Rip Off Republic - Episode #2 - review

daltonr said:
> As I outlined here and in subsequent posts in the same thread I dispute the
> claim that we don't live in a low tax economy.

I accept you dispute it and I'll agree to differ if you will
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I just thought that you might have some comment to make on the hard facts and figures that I presented in that post and the rest of that thread in relation to which I asked for somebody to point out where myself and my wife, as a not atypical couple (bar the lack of a car maybe), were being ripped off in relation to taxes, charges, expenditure etc. because we certainly can't see it. Nobody has managed to do this as far as I can see. I thought that you would be up to the challenge.
>I made two suggestions for where c. €10 meals can be had
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Yeah - lunch. There is also good value to be had in early bird dinner menus too. When I get a chance I may collate some good offers. I take it from the Florida invitation that you've decided on Canada or Oz?
 

I do have some comments. To be honest they are so obvious that I'm sure you've already considered them.

1. You bought your house 10 years ago and have benefited from 10 years of extraordinary house price growth. Well done. I'm sure you made sacrafices to get it, and you deserve every penny. Your proximity to the city would have further enhanced the effect. This would certainly buy a lot of contentment.

2. You live close to the city and close to a wide array of public transport options. You don't live where the majority of new property is being built, and where young couples are finding themselves very under served by Public transport.

Literally last night I was discussing how one might go about getting from our house to the city center by Bus. And I live in Firhouse, not exactly a backwater. The bus route is unbelievably meandering and still involves a long walk in the city center.

The person in question owns a yearly bus pass, but has found that their parking spot near a QBC is no longer an option. They have to now go searching for another back street to squeeze their car into because some park and rides along the QBC is too much to ask.

When Bus Pass time comes up for review they could consider the Luas. But the Luas from here will get you to the wrong side of the city and in a stroke of genius doesn't link with the other Luas.

3. When calculating how much tax you pay I'd add 10% of your gross to your tax bill to account for Employers PRSI. You actually pay this because your employer looks at how much you cost to employ. They'd pay you more if the government took less.
I think both the employers and employees cut even goes in the same payment. I don't pay it so I'm not sure.

4. You are fortunate in that by your location you actually do have a realistic choice about whether or not you run a car. Others including myself do not have that luxury.
Some families find the only way to get by is with two cars.

In short you are not a typical couple. You are an extraordinarily lucky couple, although I'll admit you made your own luck in many respects.

I think there is a big and growing chunk of the Irish Population who have it much worse than you. Remember when we used to hear about the high percentage of Irish people under the age of 25. Well. They've grown up and they want a house.

And when they try to buy a house they find the government giving tax breaks to people who already have houses, to buy more. Their tax that they pay is subsidising people who already have houses, to out bid them when they try to buy their first house.

-Rd
 
According to [broken link removed], the shows proving a huge hit - 667000 viewers this week. They describe it as a "record number of viewers" possibly for that slot on a Monday - we can only guess since they don't tell us what the record is.
 
daltonr said:
I do have some comments. To be honest they are so obvious that I'm sure you've already considered them.
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Some of them were so obvious that I had considered them alright. However some of them are not so obvious because they are based on invalid assumptions and, in my opinion, an seeming obsession with identifying negative aspects (real or imagined) of a situation rather than taking a balanced view of the facts and, only then, arriving at a logical and reasonable conclusion.

1. You bought your house 10 years ago and have benefited from 10 years of extraordinary house price growth. Well done. I'm sure you made sacrafices to get it, and you deserve every penny.
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These pennies are all on paper. I'm not saying that this is insignificant or irrelevant but, in practice, it means nothing to us on a day to day basis.

Your proximity to the city would have further enhanced the effect. This would certainly buy a lot of contentment.
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It has its advantages and disadvantages but ultimately the former outweight the latter in our opinion. Not everybody would agree.

2. You live close to the city and close to a wide array of public transport options. You don't live where the majority of new property is being built, and where young couples are finding themselves very under served by Public transport.
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True. But there are plenty of couples in the same situation and age bracket as us in this area and all the way heading out towards more suburban areas in all directions so we are certainly not unique or specially privileged in this respect.

I just looked up Dublin Bus and the 49/49A seem to serve Firhouse and terminate on Eden Quay which is hardly a city centre backwater.

Do they ever consider the impact that their parking might have on residents of the surrounding area and maybe consider alternative modes of transportation to their destination or to the bus (e.g. walk, bike, moped)? Suburban commuter parking in residential streets is one problem that we suffered from in our area for a long time (e.g. people ditching their cars in our area for the working day) and which caused major inconvenience for residents but thankfully the council have recently introduced pay and display in the area which has more or less eliminated this problem.

