Brendan Burgess
Founder
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The Cheapest Irish Stockbroker
- Thread starter Brendan Burgess
- Start date
Re: Key Post: The Cheapest Irish Stockbroker
I decided to maybe update the original post by Brendan with today's figures. I deal with DBB, only recently transferred from Fexco, and having just done a few deals for small holdings last week, I was flabbergasted by the charges - I work out that Commission, Contract Charge, and Stamp Duty, I paid €315 on share sold with a value of €2,767 - an !!.38% charge. Anyway this is as much an education for me, as I hope it is for you.
Campbell O'Connor
1.5% on first €8,888 Minimum charge €25.40
Cost of €2000 deal: €30
Davys Online
Minimum commission €25
€0 - €25,000 0.75%
€25,001 and above 0.50%
Account Maintenance €40 twice per year.
Shares must be held in a nominee account - you can't have share certificates.
goodbodyonline 1.25% up to €25,000.Minimum €32.
Cost of €2,000 deal: €32
Shares must be held in a Goodbody nominee account - you can't have share certificates.
There is an annual maintenance charge of IR£20.
Dolmen Butler Briscoe
€0-€20k 1.65% on first €15,000. Minimum fee: €50
Cost of IR£2,000 deal: IR£40
BCP 1.5% on first €20,000.Minimum charge: €45 + €15 Admin fee.
Cost of IR£2,000 deal: IR£47
Bloxhams 1.65% on first €13,000. Minimum:€60
Cost of IR£2,000 deal: IR£47
Fexco
Many people (including myself) who have dealt with Fexco would not deal with them again no matter how cheap the deals were. It was an intensely frustrating experience. Their systems were so bad, that the Central Bank prohibited them from taking on new clients for over a year. For those of you willing to take the risk that things have changed, here are their charges as of May 2002:
Fexco sent me their love note last week informing me of their more attractive charges! Slightly unattractive!
The new rates are as follows:
Commission on € trades up to €9K: 1.25% (was 1%).
Minimum commission: €25. (was €15.87)
Admin charge: €7.50 (was €7.62)
Commission on $ trades up to $7K: 1.25% (was 1%).
Minimum commission: $20 (was $12.50)
Admin charge: $20 (was $6) <=4999 shares
Commission on Stg£ trades up to Stg£6.5K: 1.25% (was 1%).
Minimum commission Stg£20 (was Stg£12.50)
Admin charge: Stg£6 (was Stg£6)
Also, they are charging an annual charge of €40 (€20 payable twice yearly in March and September).
Stock transfers to another broker will be charged at €15/stock
I decided to maybe update the original post by Brendan with today's figures. I deal with DBB, only recently transferred from Fexco, and having just done a few deals for small holdings last week, I was flabbergasted by the charges - I work out that Commission, Contract Charge, and Stamp Duty, I paid €315 on share sold with a value of €2,767 - an !!.38% charge. Anyway this is as much an education for me, as I hope it is for you.
Campbell O'Connor
1.5% on first €8,888 Minimum charge €25.40
Cost of €2000 deal: €30
Davys Online
Minimum commission €25
€0 - €25,000 0.75%
€25,001 and above 0.50%
Account Maintenance €40 twice per year.
Shares must be held in a nominee account - you can't have share certificates.
goodbodyonline 1.25% up to €25,000.Minimum €32.
Cost of €2,000 deal: €32
Shares must be held in a Goodbody nominee account - you can't have share certificates.
There is an annual maintenance charge of IR£20.
Dolmen Butler Briscoe
€0-€20k 1.65% on first €15,000. Minimum fee: €50
Cost of IR£2,000 deal: IR£40
BCP 1.5% on first €20,000.Minimum charge: €45 + €15 Admin fee.
Cost of IR£2,000 deal: IR£47
Bloxhams 1.65% on first €13,000. Minimum:€60
Cost of IR£2,000 deal: IR£47
Fexco
Many people (including myself) who have dealt with Fexco would not deal with them again no matter how cheap the deals were. It was an intensely frustrating experience. Their systems were so bad, that the Central Bank prohibited them from taking on new clients for over a year. For those of you willing to take the risk that things have changed, here are their charges as of May 2002:
Fexco sent me their love note last week informing me of their more attractive charges! Slightly unattractive!
The new rates are as follows:
Commission on € trades up to €9K: 1.25% (was 1%).
Minimum commission: €25. (was €15.87)
Admin charge: €7.50 (was €7.62)
Commission on $ trades up to $7K: 1.25% (was 1%).
Minimum commission: $20 (was $12.50)
Admin charge: $20 (was $6) <=4999 shares
Commission on Stg£ trades up to Stg£6.5K: 1.25% (was 1%).
