greenfield
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On a point of info, Doctors are not exempt from OWT, there was a phasing period to allow its introduction in hospitals. I am not sure if Ireland is compliant yet but the law does apply to Doctors.
Leave and get another job.If you don't know about it, and its not in the contract, but the employee takes the job, then afterwards realises that working beyond the agree hours is expected what then?
The phasing period is alive and well.On a point of info, Doctors are not exempt from OWT, there was a phasing period to allow its introduction in hospitals. I am not sure if Ireland is compliant yet but the law does apply to Doctors.
So you are in favour of penalising the majority, treating them like children because of the few who are incapable of behaving like adults?I think the law has to work for the lowest common denominator, and for eveveryone.
Some inept and/or stupid people will always be screwed over. The state is not your Mammy, it should not be expected to act like it is.Do you think that no explotation goes on in this day an age? IMO its alive and well.
Some inept and/or stupid people will always be screwed over. The state is not your Mammy, it should not be expected to act like it is.
So you are in favour of penalising the majority, treating them like children because of the few who are incapable of behaving like adults?
Some inept and/or stupid people will always be screwed over. The state is not your Mammy, it should not be expected to act like it is.
I find that if you treat people like children they tend to behave like children and if you treat them like adults they tend to behave like adults.
I don't like laws that tell me what I can or cannot do in situations where I act freely and have no negative impact on others. I'm a liberal, I am in favour of personal liberty.
So what is your opinion?I never expressed an opinion for or against.
That facile. The point is that the government has already restricted the way in which people can choose to work in most of the economy.But like you said people are free to move job why not move to a job thats doesn't come under the act? or move to a job that earns more for less hours. Your free to do that.
So can going on holidays. Should that be banned as well?The problem with exploitive behavior especially with regard to working extra or overtime hour is that it may have a negative impact on others. You are ignoring that possibility.
But this aspect of how the state interferes in the basic day to day decisions that we are allowed to make is not beyond the scope of this thread.A debate about the [SIZE=-1]responsibility [/SIZE]of the state to its citizens would be far ranging and perhaps beyond the scope of this thread no?
It's meant to be a free country. If people don't like their job they are free to get another one. There are all sorts of areas that should and are regulated and legislated for to protect people in their place of work. I simply do not think the length of time they choose to spend at work should be one of them.As for treating people like adults. Some don't even treat people like people. Hence the act.
The problem with exploitive behavior especially with regard to working extra or overtime hour is that it may have a negative impact on others.
Purple - both the employer and employee are liable if there is a breach on rest breaks etc. However, the employer can defend themselves on the basis that they did not know, or by reasonable enquiry could have known about the second job.
So what is your opinion?
That facile. The point is that the government has already restricted the way in which people can choose to work in most of the economy.
So can going on holidays. Should that be banned as well?
But this aspect of how the state interferes in the basic day to day decisions that we are allowed to make is not beyond the scope of this thread.
It's meant to be a free country. If people don't like their job they are free to get another one. There are all sorts of areas that should and are regulated and legislated for to protect people in their place of work. I simply do not think the length of time they choose to spend at work should be one of them.
If a person has a second job but doesn't tell either of their employers is one or both of them liable for breaching the act?
Without working long hours I could not have bought my first home and all that followed would not have been possible.
This act penalises a person wants to work hard and get on in life. That's just not right.
If this is correct, it surely applies both to employees and the self-employed. Yet the latter are free to work as long as they want while the former are prohibited from doing so. This doesn't make sense.
Why not?
No, what's your opinion of the working time act? Do you think it is right that our government legislates in this way? Do you accept that it restricts our right to free choice?You're only seeing one side, because its to your advantage.
No it's not, I cannot choose to work more hours in most jobs because the government has taken that choice away from me. They have restricted my ability to make a living.Its the same point you made. You can just move jobs if you don't like the hours. As if lifes that simple for everyone.
I was not aware of legislation that restricts the maximum amount of holidays that one can take. Can you post a link please?Holiday leave IS regulated aswell. Overtime isn't banned (AFAIK) its regulated and limited.
The working time act is the example of the state acting in a maternalistic way which is being discussed here.Debating should the state act as mammy is a different topic than should we have opted in to the EU working act.
Yes, but we didn't have to agree to it. That's the issue.AFAIK its not like Ireland drafted this. This is an EU directive that we agreed to.
Really? Can you expand on that point please?Employers and employees could agree to opt out, but that was abused so they changed it.
This thread was split from another. I did not post title.
No, that was me trying to be provocative!
This can also happen if the employee stays up late at night watching TV. Should the state regulate what time PAYE workers should go to bed at? It seems self employed people are adults and don't need to be told how to run their lives so they are in the clear.Occupational health is the reason for the WTA. If employees worked too many hours over a long period of time without adequate rest, they will eventually have a breakdown or serious health issue.
I do not share this view, it is not my experience. Can you back it up with facts?WTA saves the taxpayers money.
Labour flexibility is essential for any successful business. There are many reasons why overtime increases efficiencies and reduces unit costs but this is about the right of an adult in a free country to work when they want to work. There are many things that would make economic sense but are unacceptable in a free country.If a firm has most of its employees on regular overtime, then why dont they just hire more staff? Could even be cheaper if employees get premium rates for overtime.
No, what's your opinion of the working time act? Do you think it is right that our government legislates in this way? Do you accept that it restricts our right to free choice?
I was not aware of legislation that restricts the maximum amount of holidays that one can take. Can you post a link please?
The working time act is the example of the state acting in a maternalistic way which is being discussed here. ....Yes, but we didn't have to agree to it. That's the issue.
Really? Can you expand on that point please?
Employers do not force workers to take holidays and breaks they are entitled to, so that staff could still in theory work 24 hours a day 365 days a year.
In the UK, employees can volunteer to work more than 48 hours a week, and so can work unlimited hours.
This "comprehensively undermines the intent of the directive", Amicus says.
Overtime hours for UK workers on night shifts are excluded from the overall 48-hour week count.
This can also happen if the employee stays up late at night watching TV. Should the state regulate what time PAYE workers should go to bed at? It seems self employed people are adults and don't need to be told how to run their lives so they are in the clear.
Labour flexibility is essential for any successful business. There are many reasons why overtime increases efficiencies and reduces unit costs but this is about the right of an adult in a free country to work when they want to work. There are many things that would make economic sense but are unacceptable in a free country.
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