And to slightly modify the example again, what if the value drops after deemed disposal exit tax is paid? How does the edit tax rebate feed into the CAT tax calculation?
It makes no mention of interactions with CAT.Page 5 of the document I attached.
Is the “deemed” charge on each 8th plan anniversary an additional charge?
No, it is not; it is simply a prepayment of tax. For example if you cash in your plan on the 9th anniversary, the tax you pay at that stage will be reduced by the amount of tax you paid on the 8th anniversary. Also, where the tax payable on a subsequent encashment is lower than the tax deducted on the 8th anniversary, Irish Life will refund you the ‘overpaid’ tax. Either way there is little change to the overall tax you will pay on your investment.
It makes no mention of interactions with CAT
Logic would suggest to me
Is this so? I downloaded this from the CSO here on all financial assets excluding pension assets.Most people won't have share portfolios that they intend holding until after they die.
Statistic | Year | Age of Reference Person | Type of Financial Asset | Unit | Value |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
Participation in total financial assets | 2020 | 65 years and over | Bonds or Mutual Funds | % | 16.5 |
Participation in total financial assets | 2020 | 65 years and over | Shares | % | 10.1 |
Median values of financial assets | 2020 | 65 years and over | Bonds or Mutual Funds | Euro | 18,400 |
Median values of financial assets | 2020 | 65 years and over | Shares | Euro | 3,600 |
Distribution of total financial assets | 2020 | 65 years and over | Bonds or Mutual Funds | % | 21.8 |
Distribution of total financial assets | 2020 | 65 years and over | Shares | % | 6.7 |
Isn't this slightly contradicted by this?You should not plan your own finances based on averages or based on the government's take from a particular tax.
Aren't you arguing that people should do that very thing - i.e. choose the investment option that minimises the tax take?If you are aged 65 and planning your finances, you should not have investments in a life fund under current rules. Your gains will be subject to exit tax.
If you have the same amount directly in a portfolio of shares, the capital gains will disappear on death.
This strategy may change if the government changes the rules but for now, this is the correct strategy.
Brendan
Thanks @Brendan Burgess - I eventually understood your point and updated my post to reflect this.Dr Strangelove had a post which showed that the average size of funds was small and the tax take was small.
My point is that this is not relevant to an individual's tax and investment planning.
If the average portfolio is €3,600, then the "average advice" would be that it doesn't matter what you do.
But if you have €1m to invest, then the average advice is irrelevant to you.
Brendan
"Correct" is subjective to the individual.If you are aged 65 and planning your finances, you should not have investments in a life fund under current rules. Your gains will be subject to exit tax.
If you have the same amount directly in a portfolio of shares, the capital gains will disappear on death.
This strategy may change if the government changes the rules but for now, this is the correct strategy.
Lucy is deemed to have received a taxable inheritance of €150,000 from which €20,500, Exit Tax, has been deducted.
The Inheritance Tax liability is calculated based on the ‘gross value’ i.e. €150,000, on which the estimated Inheritance Tax
liability at 33% is €49,500. This amount can then be reduced by ‘offsetting’ the ‘Exit Tax’ of €20,500 (in this example)
which has been deducted.
Maybe I'm a bit slow today but how have you come to this conclusion? Does the beneficiary not end up in exactly the same position ?Summary
1) Invest in a life product at age 65 and you will have a tax liability.
2) Invest in shares and your CGT liability will disappear on death.
Your beneficiaries may have a lower CAT liability on death if you invest in a life product, but that is because they are inheriting less.
Maybe I'm a bit slow today but how have you come to this conclusion? Does the beneficiary not end up in exactly the same position ?
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