Laya Should we stay on Laya Control 600 Connect.

Bronco Lane

Registered User
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A couple of years ago we moved from one of the Laya Flex policies on the recommendation of snowyb to the Laya Control 600 Connect.

Our renewal is now due. I notice the cost of this policy has increased by just over €70 per head. Now €955. I don't think that there has been any material changes to the policy though.

snowyb. Have there been any new policies made available that offers similar cover for a lower price in the past two years that you know of from any of the providers?

Thanks, as always, for your input.
 
Hi Bronco Lane,

Unfortunately, there are no cheaper plans with similar cover to Control 600 Connect.
However, as an alternative option with Laya, Control 600 Create plan @ price 1015pa will not change pricewise in November 2019.
I know it is 60 euro more expensive than 955 for your current plan, but there is more day to day cover included on this plan.
There is a refund of 80 per consultant visit and 30 per gp visit, plus a list of further day to day medical expenses. This may or may not be beneficial
to you, depending whether or not you have a medical card and/or if you incur many medical expenses in a given year.

https://www.hia.ie/comparison-tool/...vY2siOmZhbHNlLCJwbGFuX2RldGFpbF9pZCI6LTF9fV0=

Regards, Snowyb
 
Why is the cost of Control 600 Connect €910 on the comparison but €955 on the OP's renewal?
 
Thanks snowyb. That is interesting.

It seems I can get a refund for non emergency dental €150 per year?
Optical is covered €100 per year.

Does this mean my second routine visit to the my dentist for a dental clean (one free from social welfare) will effectively be paid for and my additional pair of glasses will be paid for when I visit my optician?

Just one last question if I may. I notice on the comparison above that the cost of Control 600 connect is €910.65. My renewal is asking me for €955.07.

Is this the usual rip off on renewal but cheaper price for "new" customers. If so, how do I get the lower price?
 
Just to note, that going to their website directly today as a new customer gave me a quote of €880.80 with a start date of today.
Edit: Sorry, that takes into account a partial payment for the month. A full period quote is €955.07.
 
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Control 600 Create appears to have disappeared off Laya's site. The nearest is Control 600 Total, which could offer better value (€1004.57) than Control 600 Connect (€955.07) if you factor in the excess of €1 and up to €80 back in routine dental or a couple of doctor/physio visits.
 
If you move from Control 600 Connect to Control 600 Create are you upgrading your policy and is there a two year wait before you can make a claim re dental etc?
 
Hi Bronco Lane,

Firstly, the plan Control 600 Create has been discontinued since July 2019 but the Health Insurance Authority still had it listed live on their comparison
site. To avoid confusion, I notified them to delete and update their system.

The next best alternative option is Laya Control 600 Total @ price 1004pa (price increase from 1st November 2019). The medical expenses are
lower on this plan, for example optical 60 refund per year and routine dental 80 refund per year. I queried these particular expenses with Laya and
the full refund amount applies if your bill is higher. So if your dental cost is 80 or more you will get the max refund of 80, it is NOT halved or restricted.
The same applies to optical.

https://www.hia.ie/comparison-tool/...Mb2NrIjpmYWxzZSwicGxhbl9kZXRhaWxfaWQiOi0xfX1d

Regarding the price of Control 600 Connect, there is a list of price increases with Laya from 1st November 2019, so that explains the 955 price in
your case.

https://www.hia.ie/news/laya-healthcare-price-updates-and-benefit-changes-01112019-02112019

Lastly, there is NO 2 year upgrade waiting time with Laya for this extra day to day cover, regardless of your age. Expenses are allowable from
renewal date.

Regards, Snowyb
 
Optical is covered €100 per year.
Thanks. I get a free eye test from Specsavers every two years. Do you know if the optical benefit on the Control 600 total covers the cost of Glasses or does it only cover the cost of the eye test?
 
WaterWater,

Optical benefit with Laya does cover the cost of glasses. Note; Control 600 Create plan is no longer available since July 2019. So the nearest alternative
is Control 600 Total. Optical benefit is 60 euro less 1 euro excess = 59 per year.

Snowyb
 
Hi Snowy

I too have the Control 600 Connect as I want high tech cover but don't mind paying a high excess and day to day cover.

It was great to check here and see from an authoritative source like yourself, that is still the right product.

Thanks again for such a great service to Askaboutmoney users.

By the way, I rang Laya to check their advice as invited to do so on the renewal notice.

They said
1) A Flex plan would be €20 cheaper but I would lose access to the Blackrock Clinic and Mater Private
2) Control 450 Create would be a fair bit dearer but would give me lower excesses and some cover for everyday medical expenses.

