Teenagers!

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JP1234

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I am banging my head in frustation lately at my son, who will be 17 next month.

Because he skipped transition year most of his friends now are either close to or are 18 and as a result have a bit more freedom, including going to the pub at night/staying out late. My son thinks he should be entitled to do this as well. Despite the fact he is only 16 and does not have a summer or part-time job (which a lot of his friends do) and expects us to fund his lifestyle. About 2 hours ago I gave him €20 as he said he wanted to go to get a bottle of mineral and some bread, said he might go for a walk as well. Now I have just been informed he is in town and staying out for a while.. and he thinks I am being unreasonable asking him to come home by 7 while we go out shopping as he doesn't have a key to get in and I am not prepared to leave one out "hidden" for him....

This is fairly typical, he has done little over the summer, it's a HUGE deal for him to wash the pots, hoover up, walk the dog...and as for cleaning his room!!!! Last week we allowed him to go to his friend's 18th at a nightclub ( private party type thing) and he was very put out that we insisted on collecting him at 1.30am rather than letting him stay out as long as wanted then walk home! When he got up at 1.30pm today he moaned and complained first there was nothing in to eat, then because I wouldn't make him a brunch!

We give him €20.00 a week plus I top his phone by €20 once a month, which I think is pretty generous.

I know it's a difficult age, not quite an adult but not a child either but I thought it would be easier by now. He's an intelligent, thoughtful, funny man/boy otherwise.

What rules and guidelines to folks here have/or had with their teenagers at this age? How do/did you cope with the last big leap? I am actually finding this period much more difficult than the hormonal years!!
 
Ahh..the gold old days!

Seriosuly though, from your post it sounds like he's a nice lad and will turn out fine. Just going through that stage in his life. Unless you think he's veering into too much partying (alcohol, drugs etc) I'd probably go a bit easy. He'll have the LC to look forward to so is probably going mad whilst he can. As a parent though you could do worse than take him to a college/university and let him get a feel for what he should aim for.
 
Well I'm not a parent so can't fully relate or empathise but I will say this:

2 weeks after my eighteenth birthday I was living in another country, unsupported, sharing a house with strangers, doing my own everything etc.

It wasn't considered that unusual at the time either (late 80s)

I suppose what I'm saying is that your son probably doesn't appreciate the support and assistance you give but also, he probably feels he isn't getting that much freedom either.
.. and he thinks I am being unreasonable asking him to come home by 7 while we go out shopping as he doesn't have a key to get in and I am not prepared to leave one out "hidden" for him....
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To be honest, I would regard the above as a big deal really.
 
Firefly said:
Ahh..the gold old days!

Seriosuly though, from your post it sounds like he's a nice lad and will turn out fine. Just going through that stage in his life. Unless you think he's veering into too much partying (alcohol, drugs etc) I'd probably go a bit easy. He'll have the LC to look forward to so is probably going mad whilst he can. As a parent though you could do worse than take him to a college/university and let him get a feel for what he should aim for.
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Yeah, I am pretty sure he will be ok and to be fair, he has never come home drunk or worse ( was only tipsy after the party last week)

caveat said:
I suppose what I'm saying is that your son probably doesn't appreciate the support and assistance you give but also, he probably feels he isn't getting that much freedom either.
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.. and he thinks I am being unreasonable asking him to come home by 7 while we go out shopping as he doesn't have a key to get in and I am not prepared to leave one out "hidden" for him....

To be honest, I would regard the above as a big deal really.
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that's exactly what is happening, we seen to constantly knocking heads, he thinks I am too strict ( maybe I am a little) while I think he is pretty ungrateful!

And I can see where you and him think it's a deal for me to ask him to come home but it's not like we ask him to do an awful lot and I am trying to make a point with him.

It's so annoying because we do get on very well on the whole but the last few months have just been....aaaaargh!

I should say, his father is pretty lax with him as long as he does well in school, so I do kind of find I am more often the bad guy!
 
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Unless he's going around with a "I hate my parents" T-shirt or something, I'd probably go out for cup of coffee with him. Talk to him calmly as an adult and leave him open up a bit. It also sounds like he has a lot of free time on his hands...does he have someone he looks upto (such as a successful relative etc) that he could meet up with the odd time?
 
