children's rights under intestacy

J

jodie100

Guest
Hi,

Hoping that somebody could also help me with this query, it's a bit complicated. If a father who has the family home in his name and inherited by will from his father and lived in it on his own before marriage dies intestate with young children, what is supposed to happen? I understand the property is shared 2/3 surviving spouse, 1/3 children, but not what is supposed to happen in practice.

In my case I was one of the children but nothing ever happened re this. Is it correct that the mother can have sole charge as the children are under age and receive all the income from the property( as there was rental land involved as well as the house)? Should the children have had anybody else to look after their interests, or received any part ownership when they came of age? Finally is it correct when the children are of age that the mother can sell the property against their wishes, even though one of them has become unable to provide for themselves due to becoming ill while still at college, and is it correct the sale can go through with no signatures from the children?

Thanks for any help, I may be worrying about nothing but unfortunately my mother has proven unreliable about other issues, and now I am worried about this, especially as I am certain my father never intended her to sell the home ( his siblings were shocked that she did).

Jodie
 
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I think you need to take urgent legal advice.

If what you suggest is true - and the 2/3 to 1/3 intestate division seems to be correct - then you may have suffered an unjust loss on the sale if you did not profit by it and it was sold against your clearly stated wishes.

This begs the question as to why you let the sale proceed if you were of age.
It also raises queries about what occurred with the proceeds of any sale.

I don't know what rights your mother may have had until you came of age in relation to using the income from your share.

If she used it to raise you, that seems reasonable.

Historically, your portion of the land was probably your mothers to mind for you until you came of age, but than it may have become yours in law once you reached your eighteenth birthday.

I don't know if there was a procedure you had to go through to claim your title.

If the money from the land was significant, i.e. there was money surplus to her requirements to raise you and she didn't save it on your behalf but either used it to enrich herself or frittered it away unwisely, you may have a case, but allow me to urge caution.

Don't just take advice from a solicitor because you appear to have implied that there are wider dimensions to all this than you are saying here.

I am assuming that your mother raised her family after the death of your father on her own.

Money can be cold comfort in such a situation, where the lack of adult companionship and the inability to share the travails of raising a family can weigh heavily on a lone parent.

Your mother may have been thinking of providing for her own last years with the sale, in the absence of having a pension fund set up by her spouse to fall back on.

The falling ill, unlooked for, of one of her children in what should have been the prime of her life may have upset your mother's plans.

You should take counselling from a friend or professional experienced in handling family land disputes, because these can be bitter, lengthy and seldom leave any of the participants feeling good about themselves afterwards.

Hope this helps.
 
Sorry, forgive me doing this but I need to be clear on your post. Let me see if I understand the background :
​

  • Your late father was a beneficiary of his father's will and inherited a dwelling house and land from him.
  • Your late father lived in / on this property for a number of years prior to his marriage.
  • He married your mother and they had children together and you are one of the children.
  • Your parents and siblings lived in the dwelling house as your family home
  • Before any of the children reached their majority, your father died without making a will.
Is this correct so far?
 
Hi,

Thanks for the replies.

Yes, mathepac, what you have outlined is correct.

onq, it was through a combination of youth/immaturity ( even though I was of age) naievety and being chronically ill at the time that I let the sale proceed on the basis of what my mother told me she could do,( probably I couldn't have stopped it anyway) and yes, you are right in thinking that it is a broader issue than just these legal points. I may be confusing my feelings about things with what was or wasn't legally permissible, but I do think that morally it was wrong. (Also I don't want to come across as unfeeling about my mother but unfortunately myself, my siblings and my father were all treated very badly by her always even though we did everything for her.)

Jodie
 
In a case of intestacy the regular thing would be for someone to take out a grant of administration over the estate AFAIK.

This may or may not have happened in your case and may or may not have been your mother. If someone did and a grant of probate was extracted, there will be a record in the probate office.
 
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jodie100 said:
Hi,

Thanks for the replies.

Yes, mathepac, what you have outlined is correct.

onq, it was through a combination of youth/immaturity ( even though I was of age) naievety and being chronically ill at the time that I let the sale proceed on the basis of what my mother told me she could do,( probably I couldn't have stopped it anyway) and yes, you are right in thinking that it is a broader issue than just these legal points. I may be confusing my feelings about things with what was or wasn't legally permissible, but I do think that morally it was wrong. (Also I don't want to come across as unfeeling about my mother but unfortunately myself, my siblings and my father were all treated very badly by her always even though we did everything for her.)

Jodie
Click to expand...

Jodie,

This is all perfectly understandable.

Only since being married myself and listening to other married people have I come to understand the often complex relationships that can exist between mothers and daughters.

:)

mathepac seems to have offered you pertinent legal advice on the matter, and I have nothing to add to it except to say that speed is seldom a function of the law in this area.

My father made a will and I have no siblings, but processing the inheritance still took nearly two years or so.

If you are going to pursue this, following the money seems to be the easiest course of action to me, a relative layperson, using court orders to search bank accounts and the like.

I hope your own siblings of like mind and will they work with you to trace the proceeds of the sale and share legal costs if it comes to that.

Because otherwise it may be a very lonely furrow you'll be ploughing.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do.
 
I stand corrected here, but the house being the family home, was most likely in both names and on the death of one spouse, title goes soley to surviving spouse, Family Home Act applying here ?
As far as I am aware the 2/3 to surviving spouse and 1/3 to children only applies in the case where the asset was in sole name of deceased person when a will was not in place. If this is the case, the decision to sell the house was totally within your mothers rights.
When an asset is in both names, title passes to surviving spouse.


As I say in the outset, I stand corrected on this.


Secman
 
As has been said, you need proper legal advice.

If the house belonged to your father, then I dont understand how your mother was
able to sell it as how would she show that she owned it ?

If your father signed half the house over to her, then she would have inherited it outright on his death, will or no will.

These are the issues which you need to find out details on.

Good luck, and I hope the whole thing does not stress you too much.
 
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