They said that the lower excesses would not apply for existing illnesses for the first two years.

Brendan
 
Hi Brendan,

While Control 600 Connect ticks a lot of boxes re hospital cover, the 600 excess is quite high per admission.

For an extra 43 euro, you can reduce the excess to 450 per admission with the same hospital cover.
Details as follows;
1. Laya Control 450 Connect; price 998pa; all public, private(including private room fully covered) and 3 hi-tech hospitals covered. Private or
hi-tech hospital excess 450 per admission, day case excess 125 per procedure. Limited day to day cover, same as before.
https://www.hia.ie/comparison-tool/...Mb2NrIjpmYWxzZSwicGxhbl9kZXRhaWxfaWQiOi0xfX1d

For an extra 50 euro, Connect 600 Total has better day to day cover, with a 1 euro excess. Details as follows;
2. Laya Control 600 Total; price 1004pa; all public, private(including private room fully covered) and 3 hi-tech hospitals covered. Private or
hi-tech hospital excess 600 per admission, day case excess 175 per procedure. Better day to day cover, 1 euro excess, refund of 40 per consultant
visit, 15 per gp, physio etc. This is also useful for x-rays etc. MRI scans are handled differently, they are fully covered directly by Laya if carried out
in an approved MRI scan centre.
https://www.hia.ie/comparison-tool/#/plan-comparison?plansAndProfiles=W3siaWQiOjEsImFnZSI6MjYsIm1pbk1heFByaWNlIjpbMCw2NTAwXSwibWluTWF4RXhjZXNzIjpbMCw2MDBdLCJwbGFuVHlwZSI6MSwicGxhbnNTZWxlY3RlZCI6WzEzOTMsMTM2OF0sInBsYW5zIjp7ImRhdGEiOltdLCJsb2FkaW5nIjp0cnVlfSwicGxhbnNTZWxlY3RlZERhdGEiOltdLCJhcHBsaWNhdGlvbiI6eyJ0b2dnbGVfc2Nyb2xsTG9jayI6ZmFsc2UsInBsYW5fZGV0YWlsX2lkIjotMX19XQ==

Regarding Laya's recommendation to you, Control 450 Create @ price 1159pa, it is not the best value plan available.
For another 22 euro, Control 300 Create @ price 1181pa would reduce the excess to 300 per admission and day case excess to 125 per procedure.

3. Laya Control 300 Create; price 1181pa; all public, private(including private room fully covered) and 3 hi-tech hospitals covered; private or hi-tech
excess 300 per admission, day case excess 125 per procedure. Strictly speaking, there would be a 2 year wait for pre-existing illnesses before the lower excess would apply. Sometimes this rule is not strictly applied. It is paid to the hospital, not to Laya.
Good day to day cover included, 1 euro excess, refund of 80 per consultant visit, 30 per gp etc.
https://www.hia.ie/comparison-tool/...Mb2NrIjpmYWxzZSwicGxhbl9kZXRhaWxfaWQiOi0xfX1d

Finally, if a person has a number of illnesses + conditions, plans like the Control 600 range are not a practical option, as the excess costs would
spiral out of control fairly quickly.
Ideally for a person with several illnesses or with a condition that will probably mean admissions to hospital per year, a plan with a capped excess per year is the best option.
There is a limit on the yearly excess amount, regardless of the amounts of admissions per year.
Examples of such plans are Laya Simplicity, Laya Connect Simplicity which both cover a private room.
https://www.hia.ie/comparison-tool/...Mb2NrIjpmYWxzZSwicGxhbl9kZXRhaWxfaWQiOi0xfX1d

Laya Simply Connect, Laya Simply Connect Plus, Laya Essential Health 300.
https://www.hia.ie/comparison-tool/#/plan-comparison?plansAndProfiles=W3siaWQiOjEsImFnZSI6MjYsIm1pbk1heFByaWNlIjpbMCwxMzMwXSwibWluTWF4RXhjZXNzIjpbMCw2MDBdLCJwbGFuVHlwZSI6MSwicGxhbnNTZWxlY3RlZCI6WzEzOTMsMTUyMiwxNTUyLDE1NTNdLCJwbGFucyI6eyJkYXRhIjpbXSwibG9hZGluZyI6dHJ1ZX0sInBsYW5zU2VsZWN0ZWREYXRhIjpbXSwiYXBwbGljYXRpb24iOnsidG9nZ2xlX3Njcm9sbExvY2siOmZhbHNlLCJwbGFuX2RldGFpbF9pZCI6LTF9fV0=

If you know you are going to have a lot of medical expenses coming up, Laya allow you to switch plans at any time during the year.
So you can upgrade to a plan with extra day to day cover, there is no waiting time for this type of cover, regardless of your age.
You can then use the app to claim refunds as the expenses arise.