I can remember being his age and feeilng the exact same way. It's a phase. Sit down and explain to him that you want him to enjoy these great years but you also want to protect him. He'll understand.
Then say that if he wants to be treated like a young man he has to help out at home and be respectful of your house. (It was at this point that my mother would ususally say "You'll be on your own in a year but for now you're under my roof and must live by my rules". I always thought that was a bit OTT)
When I was 16/17 I thought the friends I had then would be my best friends for life. Now I only meet a handful of them. I was told that at his age and didn't believe it. Thankfully the good friends are still there.
Being that age is full of self-importance and I honestly believed my friends and I were more important than anything else happening around me. He'll soon grow out of this and as long as you allow him to set his own life goals whilst respecting you and your home he will blossom in to a good man with the virtues and morals you have instilled in him.
 
The following is aimed as much at parents of teenagers from 13+ rather that just the OP; and comes from many years experience at the 'coal-face'! You can read 'he' as 'he or she'

1. A key to the front door wouldn't be unreasonable by the time they are in Secondary School.

2. Rather than set the curfew, ask him to agree one with you, depending on what he's doing. e.g. if movie finishes at 9pm be home by 10. If he misses his curfew time, he loses 30 mins off his curfew time the next time. Stay consistent with this - let it go once & you'll regret it!

3. He's entitled to make his own choices/mistakes, but you don't have to fund it. If he misappropriates money you've given him (e.g. buying CDs when he was supposed to be buying school shoes), then he loses out on pocket money the next week.

4. All youngsters push boundaries, it's part of growing up; the trick is to let them have some independence and input into the decision making process without becoming a parent who doesn't give a toss what their offspring does (not suggesting you are, but I've met a few!).

5. Always, always, always contact the parents where he is supposed to be staying overnight. If there is any shenanigans planned, he will choose a friend you don't know at all or very well. Don't refuse permission, just insist on a landline number so you can thank the parents for having him and arrange a time to pick him up the following morning. No number, no call, no go. If it's straight up there'll be no problem; if he whinges and complains, there was some other plan!

6. Consider linking chores to pocket money - this works for some people; it doesn't for me as a) I consider everyone who lives in the house has a responsibility towards maintaining it and b) my memory is terrible, I'm liable to forget what they were supposed to do! Any extra money wanted had to be earned though; there's always a car to be washed or grass to be cut.

I would absolutely agree with you on picking him up; my rule generally was anything after 11pm you'll be collected. If you don't like it, don't go.

No. 1 tip - if you've made a decision, don't allow them to argue you out of it. Do not give in to moaning, whining, complaining, door banging or general stroppiness; don't enter into discussions or attempt to 'reason', you'll just give yourself an unnecessary argument. That does not mean don't be willing to negotiate, there's a difference!
 
Lets look at this. He will be 17 next month. If he intends going to third lelvel this means he will be just 18 which is a good age to start.
If he is taking a pint you might as well face the facts that you wont stop him. Its better that he is having a drink in a pub or a friends house rather than on the street or in the park. Tell him the few tricks about spacing out the drink, staying on the pints and keeping away from shorts etc. Tell him you dont mind the few pints but certainly keep away from the fags and drugs. As for the women tell him to mind himself and any girl he is with. He will probably be mortified but he will listen. Also tell not to do anything that would worry the mother and that after the summer he should begin to work hard for the leaving. Tell him that after the leaving he will be his own man. What you need to do is accept that he is growing up. If underneath he is a good lad he will know that you are acting in his interest out of love and concern.
He needs a bit of leeway and will get it if he is willing to meet you half way with doing a few jobs around the place
 
Horrible, Horrible age.. Keep your head down and you wll be through it in 2 years time.
Best of luck.
 
Great views and advice - thanks!

I actually don't mind him having the odd drink and will let him have a couple of cans of cider on a Saturday night at home, the few times he has been in a pub with his mates he has told us and has never come in drunk. I honestly don't think he is that bothered about drinking. We were in France a few weeks back and the most he had was a small glass of wine with dinner. My husband's nephew just turned 18 but has been getting hammered since he was about 15, culminating in him passing out drunk at my mother-in-laws 70th birthday party:eek:.

He does have a house key - just never remembers to take it with him!

I know this is probably the final hurdle in his growing up, and I think it's the toughest on all of us. Probably doesn't help he's an only child so it's that much harder, we just seem to be pulling against each other constantly.

In all likelyhood he will be heading off to college next year, as much as I dread it I also can't wait!
 
Welcome to the club - 23 now and still no better than your 17 year old but then that's the male of the species for ya ;)
 
Sue Ellen said:
Welcome to the club - 23 now and still no better than your 17 year old but then that's the male of the species for ya ;)
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Aaargh..don't say that;) I was banking on him being out of our hair ( at least 4 nights a week) when he heads off to college next year!
 
