Is anyone else cheesed off with how much people get paid on social welfare

[Purple]

I agree that there was mass exodus from our shores in past decades. The exodus was a reluctant reality, working long and hard hours to survive not a planned exercise to be a SW tourist. The UK authorities got great value out of our citizens labour. Not a like for like situation at all in my book.

I'm sure the Polish feel the same way about us.

 

[rabbit]

I'm sure the Polish feel the same way about us.

At least the pubs are not full of drunk poles.

 

[Lak]

maybe...but why would they be happy to work for a pittance when others who do state work get paid a fortune , often for less skilled work ?

Fair point but one thing is cast in stone, the country will never move forward if every person on this Island is pre occupied in what is fair, and that so and so is getting more than me for doing this that and the other.
The burden must be shared from the poorest to the wealthiest.
There will allways be a disproportionate obligation, how could a ministers pay cut be in anyway compared to a bus driver but the fact remains we all need to find some common ground in what is inevitable.
I await with interest the poitical class gripe about them not having to take a cut, they were brazen enough not so long ago to insist they were more than worthy of massive pay increases and only very begrudgingly desisted from doing so.

 

[Bronte]

Protest about what? This seems like a perfectly good proposition to me.
People in need of housing get housed.
Builders who are in financial trouble get some income coming in.
Banks who are in trouble get some income from developers and so reduce the possibilities of bad debts.

What is the alternative way open to the government to provide social housing? Build yet more units?

It would be far more cost effective if the government purchased houses at knock down prices from developers desperate to sell. Or they could pay them over 20 years for ownership rather than leasing them and paying for their upkeep (the opposite to normal Irish landlord tenant situation). Just wait until this scheme is in place a few years, see property values go up and the developer sells going off into the sunset with his profits courtesy of the taxpayer and the government left with the problem of then housing people having paid out a fortune.

 

[nesbitt]

I'm sure the Polish feel the same way about us.

From what I have read here the Polish are on a gravy train from this country. If you know any Irish person who went to the UK in search of work you should realise that their experience would have been vastly different to the modern day Polish worker who gets wife gets to claim allowances including Child benefit even though she remains in Poland. Our Governement are a crowd of absolute plonkers... Your not comparing like with like......

 

[rabbit]

From what I have read here the Polish are on a gravy train from this country. If you know any Irish perosn who went to the UK in search of work you should realise that their experience would have been vastly different to the modern day Polish worker who gets wife gets to claim allowances including Child benefit even though she remains in Poland. Our Governement are a crowd of absolute plonkers... Your not comparing like with like......

Not every Polish person sends Child benefit home to Poland...just as not every Irish person lives in a van and claims social welfare for 10 kids on both sides of the border.

 

[redstar]

Interesting thread.
I have worked 25+ years and am now to be made redundant for the second time in that period. I paid PAYE/PRSI when PAYE was at penal rates around 65%.

My income will fall from 1000+ per week to 395 (204 + 135 + 56), includes wife + 2 kids.

I social welfare too high ? In my case, no.
I do not want 'handouts'. I just want a fair return for all the PRSI that I paid over the years...

Oh, and a job.

 

[Lak]

So do I but I get exactly (204+135+56) less than you will.

 

[nesbitt]

Not every Polish person sends Child benefit home to Poland...just as not every Irish person lives in a van and claims social welfare for 10 kids on both sides of the border.

I would like to see the stats on the Polish people who have not availed of this great offer.. So you have seen me in the Van with the ten kids then!

 

[redstar]

So do I but I get exactly (204+135+56) less than you will.

Fair point. Tax compliant self-employed people are treated like rubbish when it comes to Social Welfare - unlike certain others (not everyone, of course) claiming welfare who have no intention of contributing to society, and who know how to milk the allowances to the max by being 'economical with the truth'.

At least you have a valuable practical trade which could generate some,though irregular, income for yourself. Unlike me, who has to go and 'get a job'.

 

[Purple]

From what I have read here the Polish are on a gravy train from this country. If you know any Irish person who went to the UK in search of work you should realise that their experience would have been vastly different to the modern day Polish worker who gets wife gets to claim allowances including Child benefit even though she remains in Poland. Our Governement are a crowd of absolute plonkers... Your not comparing like with like......

Stop reading the daily mail and look at the dependency ratio within the emigrant population.
The other thing you should consider is that there is a major skills shortage (still) in this country which is filled by skilled an motivated non-national workers.
My father and most of his family emigrated to England in the 60’s because they didn’t have the money to buy food so I know all about how hard most of the Irish worked there. I also know that most of the homeless in London were born in Ireland and there are still plenty of council estates in England housing Irish emigrants. This “we were great and they’re all freeloaders” BS is groundless.

 

[rabbit]

Fair point. Tax compliant self-employed people are treated like rubbish when it comes to Social Welfare - unlike certain others (not everyone, of course) claiming welfare who have no intention of contributing to society, and who know how to milk the allowances to the max by being 'economical with the truth'.

At least you have a valuable practical trade which could generate some,though irregular, income for yourself. Unlike me, who has to go and 'get a job'.

