I bought office furniture frm previous tenant that were still on hire purchase.

A

Alwyn

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Hi, apologies in advance if this post should be in the business threads but I need legal advise on the following please, as my solicitor seems to have washed her hands with the situation:

I took out a lease for office space from a reputable agents a couple of months back and was contacted by the previous tenant who asked me was I interested in buying the contents of the office for a fixed price as they would no longer be using them i.e. chairs, tables desks etc. It seemed a really good deal at the time and I jumped at the chance.

To get to the point, I had a call at the office from a bank representative looking for the previous tenant whilst explaining that the items within my office space that I thought I had paid cash for, were on hire purchase and were still legally owned by the bank. The previous tenant cannot be contacted.

In defense of the the bank they have given me time to digest the situation and have offered me the chance to continue on payments from were the previous tenant left off. Having been given a copy of the account there is still a lot of money owed and personally the items within the office are not worth the amount the bank is looking for.

Do I have a leg to stand on? Can the bank come in and remove the items? Or am I just a fool that was conned?

Thank you for any replies.
 
You should report the previous leaseholders to the Garda for selling items that weren't theirs to sell.
 
Negotiate a price with the bank - don't just continue where the other left off. After all, you are in effect now buying second hand stuff from the bank. Stuff that the bank doesn't want.
 
umop3p!sdn said:
Negotiate a price with the bank - don't just continue where the other left off. After all, you are in effect now buying second hand stuff from the bank. Stuff that the bank doesn't want.
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+1 ... Secondhand office furniture can be picked up pretty cheaply , make them an offer at about 33% of the original cost and see where it goes.
 
dereko1969 said:
You should report the previous leaseholders to the Garda for selling items that weren't theirs to sell.
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I doubt the Guards would get involved. I bought a car from a dealership that had finance outstanding on it and when I reported it to the Guards I was told it was a civil matter.
 
Thank you all for the feedback.

Can the bank get a court order to remove the goods or have they the automatic right of way to enter the office?
 
Alwyn said:
... Can the bank get a court order to remove the goods or have they the automatic right of way to enter the office?
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You know the bank owns the furniture, so I think you should not be considering this question.

I am assuming that the people who sold you the furniture are not to be found, so the best outcome for you at this stage might be to get a good deal from the bank. I'd go with TheShark's advice.
 
Padraigb said:
You know the bank owns the furniture, so I think you should not be considering this question.

I am assuming that the people who sold you the furniture are not to be found, so the best outcome for you at this stage might be to get a good deal from the bank. I'd go with TheShark's advice.
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+1

The bank most certainly do not want the goods back, so they should be open to doing a deal. Best of luck.
 
The plot thickens; I spoke to another representative in the bank yesterday who told me that the previous owners had went into liquidation and the liquidator didn't bother taking the items into account because there was a personal guarantee given by previous owner.

Bank don't seem to be very flexible and the situation is becoming more trouble than it's worth so I'm going to cut my losses and ask them to remove items.

Thanks everyone for your thoughts.
 
Alwyn said:
The plot thickens; I spoke to another representative in the bank yesterday who told me that the previous owners had went into liquidation and the liquidator didn't bother taking the items into account because there was a personal guarantee given by previous owner.

Bank don't seem to be very flexible and the situation is becoming more trouble than it's worth so I'm going to cut my losses and ask them to remove items.

Thanks everyone for your thoughts.
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Did you pay cash,cheque, draft etc. Be ho harm to contact liquidator and explain situation and get him to note on his liquidation report about the frauda and is their anything he can do for you.

Keep thread updated if bank have items collected. They should take whatever you offer and enforce balance of guarantee against the person who sold them to you.

If looking to find person who sold them to you, do company search on cro and sometimes gives you details of other companies they own, registered office/home address etc.
 
Hi Papervalue, unfortunately I paid cash as seller would have it no other way. I suppose alarm bells should have rang at this point:eek:

I contacted the liquidator yesterday as soon as I heard and found him very unhelpful and not forthcoming with information. He said the items were not taken into account during the asset inspection, which is odd in itself and that he had trust in his client and had left it to them to sell the 'items' in question and pay off the bank. I have never heard the likes of this before.