He is 16..he is a child!!
He should not be drinking alcohol and you should not be facilitating him doing this.
Too many people want their kids to grow up on one level, ie;they can have a few drinks and on the other hand want them to remain as kids, ie;be in at a certain time..
You are sending mixed messages.he is a child ,he is 16,you are the parent.

You say "he" skipped transition year.Why? Was that his decision? It sounds like he should have done it,thereby staying in line with what his peers are doing but this is a consequence of wanting to grow up too quickly.

You say he was in town when he wasnt supposed to be..what consequences did he have to suffer for this?

The "Few times" hes been in the pub!! "I don't mind him having a drink", "cans of cider on a Saturday night",, "was only tipsy after a party last week!"
There is something sad about a parent thinking they may be too strict by leaving a key out for a kid/collecting him at 1.30,yet allowing that kid to drink alcohol ,go to pubs,get a bit tipsy!
It is, in my opinion allowing him to get away with so much that will be your downfall,if you let him go to pubs,partys,have a few drinks ,have cans of cider,come home tipsy,not be where hes supposed to be,not do anything in the house,stay in bed till all hours,it is you that is allowing this to happen,you are the parent,it is so easy to let them get away with all of the above,it is much more difficult to parent,to make rules ,to make them suffer the consequences of his actions etc.

I know of parents who do exactly this,,however the mess that some of the kids get themselves into by drinking and partying at 16 is sad..They are being forced into an adult situation when they have the mind of a child..
Most 18 year olds wouldn't be seen dead with a 16 year old,as they consider them as kids.
Too many parents take the easy option..parents are just that PARENTS,they are not friends..

I apoligise if you think I'm being too hard on you,but I have seen the results of parents thinking that they are "cool" allowing the kids to drink,you are doing them no favours.
 
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No I actually don't think you are being too hard, because more or less everything you say are things I have thought or questioned myself.

As for allowing him a drink, well I just think it's realistic, he is going to be exposed to it and will inevitably try it and I would rather he didn't feel he had to hide it. Neither myself nor his father drink so that has been a hard choice for us to allow him to do so, definitely not an "easy choice". We have talked about drugs, he swears he has never tried them, I have never seen any evidence of it so I have to take his word on that.

My own view and some may disagree is I would rather prepare him, rather than this idea the minute he turns 18 he is on his own, making these choices and decisions. As it is now, he knows there are boundaries and limits and I would hope that in 13 months when he is 18 these will help him make his own decisions. It's nothing to do with being cool, I'd say among his friends I am the least cool parent! just trying to find a balance.

Just as some 16/17 year olds do get in a state so too the 18 years olds who were never allowed a drop, the minute they legally become an adult, who's to stop them?

Consequences of him being out when he shouldn't be yesterday was that he was made to head home by 6..which did not go down well.

I'd have to say, as frustrated as I am with him lately, it's mainly a battle of wills, he wants to freedom, I want him to earn it by taking a bit more responsability. At the end of the day he is a great person, kind, intelligent, brave enough to stand his ground and funny with it. Wouldn't change him for the world ( except maybe the beard he is currently sporting!:p)
 
I hear what you are saying..

You say.."well I just think it's realistic, he is going to be exposed to it and will inevitably try it ".But would you say the same about drugs/sex etc...

Parents have a more relaxed attitude to drinking and yet the trouble some kids get into because of it ,is heartbreaking.
We control what they watch on TV, we wouldn't let them have porn mags or smoke a spliff,yet seem to think its OK to let them drink,I don't know if its the right or wrong thing to do,I can only relay my own experience .


"I think if a parent succeeds in getting their children to "police " themselves,they are very lucky.

Perhaps its just me,but having had four kids, I brought them up with a sense of how drink affects people, how and when your body can cope with alcohol,showing them the state of some kids who attend the local disco, vomiting, being taken advantage of,carted off to hospital to be pumped out etc.and the trouble some of them get into.( and thats just me:D)

I agree with you that the minute someone turns 18,doesnt mean they are going to be a rock of sense..but at that stage at the very least ,they are considered to be adults and they make their decisions and suffer the consequences.

