Stamp Duty

T

TRS30

Guest
Hi all

Quick query.

What is the stamp duty rate/ amount for an investor buying a €340K second hand apartment ?

Cheers
 
6% according to (same rate as non first time buyer owner occupiers of second hand properties).
 
Cheers Clubman was backing you to be first reply !!

Not sure how in dept your knowledge is but heres another one for you....

If someone was given a house as a present and has lived there for 30 years and has never bought another property or never had a mortgage, would they be classed as FTB or not ?
 
would they be classed as FTB or not ?

I'm not 100% sure - I think that they may be a FTB by virtue of the fact that they never purchased a property before even if they owned one. However the FTB status may apply only in some cases (e.g. preferential rates of mortgage interest rax relief for FTB for seven years) and not others (e.g. non FTB rates of stamp duty liability on purchase of second hand properties). If this is a real as opposed to an academic query then you might want to get independent, professional opinion on the matter before acting on partial or potentially flawed information.
 
Cheers again Clubman

Was thinking much along the same lines as not really clearly dealt with anywhere were I have looked already. Was thinking about going straight to the horses mouth (revenue) to see what they say.

What you think ?
 
No harm in asking Revenue but once again it must be stressed that they will not necessarily stand over the information provided or guarantee that this information is correct no matter how strange this may seem. For example if you act on incorrect information the fact that this information may have originated from Revenue will not be accepted as any sort of defence against, say, tax/interest/penalty bills. I have received incorrect information from individual Revenue officers in the past (e.g. one Revenue official insisted to me that only self employed and not PAYE workers could claim tax relief on pension contributions made before October 31st in any year against income the previous tax year and only that I insisted that they were wrong did they eventually speak to their supervisor who confirmed that I was correct). It's up to the individual to make sure that they are acting in accordance with the relevant tax legislation/rules and to get independent, professional advice if necessary. I may be overstating the case here but it's worth noting all the same.
 
Interesting that Clubman.

I would have though that anyone working in the Revenue should know the "rule book " inside out before answering any questions or queries and if they are not sure, find out before telling Joe Bloggs something that could cost them a lot of money down the line.

Who is the best person to talk to then ? Solicitor, bank who you might get the mortgage through, broker ?

This is a situation that could occur so trying to get some facts together before approaching bank.
 
Who is the best person to talk to then

A tax professional is really the only person who can guarantee the right answer. Some accountants may also be tax professionals - I'm not sure. I definitely would not depend on the lender or most brokers to impart the correct information for certain. As I said, I may be overstating the case and the "right" answer to your question may be readily available on the Revenue website or whatever but in general the onus is on the individual to ensure that the tax information on which they act is accurate.
 
Cheers Clubman

Know any good tax professional who might answer the query over the phone ?
 
Reference the original question.
I find the following calculator very handy:
[broken link removed]
ajapale
 
Thanks ajapale.

By look of the definition of FTB, you have to live in the first property you buy and can not be an investor to avail of the lower FTB stamp duty rate.

This sound right ?
 
If I go ahead I guess thats €10K extra to hand over to our lovely Govt !!

You'd wonder why with SD effecting so many people it never really becomes an election issue !!
 
You'd wonder why with SD effecting so many people it never really becomes an election issue !!

Whatever about (the arguably populist in my view) issue of the impact of stamp duty on owner occupiers, especially first time buyers, (which was partially addressed last budget by extending exemptions for FTBs to second hand properties below a certain price) I doubt that many people or political parties will have much sympathy for investors who think that they are being hard done by in this context.
 
Would agree and disagree Clubman.

Was thinking more in the context of families who are looking to trade up due to family expanding, wanting elderly relative to live with them etc. But also investors to a certain extent, ie would like to buy 1 property to provide for retirement. Many people would not like or trust equities meaning property is the only real option of achieving long term growth and future income.
 
Was thinking more in the context of families who are looking to trade up due to family expanding, wanting elderly relative to live with them etc.

There was one or more good debates about the disrupting effects of stamp duty on people trading up among other things but unfortunately I can't find them now. I think they may have been moved from Great Debates to Budget 2005 and the latter forum was archived off the public site after the budget had passed making the discussions inaccessible.

But also investors to a certain extent

Investors already get generous tax breaks (e.g. ability to offset 100% of mortgage interest and other allowable expenses against rental income) and I personally don't believe that they need any more.

ie would like to buy 1 property to provide for retirement. Many people would not like or trust equities meaning property is the only real option of achieving long term growth and future income.

There are other ways to invest directly or indirectly through a pension scheme in property. Pension style tax breaks should not be extended to those buying property with their retirement in mind when the property in question remains a liquid/disposable asset in my view (since they could pocket the tax breaks and then make a quick killing by selling up prematurely).

In any case there is no reason a priori why one asset class is better than another one. One could easily argue that those who own their own home and are buying investment property as some sort of pension are, by concentrating much of their wealth in a single asset class (and usually also a single geographic region), are undertaking more significant risk than somebody who owns their own home and then diversifies their pension and other savings over a wider range of asset classes and risk/reward profiles (e.g. shares, bonds, cash etc.).
 
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