The bank are in constant contact with me and are pressing me to make arrangements to continue on payments from were the previous tenant left off. To add fuel to the fire they want the 'items' left in the previous tenants name as they had given the bank a personal guarantee.

I've also learned that the bank know the whereabouts of their client but feel I am the one who should be paying as their client has gone bust plus I am in use of the goods.

I will keep this thread updated as to were this mess all ends up.
 
Don't allow yourself to feel pressurised or bullied by the bank. By the sound of it, you would be doing them a favour by paying them ANYTHING for these goods. If they insist on playing hardball with you, perhaps you should play hardball with them? Come up with a figure you would be willing to pay for the goods and put it to the bank. If they refuse your offer, order them to remove their goods from your premises. Make it clear that if they don't do so, you'll be forced to charge them for storage of the goods.

As per you earlier post, these goods are not worth a smell of what the bank claim. Accordingly, they need to play ball with you. Best of luck, and do not allow yourself be intimidated.
 
Thanks Pat.

I cannot believe they are chasing me instead of the person who gave them the guarantee. Surely the guarantee is worth more than the cost of desks etc.
 
Why are you eager to hand the fittings back to the bank? I'm presuming you have signed nothing. If so, then the bank have nothing on you but instead should be chasing the person who gave them the personal guarantee. If what you say is correct regarding the bank knowing the whereabouts of the 'real owner' of these goods then I find this whole scenario absurd to say the least.
 
A few things don't quite ring true about this situation :

Alwyn said:
... I had a call at the office from a bank representative looking for the previous tenant whilst explaining that the items within my office space that I thought I had paid cash for, were on hire purchase and were still legally owned by the bank...
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Did you ask the bank representative to provide proof of ownership - serial numbers, identification marks, sight of the original invoices from the suppliers, signed agreements with a schedule of goods, etc.

Did you (or the letting agent) volunteer the information that you had purchased the stuff from the previous tenant for cash or did the bank just assume the stuff was in situ when you got there?
Alwyn said:
... Having been given a copy of the account ...
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Hopefully there is no identifying or personal information about the account holder on the copy of the account you received, otherwise the bank could be in breach of data protection legislation.
Alwyn said:
... there is still a lot of money owed and personally the items within the office are not worth the amount the bank is looking for...
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Which means either the previous tenant has removed some of the stuff the bank is laying claim to or you have paid him cash for inferior office equipment and he still has the stuff the bank wants.

Did you get an invoice / bill of sale describing what you bought, what you paid and who you paid the money to?
 
Why are you eager to hand the fittings back to the bank? I'm presuming you have signed nothing.
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This is an interesting observation.

Why not just do nothing? Keep using the fittings, but don't entertain the bank any more. This could drag on months or years.

I wouldn't be an any rush to hand money over or sign anything.
 
mathepac said:
Which means either the previous tenant has removed some of the stuff the bank is laying claim to or you have paid him cash for inferior office equipment and he still has the stuff the bank wants.
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Surely it just means the amount due to the bank is greater than the open market value of the goods? That would be normal enough.
 
umop3p!sdn said:
This is an interesting observation.

Why not just do nothing? Keep using the fittings, but don't entertain the bank any more. This could drag on months or years.

I wouldn't be in any rush to hand money over or sign anything.
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Hi, my eagerness is due to the fact that the bank is constantly ringing me and making me feel like I'm the one who has done something wrong. They are telling me that I am taking in money whereas the previous person has no income. The situation really is as crazy as it probably sounds to people reading this thread. I'm also embarrassed that the bank could turn up and remove the items at any given time.

Hi Mathepac, the representative provided a brief list of items. I did not receive a copy of this or a list of items they claim is there's. They did say the serial number on the items was the match of the serial number they had on file. I received no list of what these items were.

I volunteered the information that I had purchased the stuff from the previous tenant.

As regards the statement I did receive; well this did hold information about the previous tenant.

I cannot contact the person by telephone but he is in contact with the bank and has denied that money exchanged hands between he and I. He has told the bank that he is in liquidation and they are more than welcome to collect the items.
 
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