long car & sea trip with a v.small child

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Paulone

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Missus and I are expecting a bundle of joy at or v.close to Christmas. She will give birth Spain where she is from and where all the arrangements have been made. She arrived there some weeks ago and I'm sailing over to the continent to and driving my car down to Spain to join her.

We think to drive over & back is in the end more practical than flying/car-hire because I'm bringing a lot of stuff over and there'll be even more to go back - I'm more comfortable driving a right-hooker vehicle as well. Some airlines are sticky about carrying a child less than a month old and clearly we wouldn't be able to bring even an 1/8th the stuff on a flight.

The journey back would be undertaken with the child aged approximately 2-3weeks old. My missus intends to feed the child herself and once feeding is established we kinda have to go. We'll give it a couple of days to make it up France and then take the Cherbourg-Rosslare ferry.

That's the plan anyway.

Trouble is that I've been told a horror story over the weekend about how risky it is to place a very young child in an infant car seat for more than an hour - apparently there is a risk that they stop breathing.

Obviously there'll be plenty of stopping during the trip, but not every hour. I've never heard this advice about child seats being associated with this sort of a risk.

What does anyone think about this? Has anyone undertaken a long journey like this one by car with a v.small child?

Of course the return journey with the three of us would be a lot longer and more stressful than getting there, but if I thought I was putting the child in any danger, I'd put them on a flight & drive the bags home by myself.
 
I'm not sure I believe that a car seat is a particular danger to a newborn, but maybe there's research to back this up. As long as there is plenty or air and the child isn't over wrapped then I can't see that there would be a problem. To cut the the driving somewhat you could consider going Brittany Ferries from Santander to Plymouth. Also note that the weather reports on RTÉ have been mentioning very rough seas for ferry crossings recently.
 
Friends of mine have just had a baby and have also been advised by the hospital to avoid long car journeys (I think they were told 90 minutes) - I think the issue is that car seats are only designed to provide neck/head support for a certain period of time.
 
Hi Paulone,

Have a read of the RSA guidelines on safety in cars with babies. I think there may be an issue with premature and low weight babies?

I'm sure if you gave your GP/Public Health Nurse a call they'd advise you.

Plenty of breaks with the little one to let them lie out flat so they're not in sitting up position for long period of times might help??

best of luck with the new arrival!

C
 
Don't remind me about the weather forecast!! I did that crossing once before some years ago about the time of St. Patrick's Day. I heard that a singer performing in the bar stopped her set midway to go off and throw-up.

Santander and Bilbao route timetables don't suit our timing unfortunately - a real pity - I'm tied to getting back to work.

This whole arrangement could come to nought if the child arrives late or there is any issue with feeding, any health difficulty, arrival of the child's documents or anything which makes things not straightforward.
 
It is recommended that a baby isnt in a car seat for more than 90 mins - 2 hours a day as they need to be lying flat.

As for the stopping breathing, if you are using an isofix base it pushes the baby forward in the seat and can cause breathing problems but just dont use the base and you remove this danger.

Its more hassle and would take longer but could you perhaps stop overnight on the journey in the car. I dont know how long your drive is but maybe do half, stop ovenight and continue on next day.
Realistically its a once off thing so i doubt you will harm the baby, the regulations are really to stop people leaving the babies in car seats constantly for long periods.
 
Grand - am slightly reassured.

Our trip is 1300km up France - about 19hours in the ferry (not a problem as we'll use a bassonet), followed with about 160km in the car back home once we hit Rosslare.

Assuming its okay to do, the time required to cover the distance in France will be about 13-hours, not including stops. The total journey time I'd set aside is 48hours with stops, behind the wheel for approximately 7 hours in each 24-hour period.

Baby will be in need of refuelling a lot more than the car, so I think we can predict a stop every two hours or less. Having heard the advice, it seems sensible to place the child in the bassonet at every opportunity.
 
