Rockbrook Sandyford

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haircut

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Hi

I have qualified for an apartment in Sandyford but am concerned about the fact that Tivway, part of the Fleming group of companies is seeking the appointment of an examiner to protect itself from ACC who has appointed a receiver. I contacted Dun Laoghaire Rathdown today regarding this matter and they had no further information to offer as to date. Has anybody got any information on this situation
 
I saw a piece about it on the news yesterday. From what I understand Tivway are building (or stopped building) the office tower. I dont know if they are also building the residential towers.

Could be wrong though.
 
it has been reported in today's Irish Times that the examiner has 100 days to come up with a rescue plan for Tivway (one of the Fleming Group Companies) or else the company will be wound up. Tivway is behind the Rockbrook residential and retail development in Sandyford. Other Fleming Group companies are also at significant risk by virtue of the 'inter dependency' of the Fleming Group companies
 
is anybody in the process of signing contracts on these apartments, I have been advised to hold off till the examiner finishes his work.
 
Haircut, your last post is misleading. Tivway is a special purpose company set up to develop the Sentinel tower and the old "Aldi" site. The current Rockbrook developments (Grand Central and South Central), are on the "Allegro" site. The Aldi site is the next one along, as yet undeveloped. They are different companies, although all part of the Fleming group. Legal advice that I have received is that here is little exposure even if Tivway went into liquidation. Grand Central and South Central are essentialy complete. They are already fitted out, and the management company for each block is separate. There is a potential small issue re the developer's liability for his share of the management charges until all the properties are sold.
However the current release of South Central apartments seem to be competitively priced, and appear to have sold well over the last 2 months. It seems likely that the developer will continue to release the remaining apartments as quickly as prudent, to reduce his outstanding loans.
Rusty100, I'll be interested in your efforts to delay for the 100 days.
It could make sense for you. On the other hand if the apartments are selling well at current prices, and the developer needs the money, he may not be willing to accept the delay in closing.
 
Oceanis i appreciate your attempt to clarify the situation regarding Tivway. But answer me this, why did the Fleming Group in their efforts to appoint an examiner say that 650 jobs would be in danger if ACC was successful in appointing a receiver for Tivway ltd.
 
If any of you do go ahead and buy make sure that you snag the place yourself and don't sign contracts until the snag is complete. Dun Laoghaire Rathdown Co Co did the snag on some apts in other developments and it wasn't done properly at all. If Flemmings are in trouble it will be hard to sort out problems post-sale, so make sure that the apt is perfect before you sign.
 
Haircut,
I think there is a lot of positioning going on with various parties pre-NAMA - ACC, Fleming, other banks. Fleming clearly believe that they can trade their way out of trouble. ACC/Rabo want their pound of flesh before anyone else - very Dutch! So mentioning 650 job losses in court is all part of the plan to get ACC to pfo while Fleming sort themselves out. To me Fleming is one of the better developers. They paid way over the odds for the Allegro site (€165m or c. €200k per apartment), but seem to have done a good job on completing it, and other developments in the past. They have other trading companies, plus an interesting company, Vision, doing advanced construction technology in UK and Ireland. Seem a bit different from some of the cowboys out there. (Though I could be wrong!!)
However even if Fleming don't make it, the key issue is what is the effect on your home. The legal advice that I have received is that there is minimum risk, as long as you don't pay until the property is complete, and as Cheesus says, well snagged.
 
Oceanis you seem very confident about it all. Have you or do you intend to purchase an apartment under the AH?
 
Rusty100,
Helping a family member, who didn't proceed with an AH offered in the Beacon (for the usual reasons). Now planning to buy on open market basis in Rockbrook.
 
Advertising 1 beds from €225k, 2 beds from €295k. Seems they are doing deals a few % below those figures, depending on the apartment. Might be worth making an offer at your current AH price plus whatever you would be prepared to pay for the flexibility, greater location choice, and any fitout difference. Then you can make the call.
The current prices are supported by Building Soc valuers (if that means anything after the last 5 years!)
 