Regards, Snowyb
 
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Hi Snowy

Wow!

That is great.

I will digest that and change to one of those plans.

My thoughts were that I did not want day to day cover, but if it costs very little , a routine visit to Blackrock Clinic A&E would be covered with a much smaller excess.

Brendan
 
Hi Snowy

I have summarised the key points of all this into a table. Does it look right?

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The main thing I gather here is

1) If you have an existing condition which will require a lot of ongoing admission to hospitals, then the first three policies with big excesses are not suitable for you.

2) There isn't that much difference if you don't expect to be in hospital a lot. If you pay a little bit extra, you will save a few hundred euro if you are admitted to hospital once. You can get better day to day cover with Control 600 total, but that is not usually important for someone prepared to pay €1,200 out of their own pocket for 3 days in Blackrock Clinic.
 

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Brendan,

Just one correction, Connect Simplicity has a hi-tech shortfall of 175 per night.

If you had Blackrock Clinic in mind, then you could definitely go for one of the Control plans as they waive all nightly shortfall amounts.
Just the once off admission excess of 600 or 450 would apply. If its cardiac or orthopaedic(hip or knee replacement) there's no excess at all.

Blackrock Clinic now has a new 'Check Cover' feature on their website.
Great for looking up cover in their hospital on any plan.
Examples as follows;
http://cover.blackrock-clinic.ie/Home/Step4?FullyCovered=False&PlanId=1031&CompanyId=4

http://cover.blackrock-clinic.ie/Home/Step4?FullyCovered=False&PlanId=1090&CompanyId=4

http://cover.blackrock-clinic.ie/Home/Step4?FullyCovered=False&PlanId=1032&CompanyId=4


http://cover.blackrock-clinic.ie/

Snowyb
 
Hi Snowy

I have corrected that now.

Am I right in saying that 3 days in the Mater would cost €675 under the Simplicity Plan?
€175 x 3 = €525
+ €150 per claim exess
= €675
 
Strictly speaking, 675 would be the cost under Connect Simplicity plan.

But in practise, its a different ballgame completely.
Cardiac related or hip or knee replacment surgery would be fully covered, no shortfall, no excess.
This would be regardless of how long the stay.

I have experience of close relatives who went into Mater Private for both elective surgery and admission through their private Emergency Dept,
and no shortfall was charged.
One stay was 3 weeks, with surgery and other treatments, shortfall was waived.

The shortfall charge relates to the bed, all surgery, procedures, scans, medical treatment, medication are all covered on the plan once you're
admitted.

A lot of elective surgery is fully covered and if a shortfall applies, it is waived.
However, there is no transparent information about this on the Mater Private website.
They have a waiver system like the Blackrock Clinic, but its a grey area as to the finer details.
Its through personal experience or word of mouth that you find out.

But on the face of it, 675 would be the cost for three days.

Snowyb
 
Snowy

That makes these policies even better value.

I see that Blackrock Clinic actually commits to it in writing.

4260




Blackrock Clinic charges you the full price if you have insurance. But they give you a discount of €200 per night if you have an excess.

Brendan
 
Yes, that 'Check Cover' facility is new on their website, since before Christmas.
Its very helpful and reassuring to know where you stand regarding hospital cover in Blackrock Clinic.

They originally started that 'waiver discount' back in 2008 when the banks collapsed etc.
People on the top level plans switched to lower priced plans as part of making savings throughout the recession.

Hospitals like Blackrock Clinic and Mater Private would have noticed the loss of business as a result.
Blackrock Clinic came up with this waiver idea first and as a competitor, Mater Private had to follow their lead.

While Blackrock Clinic's waiver is across the board, ticking all the boxes regarding all types of surgery,
Mater Private's list appears not to be as comprehensive.
Their lack of transparancy and finer details means you just don't know, what plans qualify or what surgery is included.

That was my 'lightbulb moment' back in 2011, when I phoned Blackrock Clinic just enquiring about VHI plans and shortfall amounts at the time,
which are shown in percentages not nightly amounts.
I was asked straight away 'Oh have you not heard anything about our waiver system, where we don't pass shortfall amounts onto the patient
on most lower priced plans with hi-tech cover included, on a wide range of surgery?
Shortly after that I joined AAM and mentioned this information regularly.
I'm sure many thought it was far-fetched at the time, like myself to be honest, except I heard it straight from the horses mouth.

The new 'check cover' facility, confirms everything in writing.

Mater Private did have some info on the website in the past, which was vague enough.
This is not available at the moment.

Regards, Snowyb
 
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