Health Insurance Family of five moving back to Ireland - what health insurance cover?

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Green in Wien

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Myself, wife, and three kids moving back to Ireland from abroad for good in a few months. I am looking at health insurance plans and despite looking at the price comparison websites and key posts on AAM I am pretty much lost. I have next to no experience of the healthcare system in Ireland I can't make sense of all the options.

In general what I want is the best treatment for anything catastrophic but I'm willing to tolerate a high excess. I don't need to pay for a private room and unlikely near term to need orthapaedic or eye treatment.

Family details:
Me (41): Good health
Wife (43): underlying medical condition requiring 1-2 consultant visits per year, occasional blood tests
Child 1 (13): Good health but 2/3 way through orthodontic treatment
Child 2 (9): underlying medical condition requiring 1-2 consultant visits per year, occasional blood tests
Child 3 (6): Good health

We will both be public sector workers so there won't be an option for a work scheme. We'd like to avoid waiting periods for the pre-existing conditions but it's hard to know without going through scheme details if the condition would be covered and, if not, what the waiting periods would be like.

Lifetime community rating penalties shouldn't be an issue as we had VHI before we left Ireland in 2015 and will be able to prove evidence of continuous insurance cover after we left.

Grateful for any tips on what schemes would suit us best, or what to look for and what to avoid.
 
In Laya, consultant visits and GP visits (inc. blood tests) are covered under "everyday medical expenses". For these the pre-existing condition waiting time does not apply. Look out for a policy that pays 50% of these with an outpatient excess of €1.

If you're unsure about a policy ring Laya and ask if that one's the best for your family. From past experience I'd say the agents don't generally try to upsell.
 
A few points to consider:
Orthodontics won't be covered on a health insurance policy.
Kids don't have to be on the same level of cover as the adults.
It is very useful to have cover for everyday medical expenses. It's common to get 50% back on GP, consultant, physio, routine dental expenses and more. Some radiology is covered in full. I recently attended the Affidea minor injuries clinic and it was covered in full (I'm with Laya). There is an optical allowance every 2 years which is useful if you wear glasses.
 
From the HIA website:

Q: I am moving abroad for a period of time but I have held health insurance in Ireland up to now. Will I have to serve waiting periods when I return?

A: Health Insurance abroad is not taken into account for the purposes of waiting periods. However, a health insurer may waive the waiting period at their discretion, because the law imposes a maximum on waiting periods that an insurer may require, but no minimum. Some insurers routinely waive waiting periods if you have previously held health insurance in Ireland or if you were covered by certain types of health insurance while abroad.

Please check our section on Lifetime Community Rating if you will be 35 or older when you return, as a loading may apply to your premium.

Q: I currently hold health insurance abroad and I am returning to Ireland to live. Will my foreign health insurance be taken into account for waiting periods on Irish health insurance?

A: Health Insurers in Ireland are not obliged to take foreign health insurance into account. But see answer to the following question.

Additionally, if you are 35 or older when you move to Ireland you must purchase private health insurance within 9 months, otherwise, a Lifetime Community Rating Loading will be applied to your premium. This loading is 2% of the gross premium for every year over 34 that you have attained. The loading will be applied to your premium for 10 years.


If you were with VHI before my first step would be to call them, explaining your situation and see if they will waive the 5 year waiting period for pre existing conditions. You can ask each insurer this question. This would be a great thing to get. The other key thing would be to get onto the insurance before age loading gets applied.
 
Thanks for all the advice. I had tried the HIA tool but found it confusing but the Laya one is good. I think for my specific circumstances I will have to call the insurers directly to see what they can do on continuing cover.

One thing I am not really clear on is what "hi-tech hospitals" means. In practical terms does this mean any better treatment?
 
I think for your first policy back here I'd nearly be inclined to pay for advice, I agree it's very confusing compare on the HIA site as there is just so much. Once you have got what you want or as close as possible the first year then you will be better equipped to sort it out yourself on renewal.

I have never used the Dermot Goode service for this but it's worth looking at maybe?
 
This is a recent podcast with Dermot Goode.

spotify.link

Are you getting the most out of your health insurance?

Listen to this episode from The Pat Kenny Show Highlights on Spotify. Anton was joined by Dermot Goode of Total Health Cover to discuss health insurance cover now that all insurers have increased their rates and to find out if you are getting the most from your health insurance and more
spotify.link spotify.link
 
Green in Wien said:
One thing I am not really clear on is what "hi-tech hospitals" means. In practical terms does this mean any better treatment?
Click to expand...
From an Irish Life webpage:

The Blackrock Clinic, the Mater Private and the Beacon Hospital are the only three high-tech hospitals in Ireland. These are private hospitals with specialised equipment and they treat complex conditions including cardiac, oncology (cancer) and orthopaedic conditions.
 
becky said:
This is a recent podcast with Dermot Goode.

spotify.link

Are you getting the most out of your health insurance?

