The single family demographic for HAP and social welfare - sad problem to fix

Came across a group online recently with subject of HAP, rent, and landlords.

The number of participants who are single parents (mums in 100% of observation)

Many share an insight into their story in their questions, and it is sad to read.

Being alone is incredibly hard, and limits that persons ability to secure good employment. Then there is the child's life too. In many cases (yes not all) the children will suffer from not having two parents - be it education, financial, or criminality data points. All that comes with cost to the tax payer too. A big mess.

Amongst some of the sad stories there is also many with a huge sense of entitlement from the state - aka the tax payer. The sense of entitlement some have to pick and choose from what little accommodation is available - it should not be allowed but it is. If people get an offer of accommodation in this environment they should be forced to accept it unless a grade 1 reason not to. They should go to the bottom of the long lists.

In a way building more houses to cater for more people in this demographic is just a short term sticking plaster at best, and at worse it is encouraging more people not to fight like hell to stand on their own feet. Why would you when the council provide new build houses in some of the best postcodes in Ireland?

But what can be done?

The blunt reality is people should not have children until they are financially capable of supporting themselves and a child, and children shouldn't be an income stream or a tool for a free house from the tax payer.

The government do push sexual education, there is free contraception for men and women. I don't know if the data shows any ROI on this? Suspect not?

Broken families and single parents is perhaps just one dynamic that I have latched onto, maybe I am doing that incorrectly? Yet, without having a baby the individual has a chance to educate and get themselves onto a reasonable income, many are condemned to living off benefits once the baby arrives...

I see no way that the demographic in need of support doesn't expand in the next 30 years. Those that sit slightly above the thresholds will be the prime group to immigrate - as can't get a house handed to them extremely cheap, nor can they earn enough to sustain a positive trajectory. A symptom also of the first generation in many generations to be poorer than parents.

So what brave dial turning steps can realistically be done? Some how there needs to be policy which drives behaviours - that logic doesn't seem to be at full potential.

I suspect that most single parents are only thus for the purposes of claiming State supports and accessing state funded housing. I work with a large number of men who live with their partners and children but that partner claims lone parent supports.

As long as the State financially penalises the nuclear family and provides massive financial incentives for mothers to remain single it will be thus.

Have you been binging on the Daily Mail??

Now, in fairness, a fair few of them are not single mothers out of choice.

Also the stats don't necessarily back this up

First step to me is to make it far easier to force the father to pay up, regardless of whether the mother wants him involved or not.

thedaddyman said:

First step to me is to make it far easier to force the father to pay up, regardless of whether the mother wants him involved or not.

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Yes, the State should make the application for maintenance. The process should be streamlined. Temporary assistance only should be applied until the case is settled.

Children's allowance capped at 4 children.

OPFP used to be paid until the child was 18.

Now, to get the One-Parent Family Payment (OFP) you must have at least one child under 7 years of age.

In other countries, this type of payment would stop earlier.

Knuttell said:

Children's allowance capped at 4 children.

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I am not sure how many have more than 4 children and what difference this cap does or would make.

The damage is done for many once they elect to bring one child into the world on a single or no income one parent household - the mother faces time out of workforce, massive childcare costs, and an inability to house themselves. Getting back into the workforce if they were there becomes harder thereafter the spiral. I guess once in that hard place accepting it and having another kid may support higher state support and chances of the better accommodations??

How are other countries avoiding this spiral of cost and entitlement (in many not all quarters), and how do we ensure those that want to be helped can be helped while limiting hand outs to those who make a profession out of gaming the system.

I am really unsure that the model to provide councils houses in every estate as opposed to concentrated areas truly helps lift people up? Is integration with better ways of living and staying in education happening, or does state provided housing in better neighbourhoods and expensive houses just provides even less incentive to fight for a better future when people learn what can be had from the state?

I think I remember reading a few years ago that Ireland had the 2nd highest number of lone parent families in Europe. And we were way above (former) Catholic countries like Italy, Spain etc. I've never seen a satisfactory explanation for this - so the only conclusion you can come to is that it is incentivised in some ways by the system.

Edit: found the article below:

presidenttttt said:

How are other countries avoiding this spiral of cost and entitlement (in many not all quarters),

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Someone would have to establish the entitlements in other countries.

CSO stats are here. Interesting to see the rise in single fathers with kids.

EU stats are also interesting in that we are above the EU average but below quite a few countries


Other stats indicate that 60% of lone parents are working to some degree, implying that the majority are not "milking the system". As children get older, that % working rises which is understandable. However a lot are in part time working, again the challenge of child minding.

Incidentally, the assumption that single parents jump to the top of the queue for social housing is an urban myth. Every council has it's own rules but those in unsafe/overcrowded and classed as homeless are normally first, followed by disabled or chronically ill.

Obviously someone will now say "I know someone....."

thedaddyman said:

Other stats indicate that 60% of lone parents are working to some degree, implying that the majority are not "milking the system". As children get older, that % working rises which is understandable. However a lot are in part time working, again the challenge of child minding.

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Most welfare is paid to working people. Just because someone is working that doesn’t mean they aren’t milking the system.
Most people want to work but if, as is frequently the case, both parents are living together and working but the mother is pretending to be a single parent and claiming supports accordingly then they are very much milking the system. The biggest benefit is not supports aimed specifically at children but access to HAP.

I would share that view, the children aspect was an observation of something that puts even more pressure on the HAP situation, where people in need of support go from needing a 1 bed apartment or even SHARED accommodation, to needing a 3 bed house worth 600,000 euro, and additionally the impact of the child is often that the individuals path to standing on their own two feet is limited, so they need that house for life not 6 months. Any incentivisation away from that is likely to benefit society and tax payers over time.