Draft Contracts, that were submitted from Solicitors acting for Fleming Construction, have not been approved by the Council's Legal Services Department and therefore sales at Rockbrook cannot proceed at this stage.
 
Interesting to hear about Council's legal concerns re the Affordable homes apartments. Would be very interested to know what the issues are. The legal process seems quite slow on the private side as well. There are some questions/clarifications needed re the parking and some other minor issues. We have checked out the assigned residents' parking slots, and they look OK. Various temporary structures are visible, which may relate to the retail parking.
Hooke & MacDonald claim that c. 25 of the initial release of 39 private apartments have been sold, and this is supported by comparing their current sales literature to that from May. Looks like the 1 and 2 bed apartments are selling well, but the 3 beds have been slow. Seems these were targeted at the buy-to-let market which has stalled. The 3 beds are priced at €405k and up - looks like there might be some good deals going if you have that kind of money!! They didn't have viewings during August. Apparently this is normal in the holiday period, and they are due to start again shortly.

The quiet period on site in August was the builders' holiday and work has restarted on site. There is visible activity is taking place on the main entrance, and in the retail area, and I understand that there is work scheduled to tidy up the parking. According to a senior Fleming manager on site (who was very upbeat about the development), they expect to have people in by end September. He informed me that finance had recently been agreed for completion of the block, and that there were deals in negotiation on a number of the the retail units.

I have read that the administrator for Tivway has now asked for two other Fleming companies to be included in the overall administration scheme. There were some previous references in court to cross-guarantees between Tivway (the office block company) and two other Fleming companies. At a guess the examiner wants to see off any possible back door approach by ACC or others which could impede his work on resolving the Tivway examinership.
 
Oceanis, as appeared in the Indo today

"THE survival of a 30-company construction group is "remote" unless High Court protection from its creditors is extended to its two parent companies, a judge heard yesterday.
Mr Justice Daniel O'Keeffe has been asked to extend the examinership of Tivway, one of the Cork-based Fleming group of companies, to John J Fleming Construction and JJ Fleming Holdings"

So my undersatnding of this is that the Fleming Group is at significant risk due to the interdependancy with Tivway. Maybe you can clarify
 
Haircut,
The application to extend the examiner’s role to Fleming Construction and Fleming Holdings was agreed by the High Court yesterday, and things are a bit clearer. The cross guarantees between the three companies, (Tivway, Fleming Holdings and Fleming Construction) presumably left a door open for ACC to follow their attempt to force liquidation of Tivway, so the examiner needed to close it off. The Court seems to have decided that there is a reasonable chance that the group can be successfully restructured and restored to profitability over a 7-10 year period, and it seems that finance is available to complete projects (Rockbrook + others ?) There is another review in early October, at which stage the examiner’s full plan will be submitted to the court.
I looked around the site on Friday. It looked fairly quiet, but I was told that snagging work is underway on the apartments at the front of the block. There does seem to have been some delay in completion, but it looks as if the first apartments will be available within several weeks.
However my strong advice would be to hold back on making any further payments until your apartment is completed and fully snagged, and relevant public areas are completed (i.e. the rest of your core, lifts, stairwell, entrance, plus the landscaping and parking). There are two main reasons for this. First there is still some risk (though it seems to be diminishing) of the company going into liquidation and deposits being exposed. I believe the Homebond scheme gives some protection against this, but why risk the hassle? Second, if Fleming had cashflow problems, they might have difficulty paying for labour, or getting suppliers to replace any broken “things” in your apartment.
Unlike the mad situation of a few years ago, I don’t see the developers or agents being in a position to “give away” your apartment to the next person in a long queue. Seems to me that in today’s highly volatile situation, it’s a fair deal that they finish their work, and then buyers pay them on handover.
 
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