Minimum commission Stg£20 (was Stg£12.50)
Admin charge: Stg£6 (was Stg£6)
Also, they are charging an annual charge of €40 (€20 payable twice yearly in March and September).
Stock transfers to another broker will be charged at €15/stock
DrMoriarty
Moderator
- Messages
- 5,173
Re: Key Post: The Cheapest Irish Stockbroker
Sharewatch currently seem to be the cheapest, at 0.3% commission (minimum €30) for any trade — but I recall seeing some very negative comments here and elsewhere about the quality of their service, about a year ago. Anyone got any recent experience with them?
John, does this refer to your last trade with Fexco or your first with DBB? I was thinking of moving from Fexco, simply because I don't do enough trades to warrant the €40 annual fee.JohnGonne said:
Sharewatch currently seem to be the cheapest, at 0.3% commission (minimum €30) for any trade — but I recall seeing some very negative comments here and elsewhere about the quality of their service, about a year ago. Anyone got any recent experience with them?
DrMoriarty
Moderator
- Messages
- 5,173
Re: Key Post: The Cheapest Irish Stockbroker
I see that the RTE business show's website recently posted this useful [broken link removed] (.pdf format).
I see that the RTE business show's website recently posted this useful [broken link removed] (.pdf format).
[broken link removed] offer online share trading - execution only, with a minimum of EUR20.00, which I believe is lowest available in Irish Market. You probably have to open a custody account to transfer your de-materialised shares into. I haven't set one up as yet.....
Brokerage rates for securities trading
Charge
UK/Ireland
€ 0 - 15,000 0.75% minimum € 20
€ 15,000 - 30,000 0.50%
€ 30,000 - 150,000 0.40%
Nordic, Europe, US
€ 0 - 15,000 0.75% minimum € 20
€ 15,000 - 30,000 0.50%
€ 30,000 - 150,000 0.40%
Brokerage rates for securities trading
Charge
UK/Ireland
€ 0 - 15,000 0.75% minimum € 20
€ 15,000 - 30,000 0.50%
€ 30,000 - 150,000 0.40%
Nordic, Europe, US
€ 0 - 15,000 0.75% minimum € 20
€ 15,000 - 30,000 0.50%
€ 30,000 - 150,000 0.40%
tolkarovers
Registered User
- Messages
- 60
It depends on what you're buying. I'm buying some of the iseq 20 etf and these need to be held in a crest account. For this transaction goodbodys works out to be the cheapest (if not trading regularly) - 26 per annum fee, crest a/c is free, initial cost is higher but works out better in the long run.
Trebledigit
Registered User
- Messages
- 23
Since being taken over by Danske, NIB claim to be offering an online execution only dealing service (equities, not drugs !) with a minimum commission of €20 per deal. Only problem is that NIB themselves are not quite sure what they are offering and what their various commission rates cover. I've been on to them by phone twice and they promised to ring back with details but I've had no useful response yet. If they will do online deals in the Irish and UK market for €20, that would make them very competitive here (Mybroker.com also offers deals at £12.50 which is marginally less than €20 on conversion).
Anyone know what precisedly NIB are offering ?
Anyone know what precisedly NIB are offering ?
badgambler
Registered User
- Messages
- 40
Is that survey accurate?
These are much higher charges than those charged by online UK, Europe or US based brokers. For a € 10,000 euro deal, anywhere from €20-€50 is the norm and it is possible to find even lower !
Obviously, the small(?) retail investor is not wanted here in Ireland.
Obviously, the small(?) retail investor is not wanted here in Ireland.
C
cyberbunny
Guest
FWIW, some recent feedback on Sharewatch....sold some shares over 2 weeks ago and still awaiting the funds...on the same deal, the trader appeared to misunderstand the instruction requiring an additional buy contract to fill the deal and while the latter was only for a minor # shares, the commission costs/duty effectively doubled the transaction cost....certainly a caveat emptor for any future dealings......
The IFSRA stockbroker cost survey has provoked much comment here and in the press - Shane Ross in Sunday Indo for example - on the fact that charges in Ireland seem to be clearly at rip off levels compared to elsewhere. Can any of you more experienced posters say whether an Irish citizen and resident can use a foreign stockbroker to buy Irish and other stocks with a Euro denominated account?
Seems too simple a solution but perhaps it is available.
Seems too simple a solution but perhaps it is available.
F
fran1496
Guest
I use Sharewatch all the time and find them very efficient.I buy irish shares on an execution only basis.Commission is 0.3% and minimum trade is €30.I can access my portfolio at any time on the iNTERNET. I
hi folks,
could someone shed some light on the significance of this statement?