When Bus Pass time comes up for review they could consider the Luas. But the Luas from here will get you to the wrong side of the city and in a stroke of genius doesn't link with the other Luas.
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I presume by "wrong side of the city" you mean that this person is destined for some Northside destination and the Luas green line termination at Stephen's Green is not convenient for them? I have regularly managed 5-10 minute walks to make connections between different public transport facilities and I'm sure that others can manage it too.

3. When calculating how much tax you pay I'd add 10% of your gross to your tax bill to account for Employers PRSI. You actually pay this because your employer looks at how much you cost to employ. They'd pay you more if the government took less.
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I don't accept that this is the case and I don't accept that this is a valid way to deal with the employer's PRSI liability. It's like saying that if 21% VAT was not charged on goods then they would simply be 21% dearer anyway. This is a fallacy in my opinion. Even if your analysis was true and the removal of employer PRSI drove wages up by 10% would you blame the inevitable consequential rise in prices and reduced level of PRSI linked welfare services on "rip-off Ireland" or on something else?

I think both the employers and employees cut even goes in the same payment.
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I don't know what you mean here.

4. You are fortunate in that by your location you actually do have a realistic choice about whether or not you run a car.
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You are making assumptions here about our regular destinations by drawing this conclusion. Not all of our regular travel is facilitated by public transport and arrangements can sometimes be complex. In spite of this we choose not to own and run a car because on a cost/benefit anlysis basis we simply cannot justify it. That's the key issue - it is a choice and we live with it rather than blaming somebody or something else for our lack of this modern convenience that many people (mistakenly in my opinion) consider an essential requirement.

In short you are not a typical couple. You are an extraordinarily lucky couple
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I think that this is an extremely presumptuous conclusion to arrive at particularly since it is based on very incomplete information. As I have said above we are in no way unique in our immediate or wider vicinity so I don't accept that we are particularly atypical. Perhaps the problem here is that you are not willing to face the fact that many individuals and couples are in situations very similar to ourselves and that they are relatively happy with their lot and not prepared to buy into the whole "rip-off Ireland" mania (or is it depression?)?

I presume by tax breaks for people who already have houses you mean the ability of investors to write off 100% of mortgage interest and other allowable expenses against rental income? If this is the case they you also have to accept that these people will pay higher rates of stamp duty on the purchase and will pay CGT on the resale gain whereas owner occupiers in general, and first time buyers in particular, will generally pay lower CGT (if any) and no CGT on any resale gain. And they get mortgage interest relief with first time buyers getting preferential rates compared to non FTBs. And don't forget that owner occupiers can earn up to €7,620 in rent a room rental totally free of tax and PRSI. Given these tax breaks for first time buyers and other owner occupiers where do you see the "rip-off"?
 
These pennies are all on paper. I'm not saying that this is insignificant or irrelevant but, in practice, it means nothing to us on a day to day basis.
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Yes it does. You are not one of the thousands trying to find a place to live today. To the best of my knowledge you bought your house before local authorities started ramping up levies of 15K to 20K on new houses. I might be wrong in this. Do you recall how much of a Levy you paid. It sure takes the sheen off avoiding stamp duty.

The typical Dublin house buyer today is squeezed out to areas like Firhouse and Lucan. Four out of five first time buyers buy outside Dublin even though 29% of the population live there.


True. But there are plenty of couples in the same situation and age bracket as us in this area and all the way heading out towards more suburban areas in all directions so we are certainly not unique or specially privileged in this respect.
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IF course you're not unique, there are even people who are better off than you. But you have to acknowledge that there are a lot of people struggling with issues that don't affect you. If those people feel ripped off, and you don't share their problems, you're unlikely to share their feelings.

I just looked up Dublin Bus and the 49/49A seem to serve Firhouse and terminate on Eden Quay which is hardly a city centre backwater.
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This is the regular chant of the public transport lovers. Who cares if you have a 20 minute walk in the rain at the other end. Who cares if your bus meanders all over the county before getting you home.

There is a bus that get's them reasonably close top their job and they can drive the last few miles to/from their house at the other end. A simple set of Park and Rides would do wonders. But no. It's too much to ask.

Do they ever consider the impact that their parking might have on residents of the surrounding area and maybe consider alternative modes of transportation to their destination or to the bus
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I don't know, have you ever considered that Park and Ride might do more to get cars out of the city and out of residential areas than complaining about motorists attraction to their car.


Motorists parking in residention areas is a symptom of poor last mile infrastructure. We live in a country that is wet and dismal almost all year round. Instead of complaining that motorists don't do the things you'd like why don't we just deal with the problem. Again this is a case of you complaining about a problem you don't understand. Since you are not a motorist and are not living in somewhere like Lucan or Firhouse.

Why is it too much to ask that we adopt international best practice and build some park and rides to go with the QBC's?