Listen to this episode from The Pat Kenny Show Highlights on Spotify. Anton was joined by Dermot Goode of Total Health Cover to discuss health insurance cover now that all insurers have increased their rates and to find out if you are getting the most from your health insurance and more
spotify.link spotify.link
Click to expand...
Reply we used a service when we returned to advise us - I think it was this guy. EUR250.

One thing to bear in mind that may have passed you by is that if you are being moved home by your company to a job in Ireland they may well propose & pay for a policy or if you are moving home to a new job the same may also occur.
Maybe you don't need to kill your self optimising this now if your employer will be putting forward a plan for you to join.
 
Many thanks for all the advice.

I have got quotes from Laya and Irish Life and am going through them both. I have to say I find it very hard to make informed comparisons and sort wheat from the chaff. For example two different Laya packages quote differing co-payments for eyebrow tattooing after cancer treatment.

The bigger problem is that Laya and Irish Life have both confirmed that they will not cover pre-existing conditions for the legal maximum of five years. In our circumstances that's likely to be a big cost. Irish Life Healthcare will at least waive the 26 week waiting period for new illnesses.

Both insurers confirmed LCR loadings at least won't be a problem as our cover in Ireland prior to leaving more than compensates for missing cover while abroad.

I am awaiting a callback from VHI for "reinstatement" of previous cover potentially (we were with them until 2018) so hopefully there is wiggle room on the preexisting conditions but I doubt it.

To cover a few other points:
  1. No option for employer cover, we are both public sector;
  2. Will consider using the comparison guy
 
Dermot Goode seems to be the only health insurance expert in Ireland.

In the OP's case I think it would be worthwhile paying a few bob.
 
I personally wouldn't recommend to spend €150 on advice and rather put that towards the insurance itself or savings towards medical costs.

Picking any corporate plan for your first year will likely set you up on solid foundations.

Check out : https://www.totalhealthcover.ie/special_offers
for a list of recommended plans to look into from each provider, updated monthly. They also have a free search tool on their website.

The key thing for you here is to see if VHI will waive the pre existing conditions rule. This would be very beneficial for you. I'm not surprised Laya and Irish Life have said no as they are for profit companies. They have done it when they bring new companies on their books to try attract employees to take them up, so they can do it, they're just choosing not to.

Also on the hia website if you select high day to day cover you'll filter in a lot of the corporate plans.
 
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VHI have confirmed that no cover for pre-existing conditions possible for five years. It seems all the insurers apply the legal maximum of five years waiting period here and all confirmed that there was zero room for negotiation. This seems hugely discriminatory to anyone immigrating to Ireland but sin scéal eile.

Starrynights said:
I personally wouldn't recommend to spend €150 on advice and rather put that towards the insurance itself or savings towards medical costs.
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I've no option for employer cover. TBH I'm tempted to pay €150 for advice. We could be spending €2k to €3k a year for the family and over the course of a few years I think €150 could be money very well spent. If I do I'll let you know how I get on.
 
Green in Wien said:
VHI have confirmed that no cover for pre-existing conditions possible for five years. It seems all the insurers apply the legal maximum of five years waiting period here and all confirmed that there was zero room for negotiation. This seems hugely discriminatory to anyone immigrating to Ireland but sin scéal eile.


I've no option for employer cover. TBH I'm tempted to pay €150 for advice. We could be spending €2k to €3k a year for the family and over the course of a few years I think €150 could be money very well spent. If I do I'll let you know how I get on.
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Thanks for confirming. That's terrible but I'm not too surprised either as VHI try sell their international health insurance as a way to ensure no new waiting periods when coming back to a VHI hospital plan in Ireland.

The fact that there is no help from a legislative perspective when returning to Ireland is a little unfair, especially if a person had been paying for health insurance for years or decades prior to leaving and haven't been away for very long.

Everyone has a different perspective on the value of paying for advice, it's a very personal choice. If you think it's for you then you have your answer. You're pre existing conditions won't be covered in hospital for 5 years now so they are irrelevant to the plan you choose until year 4. Then you can serve the two year waiting period for upgrading your plan ( for pre existing conditions) on year 4 and year 5. On year 6 you'll be fully covered, with the cover you want for those conditions. Day to day benefits will be covered at that start so they matter. The t&c's, price and level of cover change on plans regularly enough, so you won't know which plan will be best in 3 years time. I highly doubt you'll get very specific advice on the level of cover on plans for pre existing conditions from these advice services either but I'm not 100% sure. The insurers often keep this info to themselves so you usually need to contact them on a case by case basis to ask specifically if X procedures/diagnostic tests are covered on X plan. You'll likely get a breakdown of how to read the table of benefits on plans, the main things that might be of interest to you and a short list of good plans to match, which will probably contain the popular corporate plans. All info you could potentially get online, on AAM, on the HIA website and from the insurers. You'll just cut out the research time, which may be worth the money alone to you.

One thing to note is make to sure the advise is independent. It was noted a few times some advice brokers used to just recommend Irish Life plans as they were the only company to pay commission to brokers.
 
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