My own kids have told me about friends who get " out of their heads" on drink.
I don't know the answer but in my circle the parents of those kids who were allowed to drink at an early age, are without doubt the ones who are having trouble.I understand that may not be the case for you,and that the other things he does is part of growing up,I focussed on you allowing him to drink for no other reason than to point out,that he may feel if he is allowed to drink he should be allowed do so much more.

Interesting to hear what others views are on their kids drinking though..
 
thedaras said:
I hear what you are saying..

You say.."well I just think it's realistic, he is going to be exposed to it and will inevitably try it ".But would you say the same about drugs/sex etc...

Parents have a more relaxed attitude to drinking and yet the trouble some kids get into because of it ,is heartbreaking.
We control what they watch on TV, we wouldn't let them have porn mags or smoke a spliff,yet seem to think its OK to let them drink,I don't know if its the right or wrong thing to do,I can only relay my own experience .


"I think if a parent succeeds in getting their children to "police " themselves,they are very lucky.

Perhaps its just me,but having had four kids, I brought them up with a sense of how drink affects people, how and when your body can cope with alcohol,showing them the state of some kids who attend the local disco, vomiting, being taken advantage of,carted off to hospital to be pumped out etc.and the trouble some of them get into.( and thats just me:D)

I agree with you that the minute someone turns 18,doesnt mean they are going to be a rock of sense..but at that stage at the very least ,they are considered to be adults and they make their decisions and suffer the consequences.

My own kids have told me about friends who get " out of their heads" on drink.
I don't know the answer but in my circle the parents of those kids who were allowed to drink at an early age, are without doubt the ones who are having trouble.I understand that may not be the case for you,and that the other things he does is part of growing up,I focussed on you allowing him to drink for no other reason than to point out,that he may feel if he is allowed to drink he should be allowed do so much more.

Interesting to hear what others views are on their kids drinking though..
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I know, it is fairly hypcritical of most people allowing children to drink and i stand guilty of that. I just don't know the answer and we can only do what we believe is best, based on what we know of our own children.

My sister in law allowed her son to drink from around 14/15, a disaster! He is the one who got completely out of it at his granny's 70th birthday. An older cousin was buying him pints while his own mother was surreptitiously buying him bacardi breezers, passing them off as orange juice. My own son was only 14 at the time and I do think seeing his cousin in such a state did him no harm. He got his A level results this week ( live in Scotland) and didn't get good enough grades to get into University..so maybe that will be his wake up call. My son is very academic (bordering on nerdy!) so I don't think he would throw away his grades like that - the reason he skipped TY was he was so keen to start his LC!
 
No. 1 tip - if you've made a decision, don't allow them to argue you out of it. Do not give in to moaning, whining, complaining, door banging or general stroppiness; don't enter into discussions or attempt to 'reason', you'll just give yourself an unnecessary argument. That does not mean don't be willing to negotiate, there's a difference!



Excellent advice for kids of any age.
 
“I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on the frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words. When I was a boy, we were taught to be discrete and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise and impatient of restraint.”



Hesiod -700 BC
 
hesiod said:
“i see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on the frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words. When i was a boy, we were taught to be discrete and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise and impatient of restraint.”
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+1

Harrumph.
 
Am nearer to being the teenager than having the teenager (eldest is 4!), but in my own situation it was zero tolerance to drugs (werent as big a thing at the time), zero tolerance to smoking, and no mention/acquiesence to some drink, though not in their presence. Was in no greater danger from the ladies !!

As to how it worked out, not too bad, never took drugs (a few pulls on a spliff in college, that was it), never got hooked on cigs - smoked a very occasional one, got drunk a few times under 18.

As regards the drinking I think I would have benefitted from some 'worldly wise' advice like - stick to pints, no shorts or alcopops, try to keep out of rounds, drink water if you get a chance, even if you think you are ok beware the "blast of fresh air effect!!". Think those TV ads about getting sick etc were on the money, very uncool to be legless.

I would rarely drink in the presence of the kids at home - they'd be gone to bed, and I wouldnt be getting inebriated, not a pub man at all. But as they get older I dont think there would be any harm in them seeing someone enjoying 1 or 2 drinks, not having it affect them, and leaving it at that. The Irish problem is mainly drinking specifically to get drunk, as opposed to enjoying a few drinks without there being a "goal" or "destination". So when they are, say, 16 I think it would take the mystique out of drinking if they have a can with their Da and everyone leaves it at that.

As regards the OP's young fella, doesnt sound like he's in too much danger, his intelligence and focus on school will carry him through. Its when lads have nothing to aim for that the "living for the weekend" thing takes hold.
 
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