Wife secretly giving money to in-laws

Age: 34
Spouse’s/Partner's age: 32
Self monthly net income from employment – 5,000 after tax
Spouse monthly net income – nil – Stay at home mother
Type of employment: private sector, permanent.

In general are you: (a) spending more than you earn, or (b) saving? Spending
Rent 1,200pm, Childcare 200pm, Food & Utilities 1,200pm, Supporting parents 1,200pm
Other borrowings – car loans/personal loans etc - None
Do you pay off your full credit card balance each month? Yes
Savings and investments: 10,000 in joint account
Do you have a pension scheme? I do, through work
Do you own any investment or other property? No
Ages of children:4
Life insurance: No

What specific question do you have or what issues are of concern to you?
Before we married my spouse was looking after her mother (currently aged 50) and brother (currently aged 20) and I was looking after my parents (aged 66 and 76). I did not enquire how much she gave them as it was none of my business (bad mistake 1).

When we married, we were both working. We contributed our salary to a joint account, gave each other a monthly no-questions-asked allowance of 200 each per week (it was the boom –(bad mistake 2)) We agreed from the joint account to give her parents 600pm and my parents 600pm. Unknown to me, from her no-questions-asked-allowance she was giving her parents an extra 400pm

When we had our son, we worked out that with day care costs etc, (our parents are not in Dublin) it would be better if wife should stay at home. That worked fine for a year until mother-in-law came for a visit and saw my payslip. She was “shocked that we were only helping with 600 when I earned 5,000 and we had heaps in the bank. Don’t I know it is a recession and we should all pull together to get through”

So over the past few months she has been putting pressure on wife to help more. 100 for this 100 for that. Everything seems life-threatening and an emergency. After it reached 1,500 pm. I put my foot down and said no more. It is going back to 600 pm.

They now hate me.

The last few months, we have been dipping into our savings. I couldn’t figure out why until I discovered deposits slips. My wife is still sending them money! I don’t know what to do. I need to resolve this. I could

1) Pretend I did not notice. There is more to life than money.
2) Be more understanding, that they were on 1,000pm before we had a child
3) Confront my wife and put in steps to stop it. I don’t know what steps. (An allowance and expenses log book??)
4) Confront my mother-in-law and basically destroy any hope of any further relationship. Demand that mother-in-law keep an expenses log book?
5) Divorce. If I stay married I will be broke
I really can’t sleep at night. At this rate our savings will be gone by mid next year. We don’t even have a deposit for a house.
Any advice will be appreciated

Why does your wife's mother need money? Does she not have her own income. What about the 20 year old, does he not have a job or he in education? Is his mother not responsible for him apart from the fact that he is an adult?

Either put your foot down now or live to regret the consequences. This is lunacy to a new extreme. Simply take your own savings and your wages and lodge them in a different Bank with only you as signatory. Put you missus on a budget which she will have to keep to. You married your wife - not your in laws.

Agree with mercman above, as sole earner put money into an account only you can access. Work out an amount to cover mortgage, bills, household expenses and out of whats left give your wife an allowance. Give a set amount to parents/inlaws if you wish. Dont deviate from the amounts agreed and set.
Dont worry about your MIL hating you - its not her youre married to.

What income has the MIL? She must be in receipt of something? If she is only 50 why cant she get a part time job?

this is the weirdest topic ever.

1. why do ye have to give any money to anyone? its as simple as that, you earn about 100k a year, but you only have one salary so you need that money to have a family etc

2. you need to confront your wife, if she wont listen or accept anything then you need to decide if you want to remain married

I think the threat of a 0 euro a month allowance might buck up the MIL idea's.

She is 50 , why isn't she working ?

I think this is dreadful and you have my sympathies for being in this position.

You need to help your wife find her feet as an adult and say no to her parents.
The demanding nature of your mother in law must be stopped flat.

Financial obligations to older people are never an easy call, but you have to look to the future and provide for your family now and your retirement later.
There seems to be an older generation quite capable of living beyond their own means and sucking everyone else dry with hand outs.
What position will you be in when you're retiring because money you should have put into savings or a pension fund went to them?