" Shares must be held in a nominee account - you can't have share certificates."
i see this in reference to many online dealing accounts. e.g. davy, goodbody.
what does it mean exactly?
if you're buying shares in the company, don't you own them after paying for them?
also, i am looking to buy shares in a couple of companies but would be a very small player eg. €2000 at a time.
who's the best dealer for small-timers like myself?
thanks alot
could someone shed some light on the significance of this statement?
" Shares must be held in a nominee account - you can't have share certificates."
i see this in reference to many online dealing accounts. e.g. davy, goodbody.
what does it mean exactly?
if you're buying shares in the company, don't you own them after paying for them?
also, i am looking to buy shares in a couple of companies but would be a very small player eg. €2000 at a time.
who's the best dealer for small-timers like myself?
thanks alot
kraggy said:
It means that rather than a physical share cert the Broker holds the shares in trust and instead you get a periodic statement saying that you own XX shares in XXX company. There is usually a charge for holding the shares in this manner. I suppose the concern would be what happens if the broker goes bankrupt, can you recover your shares.
stanbowles
Registered User
- Messages
- 28
Broker going belly up is one concern with nominee accts.
The other, frankly more probable, cause for concern with nominee accts is that the broker has the shares in their possession and charges to babysit those shares. This is useful lolly to the brokers and guarantees that in effect they have a continuing income stream in addition to / after the purchase or sales commission. The way they carry out this levy is often by taking a lump of your dividends, often in ways that are not especially clear to the shareholder.
Eg. I made the foolish mistake of purchasing shares in a large German telecom 5 yrs ago via NCB (Irish agents for this particular sharesale). All shares purchased by Irish customers are held in nominee accounts. Cut to five years later, in addition to the shares being worth less than 20% of what I paid for them (sh** happens), I receive an annual letter from NCB (Irish agents for this particular share sale) advising that I have x no of shares and then a certain small amount of cash in the account. No indication of where the cash has come from but of course it is dividends minus the NCB babysitting charge. You'd largely have to guess this as none of it is properly indicated. Moral: better to hold share certs. You get the dividend cheque - without undocumented deductions for negligible service. You decide on scrip dividend possibilities, etc, if available. You control your shareholdings.
Holding in a nominee acct also means that you, the shareholder, are pretty much constrained in terms of selling through the same brokers .... as they will charge you yet another fee to convert your nominee acct holding into transactable share certs should you choose to try and avail of better selling commissions at another broker.
I have not been active sharebuying for a number of years but my impression is that there is too small a market for Irish brokers to worry themselves about small customer needs. Fexco did shake up things a few years ago with good, cheap, execution only deals but appears to have altered its charging structure in line with many of the other SBs ... ie annual charge (FOR WHAT) to stay on their books, bigger fees.
Frankly, the best way to invest in the ISEQ is, IMHO, to put money into a Quinn Life Celtic Freeway tracker. Especially true if what you require is stockmarket exposure (generally a good thing) as well as the flexibility to cash in at short notice. What this offers is v.low charges and none of the hassle of having to build up a diversified portfolio. Buying shares is more long-term given that you are talking about a 4-5% spread when taking charges, stamp duties into account.
One final reflection on ISEQ share buying: one of the big advantages of share purchase is the possibility of scrip dividends. You forgo your dividends, receive shares in lieu, your shareholding in a company increases while, hopefully, the same also happens with the shareprice. Consequence: merry compounding of your initial outlay. As many companies are giving up or changing their scrip dividend scheme (AIB for eg.) and preferring to return cash to shareholders (no shortage of that for many ISEQ cos) rather than further dilute their shares, this is yet another reason that buying shares in ISEQ companies for the 'retail investor' is becoming less interesting.
Stan
The other, frankly more probable, cause for concern with nominee accts is that the broker has the shares in their possession and charges to babysit those shares. This is useful lolly to the brokers and guarantees that in effect they have a continuing income stream in addition to / after the purchase or sales commission. The way they carry out this levy is often by taking a lump of your dividends, often in ways that are not especially clear to the shareholder.
Eg. I made the foolish mistake of purchasing shares in a large German telecom 5 yrs ago via NCB (Irish agents for this particular sharesale). All shares purchased by Irish customers are held in nominee accounts. Cut to five years later, in addition to the shares being worth less than 20% of what I paid for them (sh** happens), I receive an annual letter from NCB (Irish agents for this particular share sale) advising that I have x no of shares and then a certain small amount of cash in the account. No indication of where the cash has come from but of course it is dividends minus the NCB babysitting charge. You'd largely have to guess this as none of it is properly indicated. Moral: better to hold share certs. You get the dividend cheque - without undocumented deductions for negligible service. You decide on scrip dividend possibilities, etc, if available. You control your shareholdings.