We have done Roscoff to the South of France and back with a 16week old sans problem. Plenty of stops and make sure junior doesn't overheat and I'd say you will be fine (but I'm no Doctor). Best wishes.
 
Would it suit you to drive and mum and baby fly? I haven't taken long car trips with a young baby, but flying, particularly if breastfeeding, is pretty straightforward.
 
I'm also no doctor, but I reckon you should get medical advice before doing this.

My 'worst case' guess would be that a new borns back isn't strong enough to support its body sitting upright in a car seat for extended periods (like more than an hour) at a time. New borns spend most of their time on their front, on their back and curled up in a parents arms, but definitely not sitting up unaided.

New borns have very poor neck control (on account of not needing it for the previous 9 months) as well as a relatively heavy head. You will always see parents supporting the head when lifting a new born. I would be concerned that a car seat that provided this support would be very restrictive and one that didn't provide the support would be dangeous in the ordinary course of events and in the event of a sudden stop (not even a crash) the head would be thrown around.

You will have restraints on the seat obviously. Given the total inability of the newborn to adjust its position in any way I would be concerned that the restraints could restrict breathing if the child slumped forward. Although the parents will of course be watching as much as they can, there is too much risk that they might be tired or distracted on the length of drive you describe.

There are only so many things that you can safely do with a child that is only a few days old and I'm afraid such a long drive wouldn't be among the list in my view.

As I say at the start I am not a doctor and the above are only my understandings, but to be honest, this type of drive can be tiring even for adults (except we can normally cope and adapt) and children (who cry and complain) but a new born is different again - totally vulnerable to anything and everything and a drive this length at that age seems too much of an endurance test for someone who will only be weeks old.

Finally, think of the other practicalities. Mother will be feeding, fine. What happens when baby is hungry/wakes up minutes after you leave a rest station and the next one isn't for 200KM ? Do you unstrap and feed while driving ? Unlikely. Do you keep driving for the next 2 hours on a motorway with nowhere safe to stop and a screaming (and hungry) baby in the back ? Possible, but it won't be fair to the baby and the noise will do your head in. Same goes for nappies. You've just pulled out of a rest area and there's a strange noise and a smell coming from the back. Do you unstrap and change at 100km/h or leave the baby sitting there and wind down the windows ?

z
 
I know that the initial indication was that there would be a few days available to drive up through France, but even with a 'few' it would still involve relatively long drives every day.

Maybe if you were doing 1h a day (which in the timescale isn't practical) you could achieve the return trip safely, but I can't see that happening.

My preference in that situation would be for mother and baby to fly home and father to either drive home or else fly also and return a few days later to pick up the car. It will cost money, it will cost time, but what cost a babys health ?

z
 
Some good points zag. Another consideration is that Mrs. Paulone may not get breastfeeding established, doesn't work for everyone, in which case you will need to sterilise bottles, boil water etc.

I took my baby to Spain, on Ryanair, when a few weeks old and managed the baggage fine. In my opinion the car/boat journey is too much for a newborn, I wouldn't even consider it. It will be a nightmare.
 
Paulone said:
am slightly reassured.
Click to expand...

Are you ever going to be really reassured, no matter what anyone says here?
Aside from the many very good points that Zag has made above, and aside from the fact of whether or not the horror story that you heard is founded, the very fact that you started this thread would suggest that you are uneasy about doing the trip. This in itself is not a good way to start a long car journey. Also bear in mind that, as a new parent, you may be suffering from a severe lack of sleep before you head off on the journey - the last thing you need is added tension by being apprehensive about the health/safety issues concerning your precious new baby. Overall, it would seem much more sensible for you to set off on your own and be at the airport to meet your wife and baby when they arrive. I am assuming that this is your first baby and therefore you should enjoy every second of the experience of becoming a parent. Don't spoil the event before it has even happened by being apprehensive about things that can be avoided.

The very best to both you and your wife - it'll be a very special Christmas/New Year for you!
 