Its easier said than done in todays Ireland for many self-employed people to " generate some,though irregular, income " in order to pay mortgage / support kids etc. I know many self employed people now digging in to savings / extra borrowings in order to survive.

 

[Lak]

Its easier said than done in todays Ireland for many self-employed people to " generate some,though irregular, income " in order to pay mortgage / support kids etc. I know many self employed people now digging in to savings / extra borrowings in order to survive.

Red star I was in no way being pedantic about you're situation and you have my sympathies as do all who have lost their jobs. I am fortunate yes that I have the opportunity to gain sporadic work if it comes my way but as Rabbit says savings do not last long when you have a weekly income at present of zero.
However (rabit) believing that non nationals do not avail of what is their constitutional rights to claim benefits of which they are currently entitled is way off the mark, lets face it who in their right mind wouldnt.
I can assure you non nationals are most certainly riding the pigs back in welfare handouts as are Irish nationals to a great extent.
A conversation I had at the weekend with a roofing contractor made me aware of the fact that in Poland the monthly unemployment benefit amounts to €160 across the board with no other supplements including housing benefit, with the average rental of an apartment being €20 more. I of course can not verify this and am more than open to being contradicted but am merely quoteing what a friends Polish workers told him.

 

[rabbit]

However (rabit) believing that non nationals do not avail of what is their constitutional rights to claim benefits of which they are currently entitled is way off the mark, lets face it who in their right mind wouldnt.

Actually what I wrote was " Not every Polish person sends Child benefit home to Poland..." I stand by that, as not every Polish person here has children in Poland. I am generous enough / fair enough to assume that there are many honest Polish people, who do not scam the system and send money to Poland for non-existant children.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Actually what I wrote was " Not every Polish person sends Child benefit home to Poland..." I stand by that, as not every Polish person here has children in Poland. I am generous enough / fair enough to assume that there are many honest Polish people, who do not scam the system and send money to Poland for non-existant children.

unlike every public servant

 

[rabbit]

Now now, I do not tar the entire Polish immigrant community with the same brush. You should not suggest every public servant "scams the system".

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Now now, I do not tar the entire Polish immigrant community with the same brush. You should not suggest every public servant "scams the system".

neither should you, not on THIS thread of course

ANyway my public counter is finished so i'll go home now and work out when i'll take my flexi day

 

[Complainer]

As a self employed individual having paid my taxes year on year and an S stamp it transpires I am entitled to precisely nothing in welfare payments so we live off one wage as do thousands of formely S/E workers.

Sorry to hear that the work has dried up. Can you just clarify if you are entitled to precisely nothing, or precisely nothing that is not means tested? I understood that anyone would receive Jobseekers Allowance if the met the means test, regardless of the employment history. Is this not the case for formerly self-employed people?

I don't recall too many complaints about self-employed status in the boom times when it was seen as a route to (legally) avoid tax.

As for working for your Dole, there is a scheme called a CE scheme where long term unemployed can work three days a week in all manner of services that benefit the community and country as a whole for just a few euro more above the welfare payments, this is a voluntary scheme which many people happily partake of in order to keep a sense of dignity, a sense of contribution and to keep themselves busy and sane........only the government have in their wisdom imposed a two month embargo on anyone taking up this option, and may even be scrapped alltogether.

If there is work to be done, the workers should get a fair days pay, not a few pennies above the dole.

Last point : I worked in a gang alongside another guy, he is single and rents a four bed new house paid for by the state alongside his €204 euro, medical card etc etc and has no intention of taking a full time job again other than the odd day cash here and there.

There is no Govt scheme that pays for a 4-bed house for a single man.

 

[nesbitt]

Stop reading the daily mail and look at the dependency ratio within the emigrant population.
The other thing you should consider is that there is a major skills shortage (still) in this country which is filled by skilled an motivated non-national workers.
My father and most of his family emigrated to England in the 60’s because they didn’t have the money to buy food so I know all about how hard most of the Irish worked there. I also know that most of the homeless in London were born in Ireland and there are still plenty of council estates in England housing Irish emigrants. This “we were great and they’re all freeloaders” BS is groundless.

Purple I have never read the 'Daily Mail' in my life. The OP asks if dole at 204euro is too much and that the Government cannot afford it. Obviously they cannot afford it so I think its about time they cut corners where they should be cut. Still not buying the Irish emmigrant v Polish emmigrant comparison. In fact when I mentioned SW tourists I was also thinking of all the non EU SW recipiants also. As I said my point is obviously a 'hot potato' issue. I must say that I have always been far too liberal in views in times past but must admit when I see members of my own family (sibling) suffering and getting the absolute run around by SW when they have fallen on hard times. I find the whole SW scenario totally galling.

 

[rabbit]

Sorry to hear that the work has dried up. Can you just clarify if you are entitled to precisely nothing, or precisely nothing that is not means tested?

Plenty of self employed people now find that they are entitled to no social welfare, because the work has dried up after working hard, paying tax and acting in a financially rresponsible manner for years or decades

I don't recall too many complaints about self-employed status in the boom times when it was seen as a route to (legally) avoid tax.

The vast majority of self employed / business people did not see it as a route to (legally) avoid tax...in fact this sector paid and pays the tax that supports others.