All extra-marital payments should be stopped immediately for six months to let you get back on your feet and everyone else needs to cut their cloth to suit their measure.
Take control of the finances and make sure your wife will support you through this and prevent unannounced calls from the M.I.L.-itary wing of her family.

Supporting a 20-year old brother in law?
Unless he's studying to better himself AND committed to paying you back in time - what are you at?

You have your family to support, you are doing well and fair play to you, but all the little cuts allow significant financial bleeding.
You didn't marry your mother in law or your brother in law - you married your wife and you are committed to her and your son.
These are the responsibilities you took on when you married your good lady wife, not supporting her extended family.
Or yours for that matter and this is an important point to remember.

I'm sure these are all nice people but on the face of it there appears to be a "whats mine is mine and what's yours is mine" attitude here.
By all means support your in-laws to a degree - given the precedent on both sides - but you as sole breadwinner have to balance the books and set the amounts.
I'll be surprised if your wife doesn't need a LOT OF HELP seeing it this way, but you must grasp that nettle firmly if tenderly and deal with it.
Her mother may be manipulating her more than you know and you have to as I said beforem help your wife to deal with this.
Do not create some sort of "opposite pole" scene where she is torn between you and her mother.
Make it clear that you are annoyed about the amount that's been leaving your household.

And be extremely even handed, no special amounts for your folks either, otherwise you will end up undermining your marraige.

This isn't a chauvinistic thing, BTW, you need to review your level of support to your folks as well - why do they need all this money?
Cut them all off, explain you're saving for a deposit for your house and that's it.
After that you'll be paying the mortgage, so no going back.

The good times for the in-laws are over.
Good luck with it.

ONQ.

MIL came for a visit and "saw your payslip"?

Either she went snooping or your wife showed it to her.

If banning your MIL from your house is not an option, I suggest a lockable filing cabinet for your personal papers.

Why are you giving your own parents 600 a month? Do they not have pensions? Are you still giving your parents 600 a month.
Can both sets of parents not sell their houses and rent if they have debts? Or are they council tenants?

Is this a wind up ? Nobody could be so gullible with their money.. surely

You need to sit down with your wife and look at the annual figure you are giving both your parents and her parents - I think the annual figure will make her see the reality of the situation a bit more easily. i don't think you should redirect your salary until you have had this discussion but equally I absolutely don't think you should be pyaing an income to two sets of parents out of your one household income.

Tough if they hate you. So pay for thier friendship ?? Just stop allowing your wife taking the money from the account. And if this means moving Bank just do it.

I agree with Mercman but also feel that your inlaws have no respect for you and I would be outraged if they looked at my payslip.
I'm sorry but they have crossed a line here and you need to stop it.

Utter Madness, "you all need to pull together to get through". You are at the early stages of your life, no house yet, which will be your greatest ever expense and should be saving towards this if you want to own one.

Absolutely agree with the other posters, your MIL is not your responsibility and providing any support is admirable - in my opinion even €600 per month is a huge amount. Would need to know why the support is needed as others have mentioned. Same for your own parents, Support payment totalling min €1200 per month - Does the MIL know you are helping out both sides?

FYI My own father recenty had a botched hip replacement operation and at 62 has been incapacitated - this has left my parents 3 years short of expected income to retirement and their pensions worthless as had not changed to low risk options soon enough. Which means they suddenly find themselves without sufficient funds to live. As yet I have not got involved (our combined income would be around 150k), even if I do, I dont see me stretching to €600 and besides they wouldn't dream of pressuring me for any help, I have my own outgoings...

A point to note is that your wife may not be aware of the implications that these payments mean you are spending beyond your means - as you will see from these forums, finance is not a subject everyone grasps.

As mentioned above, filter your salary into your sole account and transfer only enough to the joint to cover mortgage and household bills. Advise your wife that you need to take control of the finances before you all end of on the street, you have a young child and your future (hopefully) together to think about.