Dear Paulone, we undertook a long boat/car journey approx 14 hrs total with a 7 week old. Before we left we purchased a special bassinet with car straps for the back seat which was recommended. The baby slept very comforably and safely the entire trip. The bassinet went onto a buggy for moving around on board etc. Try to check one out and the up to date safety guidelines. The very best of luck
 
It's too long for lots of reasons, put them on a plane. Baby could be car sick, just cry a lot, be colicky, will want to be held, could scream the whole journey..........don't do it to the baby.
 
We have a Spanish Jane Matrix buggy that can go flat in a car. Meant to be for babies for long journeys. We only used it like that about once or twice.

[broken link removed]

I've since heard that these lie flat system to not perform aswell in an accident. But I haven't any detail on that.

Like the others though, a newborn is a real unknown. You've no idea if they'll take to travelling in the car, and personally I wouldn't choose a couple of days with a screaming vomit comet vs a few hours on a plane. But it might be ok. No way of knowing. You'll be wrecked and if you aren't happy driving a left hooker, I can only imagine how you'll be with perhaps no sleep. Also the baby might not settle after each feed that quickly. Might take an hours to settle them.

If you've a lot of stuff to carry though, maybe you've no choice.

You'll know after a week what sort of pattern you're likely to expect.
 
A big range of different experiences (all v.worthwhile to hear), so thanks to all.

We have a travel-system infant seat that can be lifted in and out of the car and clipped to the accompanying buggy. Nowhere on its guide does it say 'don't use for more than X period' in any one day, but common sense does dictate that v.small babies are delicate and it does make sense that a 2-week old child is not tough even the way a 2-month old is.

Just to clarify - this seat is a rear-facing, reclined 0-9months child seat without a base - not an upright one. I recall my parents lifting my little brother and sister in and out of the car in an unrestrained carrycot - the car had no airbags, head restraints or rear seatbelts, so I know that we're not comparing like with like!

I understand also that EU states have similar law governing these things and we can expect French cops to sling us in le-nick for travelling with an unrestrained child, so it's about travelling safely for all concerned rather than getting from Spain to Cherbourg at any risk.

I was thinking also of putting them on a cheapie flight to Charles De Gaule or Orly - or on a train to Paris or near it - which would be a compromise.

My problem is - perhaps naively - not that the child might cry the whole way or demand constant stops (an entirely realistic prospect in fairness), but rather the idea that the rear-facing seat props a newborn up to the extent that it causes a compression of the chest and restricts breathing, perhaps too much for a v.young child after a while, even if the child is healthy.

The teller of my horror story went as far as to suggest the death of the child, and I don't have to explain to any parent the sort of doubt that this creates about a course of action that was previously thought not problematic.
 
One issue which might make the journey very long, is the amount of time it takes to breastfeed a 2 weeks old. I'm a fan of breastfeeding, definitely best, but the reality is ( and I dont want to put you off), that breastfeeding a 2 week old can take a long time. It would not be unusual to feed for 60 minutes and then have to feed 2 hours later. While breastfeeding is getting established , both mother and baby are very sensitive to stress, discomfort and noise. You need a comfortable chair, cushions and some peace and quiet.

Good luck with everything, you will find the best solution and it will all be worth it.
 
all this advice regarding babies more than 90 minutes in a car seat by remembering that this is a one off trip that you, your wife, and your baby will be doing.

A baby as young as a few weeks will be fine on a one off trip. remember not dress them like you would indoors and not to dress them up in a thick coat and hat as I'm sure you will have the heating on in the car anyway. It is far easier to put on a baby blaanket which can be removed if the baby gets too warm. and to check if the baby is too warm, feel the back of their neck of their tummy. hands and feet are always colder in a young baby.

stop as you would for feeds and breaks for yourself enroute and you will be fine. don't let your wife feed the baby while you are driving however tempting it is to do so.

your baby will be very young and will probably sleep for the most of it.

stop worrying, enjoy the birth of your baby, and take the journey back as it comes. You will be fine.
 
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