Osama Bin Ladin is Dead
- Thread starter sustanon
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Just watched the news at 7am. Images of him shown with apparently a bullet thro the head. He was killed in Pakistan as was a number of other people, including his son. Crowds on the nightime streets in DC and NY "celebrating".
Bin Laden was a nutjob and a very nastly bloke. His passing will be regretted by few people. But this whole thing leaves me very uneasy, here's why:
3000 people killed in 9/11. America launches a massive strike (Operation Enduring Freedom) and topples the Taliban. America is now engaged in it's longest war. The total allied casualties exceed 2400, including 1420 in Afghanistan. Total American dead in Iraq ,33,023 with an additional 100,000 or so injured. Roughly 18 American vet suicides per day. Iraqi deaths since war began, nearly 1.5 million.
The costs of American-led actions both in human and financial terms are vast. America has beggared itself with war. Is the world a safer place or more dangerous place since all this began? Never mind the reputationally incredibly damaging Guantanamo bay spectacle, or Abu Graib. Names burned forever into the psyche of the destroyed countries and the rest of the ME that have undoubtedly fuelled the extremism America sought to counter by attacking in the 1st place.
The sight of American's celebrating Osma's death coupled with a warning of heightened security at American embassies etc tells us that there is really little to celebrate. They have created a new martyr for extremism, and the fight will trundle on interminably until someone calls a halt.
Bin Laden was a nutjob and a very nastly bloke. His passing will be regretted by few people. But this whole thing leaves me very uneasy, here's why:
3000 people killed in 9/11. America launches a massive strike (Operation Enduring Freedom) and topples the Taliban. America is now engaged in it's longest war. The total allied casualties exceed 2400, including 1420 in Afghanistan. Total American dead in Iraq ,33,023 with an additional 100,000 or so injured. Roughly 18 American vet suicides per day. Iraqi deaths since war began, nearly 1.5 million.
The costs of American-led actions both in human and financial terms are vast. America has beggared itself with war. Is the world a safer place or more dangerous place since all this began? Never mind the reputationally incredibly damaging Guantanamo bay spectacle, or Abu Graib. Names burned forever into the psyche of the destroyed countries and the rest of the ME that have undoubtedly fuelled the extremism America sought to counter by attacking in the 1st place.
The sight of American's celebrating Osma's death coupled with a warning of heightened security at American embassies etc tells us that there is really little to celebrate. They have created a new martyr for extremism, and the fight will trundle on interminably until someone calls a halt.
Whatever questions there may be about the war in Iraq and Afghanistan the death of Binladin is 100% a good thing.
The bravery and skill of the SEAL team that carried out the operation is remarkable.
While 9/11 was event that pushed the USA into military action let’s not forget the attacks on the USS Cole and the American embassies in Kenya and Tanzania as well as the tens of thousands of Muslims he's killed in Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iraq.
The bravery and skill of the SEAL team that carried out the operation is remarkable.
While 9/11 was event that pushed the USA into military action let’s not forget the attacks on the USS Cole and the American embassies in Kenya and Tanzania as well as the tens of thousands of Muslims he's killed in Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iraq.
potnoodler
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lets hope the world is better off without him, by that I mean who replaces him,
Z
z107
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I wonder what airport 'security' will be like for the next few weeks.
Tinker Bell
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The elephant in the room can now be discussed. USA debt. The national debt is now the highest it has been as a percentage of GNP since World War II. (several sources)
Lex Foutish
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Tinker Bell
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I didn't see the nightsky over Dublin 9 illuminated, nor the bloodstained duvet. But then, I doubt if OBL could hide in an under sink cupboard as the failed accountant did.The very same happened in Ireland when we got rid of Bertie!
Apparently Obama and Clinton watched this attack live, including the killing of Osama, via a camera mounted on a Navy Seals head. I find this incredible. They have made this very personal and vindictive. Does this help? Leaders are supposed to lead, not act like Western sheriff's. They are descending into the same mentality that motivates terrorism, personal visceral hatred and vengence. I don't for a minute regret the passing of Bin Laden, but this is not how statesmen and women should act.
I'm sure they watch attacks of real national importance and this was one of them.
While you would have to question all the collateral damage since the War on Terror began (Iraqi invasion probably unnecessary in retrospect), I do think its a day to celebrate. Fair play to the Americans they got their man.
I often agree with Michael Graham (the guy on George Hook) when he talks about Euroweenies. We're great for high moral ground but when some heads need to be busted its US guys putting their lives on the line.
I often agree with Michael Graham (the guy on George Hook) when he talks about Euroweenies. We're great for high moral ground but when some heads need to be busted its US guys putting their lives on the line.
In fairness, Iraq has settled down a lot over the past couple of years - I dont think you'd find many Iraqis nowdays who would want Saddam back. Economy is improving, violent death rate has dramatically declined - they've something to look forward to. They've also had peaceful reasonablty fair elections. Dont underestimate the impact this has had on the region. I'd very much doubt that we'd be seeing the secular risings across the middle east and north africa if Iraq was not democratic. Wasnt this the original plan? That the regime change in Iraq, when bedded down, would prompt regime changes elsewhere in the region.
csirl, I was thinking along those lines today.
I wonder if History will be kind to George W Bush and his war on terror policy?
With Bin Laden gone and the appetitie for change in north africa and the middle east, maybe the proactive policy undertaken by the USA after 9/11 might be seen in a more positive light if the world is a better place in 15-20 years time.
I wonder if History will be kind to George W Bush and his war on terror policy?
With Bin Laden gone and the appetitie for change in north africa and the middle east, maybe the proactive policy undertaken by the USA after 9/11 might be seen in a more positive light if the world is a better place in 15-20 years time.
Lol, and why should he? Isn't he in paradise surrounded by a few hundred virgins. I'd say he's too knackered to care!
Human shields?
Susan Boyle's a virgin. He could be exhausted from running away from them all and trying to find a secure hiding place.