Holding in a nominee acct also means that you, the shareholder, are pretty much constrained in terms of selling through the same brokers .... as they will charge you yet another fee to convert your nominee acct holding into transactable share certs should you choose to try and avail of better selling commissions at another broker.
I have not been active sharebuying for a number of years but my impression is that there is too small a market for Irish brokers to worry themselves about small customer needs. Fexco did shake up things a few years ago with good, cheap, execution only deals but appears to have altered its charging structure in line with many of the other SBs ... ie annual charge (FOR WHAT) to stay on their books, bigger fees.
Frankly, the best way to invest in the ISEQ is, IMHO, to put money into a Quinn Life Celtic Freeway tracker. Especially true if what you require is stockmarket exposure (generally a good thing) as well as the flexibility to cash in at short notice. What this offers is v.low charges and none of the hassle of having to build up a diversified portfolio. Buying shares is more long-term given that you are talking about a 4-5% spread when taking charges, stamp duties into account.
One final reflection on ISEQ share buying: one of the big advantages of share purchase is the possibility of scrip dividends. You forgo your dividends, receive shares in lieu, your shareholding in a company increases while, hopefully, the same also happens with the shareprice. Consequence: merry compounding of your initial outlay. As many companies are giving up or changing their scrip dividend scheme (AIB for eg.) and preferring to return cash to shareholders (no shortage of that for many ISEQ cos) rather than further dilute their shares, this is yet another reason that buying shares in ISEQ companies for the 'retail investor' is becoming less interesting.
Stan
C
cerberos
Guest
stan,
NCB did a deal with DT under which they do not charge maintainance so if you are getting charged, ring them and remind them
Once a year they will sell thm free for you july-aug (dont remember dates but this year window is gone)
C
NCB did a deal with DT under which they do not charge maintainance so if you are getting charged, ring them and remind them
Once a year they will sell thm free for you july-aug (dont remember dates but this year window is gone)
C
stanbowles
Registered User
- Messages
- 28
Thanks Cerberos,
This is a bit off subject but wrt yr specific point re the big German telecom firm shares, you are right that there was some type of deal between NCB and said company re no nominee acct fees.
However:
1/ NCB charge a 'dividend collection fee' of I think euro 12.50 on any individual shareholding in any company annually (where dividends apply, I imagine)
2/ + Dividend tax is withheld at source ... not sure how this is calculated
3/ None of these deductions / calculations are mentioned on Statement of safe custody ... ie. punter in the dark as to what is happening with these shares and their dividend payments.
So, I repeat my preference for having share certs and ideally not having any permanent ongoing relationship with brokers. Go execution only.
Above is based on a discussion with NCB today after seeing your posting , btw. It is clear that NCB are trying to close out these accts and encourage people to cash out by offering limited period 0% sharedealing service. Decided to get rid of shares at approx 15% of original value. Farewell then, telecom shares.
Stan
This is a bit off subject but wrt yr specific point re the big German telecom firm shares, you are right that there was some type of deal between NCB and said company re no nominee acct fees.
However:
1/ NCB charge a 'dividend collection fee' of I think euro 12.50 on any individual shareholding in any company annually (where dividends apply, I imagine)
2/ + Dividend tax is withheld at source ... not sure how this is calculated
3/ None of these deductions / calculations are mentioned on Statement of safe custody ... ie. punter in the dark as to what is happening with these shares and their dividend payments.
So, I repeat my preference for having share certs and ideally not having any permanent ongoing relationship with brokers. Go execution only.
Above is based on a discussion with NCB today after seeing your posting , btw. It is clear that NCB are trying to close out these accts and encourage people to cash out by offering limited period 0% sharedealing service. Decided to get rid of shares at approx 15% of original value. Farewell then, telecom shares.
Stan
T
taung
Guest
Hi,
I'm thinking of disposing my Aer Lingus shares through the [broken link removed] which costs €50, flat fee. This appears to be the cheapest way for me to get rid of the shares as I have no sharetrading account with any stockbroker.
Has anyone any experience of this service? Can you recommend the service?
I'm thinking of disposing my Aer Lingus shares through the [broken link removed] which costs €50, flat fee. This appears to be the cheapest way for me to get rid of the shares as I have no sharetrading account with any stockbroker.
Has anyone any experience of this service? Can you recommend the service?
D
davidg
Guest
Hi,
What is a Crest account and how does it differ from a nominee account?
What is a Crest account and how does it differ from a nominee account?