Contuinue by all means an affordable amount to both parents - which I would keep equitable - this should help the MIL appreciate the amount

Looking at the bright side, once you do sort it out - you wont be welcome I assume at the mother in laws house - wish I had that problem!

Paddy

Point out to your wife the gross value of the money you're paying over to the in-laws this will show how ludicrous the situation is. 1500pm is actually the guts of 3k gross!

I suppose we really need more details, this would have been common in Ireland in the past and still is on other cultures which don't have a welfare state/system.

For example the two of then could be getting approx 22,000 from the state + 18,000 from you. That is 40,000 Tax Free per year!

BTW is it still possible to use a Deed of Covenant to give money tax free?

A few questions for OP:

1. How many children in your wife's family?

2. How many children in yours?

3. Do your parents need your financial support or is it just that you were raised that way and it is expected of you ( and that you are glad to give it)?

4. Does mother in law need financial support? What are her means?

I would be wary of cutting your wife off from access to your earnings and giving her an allowance. Previously, you both worked. You have now agreed that she would stay home. So if you now take control of 'your' earnings, it may feel a bit dictatorial from your wife's perspective.

Perhaps you can achieve the same result by different means. Maybe you could set up a standing order out of your wages into some sort of savings plan, which cannot easily be unlocked\liquidated?

If the money is already gone to the savings plan, it is not there to be given to the in-laws.

Unless your in-laws are people of very modest means and with no real concept of money, it is difficult to understand how your mother in law could in good faith hold the views which she has expressed. She is being wholly unreasonable- but good old fashioned repression and avoidance is not to be ignored as a solution here: you don't always have to prove you are right; just conserve your finances by the least-conflict route available.

EDIT: Reading Paddyodoors post, and on reflection, there are undoubtedly some marriages where both spouses are happy for one or other of them to assume control of finances. IF your wife is happy to let you take control ( and she may secretly want this, if only to relieve her of pressure from her mother) then by all means do so. But tread carefully.

Thanks very much for all the feed back. I will go with the majority rule, and open another account with only me as a signature.

To give insight into why we started supporting the old folks - My parents have been retired for the past 10 years. Pensions aren’t that great. It covers just the basics. I thought it is bad that we live as middle class and the old folks live as lower class. Beers in the pub didn’t taste so good when I knew they were scrimping. I thought only a fool parties while his relatives suffer. 600 per month is not a lot. It is only €75 per week each. My parents are grateful. They use it for car repairs, the occasional night out .... basically the middle class life style.

Wife’s mother, on the other hand, took a voluntary retrenchment in 2003 and blew the cash living an upper class lifestyle. Now the cash has run out and there are no jobs. Same with the 20 year old brother. He saw no need to work hard in school. Failed his leaving cert twice. Now he can’t find a job.

Last weekend we had another argument when I told my wife to tell her mother if she needs cash, she should sell the family silver. Lots of “Cash for Gold” adverts on telly.

I don’t like how money (or spending thereof) has changed me. I am now too judgemental. In the past, I wouldn’t care who did what. Now I am paranoid…. “What!!! You had steak for dinner!!! I am working too hard for you to have steak. What’s wrong with chicken!!!”. ….. So sad

I will open the new account give an update on how things develop

Thanks again for the feedback. I really appreciate it.

Neo said:

I don’t like how money (or spending thereof) has changed me. I am now too judgemental. In the past, I wouldn’t care who did what. Now I am paranoid…. “What!!! You had steak for dinner!!! I am working too hard for you to have steak. What’s wrong with chicken!!!”. ….. So sad

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You sound like a very generous person to me , it's not you that has been changed.

Hi there,
I understand your plight - my FIL and step MIL blew a fortune and have run out of money. Now we are not in a place where we can help them out with our own expences. Mr. Bear is generous in that he takes his dad places and buys him dinners out and things like that..

My step MIL would makes jokes about how much money we had despite the fact that I was working 3 jobs while trying to save for a house!!!

This will be a bone of contention but your wife must understand that your mum must take responcibility for her own finances and deal with the fact that she has no money..

You both sound really lovely people, but dont let yourself be taken advantage of...