less efficient Irish service provider just to keep the money in the country?
I don't know if thats the case.

Do you also think that the NPRF should only invest in Irish company shares for example?
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Ofcourse not, when you invest money you plan to make money from investment.
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

DavyJones said:
I don't think I have. When times get tough we should support our own first.
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Without any of us having the background:

1. When was this actually tendered for - was it before the current 'tough times'?

2. Do we even know that any Irish company actually responsed to the tender.
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

rmelly said:
Without any of us having the background:

1. When was this actually tendered for - was it before the current 'tough times'?

2. Do we even know that any Irish company actually responsed to the tender.
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1- This recession has been in the post for atleast two years. Plenty of time to reposition if needed.

2- I don't know, I would hope so.
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

I am not quiet sure what your problem is. Are you saying you would rather the government spend more taxpayers money on a service just because it was provided by an Irish firm? As clubman says above, what is the point of the EU with that thinking. How would you feel if all the Irish firms who tender for work across the EU lost out for similar reasons?
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

Sunny said:
I am not quiet sure what your problem is. Are you saying you would rather the government spend more taxpayers money on a service just because it was provided by an Irish firm? As clubman says above, what is the point of the EU with that thinking. How would you feel if all the Irish firms who tender for work across the EU lost out for similar reasons?
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I would rather my money was spent in the state for the foreseeable future.
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

DavyJones said:
I understand that the contract went to tender and the best price probably got it but surely since we are in the big "R" the goverment should spend our money on Irish contractors?
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Your contradicting yourself here, one one hand you admit we are in a recession and we should get the best price but then you want it to be an Irish contractor. Clearly as a british company won the tender then they are the cheapest. and not the Irish company. That is of course assuming that Irish companies did actually tender?

DavyJones said:
I don't think I have. When times get tough we should support our own first.
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I think you don't understand the EU, it operates as one big market, all companies in all MS can tender for contracts in all MS. Sunny's point is correct look at how much time and effort is spent on trade missions abroad promoting Irish companies , how would you feel if those countries said locals only need apply!

Tenders, depending on their value are either advertsied on http://www.etenders.gov.ie/ or in the Official Journal of the EU which alerts all MS that a competition is being held.
 
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Re: Foreign cenus contractor

DavyJones said:
I would rather my money was spent in the state for the foreseeable future.
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Well under the rules that operate in the EU that were voted on by the citizens of this country we can't accede to your wishes..Perhaps you should transfer your spending to Irish made goods.
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

YOBR said:
Well under the rules that operate in the EU that were voted on by the citizens of this country we can't accede to your wishes..Perhaps you should transfer your spending to Irish made goods.
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I do where ever possible. However in light of all the informed opinions I will rethink my position:)
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

DavyJones said:
I do where ever possible. However in light of all the informed opinions I will rethink my position:)
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Well fair play to you,

However, and this is slightly off topic, I think inadvertantly you have raised an important and timely issue, our understanding of the EU and what affect it has on our lives and the role it plays. I believe that for many years, once the money rolled in, we didnt really give too much thought to its affect but now with increased immigration from the EU and other places and the end of structural funds, we now have to decide how it affects us, both positively or negatively. While we can get access to other markets they can also get access to ours.
 
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Re: Foreign cenus contractor

Clearly as a british company won the tender then they are the cheapest. and not the Irish company.
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Why would you assume that? I don't think it's always the case that the cheapest quote wins.

(As an Irish SME, we don't ever bother going for tenders and we find them to be a waste of resource applying)
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

leghorn said:
Why would you assume that? I don't think it's always the case that the cheapest quote wins.

(As an Irish SME, we don't ever bother going for tenders and we find them to be a waste of resource applying)
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I made that assumption because of the straight forward nature of the job in question, taking a census and analyzing the results would not appear to me to be an over complicated job. Therefore, the costs involved would have a big bearing once the sample methodology is correct. In my own experience a lot of what is needed for tenders can be cut and pasted for existing material.
 
Re: Foreign cenus contractor

I made that assumption because of the straight forward nature of the job in question, taking a census and analyzing the results would not appear to me to be an over complicated job. Therefore, the costs involved would have a big bearing once the sample methodology is correct.
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Statistical experimentation and analysis is a complicated job. It's very easy to make mistakes based on inaccurate assumptions.
 
DavyJones said:
Ofcourse not, when you invest money you plan to make money from investment.
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..and when you go to tender you choose the best based on time/quality/cost

And though I understand your wish to keep irish jobs etc, imagine the amount of tax payers money that would be spent redoing the work if not done correctly in the first place.
 
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