Just be careful over-estimating the money back.
1 - they will need to work out the correct or most apt margin. This will probably be the highest of the margins they had generally available. - Possibly as high as 2% and unlikely to be under 1.5%
I don't think so.Therefore, it is the margin on the day the mortgage loan started.
I don't think so.
If AIB had continued to offer a tracker product, albeit at an unattractive margin (say, ECB+4%), then that would have been the "prevailing rate" when your fixed-rate term came to an end. AIB's mistake was to withdraw their tracker product entirely.
In those circumstances, I think the "prevailing rate" has to be either (a) the margin most commonly offered by AIB on trackers immediately prior to their withdrawal of the product; or (b) the average margin applied on all outstanding trackers written by AIB.
I suspect either formulation comes out at around ECB+1%.
AIB said:the Tracker Interest Rate will be made up of two parts:
(a) the European Central Bank’s main refinancing operations minimum bid rate (the “ECB rate”) which is variable; and
(b) the Margin/Adjustment above the ECB rate, this will stay static throughout the life of the loan.
It most certainly did not! The interest option was changed, but the loan was still the loan. It wasn't a case that I (or anyone, for that matter) repaid the original loan and then took out another, separate loan.Yes but the life of the tracker rate loan came to an end when you decided to switch to a fixed-rate product.
But the original loan agreement could not predict what the "prevailing tracker rate" would amount to. The tracker rates are variable. They consist of the ECB rate (variable) and a fixed margin, again that is static for the life of the loan.It's the "prevailing" tracker rate (however determined) at the end of your fixed-rate period that matters. Otherwise, the contract would have said that you simply revert to the tracker rate that applied to you immediately prior to switching to a fixed-rate product.
It makes a huge difference.In any event, it shouldn't really make a very material difference to you.
I certainly won't be settling for anything less.
My case is being handled (along with a whole bunch of others) by Padriac Kissane.
I have no problem with the word "then". That is correct, it is the "then" prevailing rate that is appropriate to the Mortgage Loan that should have been offered.Padraic has not said much publicly about these AIB cases.
3.2 FURTHER FIXED INTEREST RATE OPTIONS/CHOICE
At the end of any fixed interest rate period, the Customer may choose between: (a) a further fixed interest rate period, or
(b) conversion to a variable interest rate Mortgage Loan, or
(c) conversion to a tracker interest rate Mortgage Loan,
at the Bank's then prevailing rates appropriate to the Mortgage Loan.
I would be surprised if he is arguing that the word "then" means the start of the mortgage and not the "end of any fixed rate period" .
Even if he is arguing that, I would be astonished if he advised anyone whose case was turned down by the Ombudsman to go to the High Court.
Ok but the terms upon which you took out the loan were amended when you opted to fix so the terms of the loan that you originally drew down are irrelevant in relation to that element of the loan that you decided to fix. From that point, you were entitled to roll to "the then prevailing tracker rate". There was no express or implied entitlement to revert to your original tracker rate.The interest option was changed, but the loan was still the loan
Fair enough but I don't think there is any reality to that argument.The argument is, in the absence of any other definition for the "then prevailing rate appropriate to the loan", that the prevailing rate is whatever the then ECB rate is + a fixed margin.
Eh, 0.25% of €100,000 is only €250.€2,500 per €100,000 borrowed for every quarter of a percent difference
There is no other margin mentioned or any mention of the ability of the bank to alter said margin
Similarly, that provision of the original contract became irrelevant as soon as you amended the original contract in order to fix. From that point, a new contract came into being (i.e. the contract setting out the terms of your fixed-rate mortgage).Agreed. 3.6.3 (b) goes on to state that can't switch between tracker interest rates directly or indirectly to avail of a lower prevailing Tracker Margin.
Indeed, thousands of people benefitted in this way.So, if the "prevailing" tracker rate (i.e. the margin over the ECB refi rate) happened to be lower when the fixed term came to an end than the tracker rate at the time of the original drawdown, then you could have benefitted from that reduction.
Eh, 0.25% of €100,000 is only €250.
Well, it would be somewhat less than that as the principal outstanding reduced over the 10 years.Over 10 years it would €2,500...
Not on new mortgages it wouldn't. No point in arguing over it. No one will really know anything until everyone knows everything.Well, it would be somewhat less than that as the principal outstanding reduced over the 10 years.
Ok, I don't want us to go around in circles, so I will try to explain it another way and we can focus on the/any specific issue(s) that we disagree on.Ok but the terms upon which you took out the loan were amended when you opted to fix so the terms of the loan that you originally drew down are irrelevant in relation to that element of the loan that you decided to fix. From that point, you were entitled to roll to "the then prevailing tracker rate". There was no express or implied entitlement to revert to your original tracker rate.
I was referring to "over 10 years", as per Megafan's reply,Eh, 0.25% of €100,000 is only €250.
No, it’s a loan on completely different terms. The original contract is no more - it was replaced in its entirety as soon as you fixed.Am I right in saying that you now accept that is is not a new loan, but an amendment to the same loan?
Again, the original contract was replaced in its entirety when you fixed - you are relying on the term of a contract that no longer exists.If so, then the question is "what terms are being amended". I hope we can both agree that the only amendments are
I don’t follow. The principal balance, upon which interest is charged, amortises as the loan is repaid. That is the case with all mortgages - other than interest-only mortgages - new and old.Not on new mortgages it wouldn't. No point in arguing over it. No one will really know anything until everyone knows everything.
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