I presume by "wrong side of the city" you mean that this person is destined for some Northside destination and the Luas green line termination at Stephen's Green is not convenient for them?
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Actually the Firhouse Line arrives on the North side of the city, and would mean a walk to bagott St. A walk from Stephen's green to work might be an option if the Luas lines connected. Yes, a bus might be an option from the Northside to Bagott St., I don't know if there is an equivalent of the Annual Tax deductable Bus Ticket that would allow Luas and Bus use.

But again your missing the point. Individuals might be pursueded to go out of their way, take 2 or 3 transport connections each way, walk the last half mile in the rain. But the population as a whol will not. The person we are discussing has a good way of getting to work. They drive, park on the outskirts of the city and take public transport.

They don't clog up the city center. They are literally going half way to meet the public transport lobby. But it isn't enough. You want them to go the whole way.

If the public transport lobby would also come half way and allow for the very sensible way of getting to work of driving to a park and ride then the City Center would be a significantly better place. We know this works, it's not a theory.

Even if your analysis was true and the removal of employer PRSI drove wages up by 10% would you blame the inevitable consequential rise in prices and reduced level of PRSI linked welfare services on "rip-off Ireland" or on something else?
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If the 10% was removed there would probably be a combination of take home pay increasing (upward inflation preassure) and profit margins increasing (downward inflation pressure greater scope for competition).

The bottom line is that it's 10% YOU are paying to the government. If we are assesing whether you get value for the tax you pay then it should be included in the calculation.


The fact that you don't have a car shows that you have a choice. I'm sure there are some who have cars that could survive without them but choose not to. But I'm equally sure that there are MANY MANY people including myself simply could not do without it. And I have to say I am far from the most dependant on it, if I had a couple of kids to get to/from school etc I suspect my dependance would go up.



If you are only willing to look to the cocoon of people living near you (availing of the same Public Transport Options), same house price increases, people who have the difficult job of getting a house out of the way then of course you'll see yourself as typical.

You problem is that you are confused why so many people feel ripped off if you don't. The reason is that you are not in the same boat as the people who are talking about the Rip-Offs. The very fact that people living near you don't feel ripped off proves the point rather than disprove it.

Congratulations it sounds like you snuck through before the gates started closing, but it's silly to wonder why all the people outside the gates are upset when everyone you talk to inside the gates seems so happy.

I presume by tax breaks for people who already have houses you mean the ability of investors to write off 100% of mortgage interest and other allowable expenses against rental income?
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Actually I was referring more specifically to the impact of section 23 and similar on house prices particularly when applied in inappropriate areas.

Given these tax breaks for first time buyers and other owner occupiers where do you see the "rip-off"?
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FTB only holds if BOTH partners are FTB's. This is no recognition of couples with one FTB. There is a presumption that if either party every owned any portion of a house that they must have loads of cash and can afford a high tax. The stamp duty rates have not reflected to astonishing increase in house prices.

Local authority Levies have been increased and are now as much or more than many would be paying in stamp duty. Give the illusion that you are removing stamp duty for the most hard pressed. Hit them with another tax instead. Welcome to the No Frills economy.

-Rd
 
Insane conspiracy theory

Back on the subject of Eddies show - isn't it interesting that there is a double episode of LOST on on Monday at the exact time Eddies show is on?
 
Next episode of Eddie's show isn't on until Monday week. Replaced by Rose of Tralee
 
Replaced by Rose of Tralee
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Since 51.5% of people watching TV seem to like Eddie's show, why don't they replace whatever is on the other channel. No offence to Lost Fans.

-Rd
 
I asked them a similar question a few years ago and didn't get a reply.
So I don't bother any more.

It was more of a rhetorical question. Like, Why does the other lane of traffic seem to move faster? Or why can't Irish people make comedy until they move to England?

-Rd
 
daltonr said:
I asked them a similar question a few years ago and didn't get a reply.
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Did you write to them or email them? In general with large organisations I find that the former is more likely to elicit a response than the latter.
 
> Did you write to them or email them? In general with large organisations I find that
> the former is more likely to elicit a response than the latter.

I emailed them. I agree, if it had been a serious question I'd have written.

Since you asked me about this I've been thinking about the question I posed above and It actually has more merit than I originally thought. Perhaps I will write to them after all.

For what it's worth the question I asked a year or two ago was why RTE don't have a Watchdog program like the BBC? I suppose in a sense Eddie's program is as close as we've come to filling that gap, even if it's government rather than specific businesses treatment of consumers that's under the scope.

Elcato,

The answer to your question is that we're a restless bunch always striving for better.
at least that's the marketing spin on it. The real reason is we're a bunch of miserable oul farts living on a cold wet rock on the edge of Europe.

-Rd
 
The answer to your question is that we're a restless bunch always striving for better.
at least that's the marketing spin on it.
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Yes, but when people are very negative all the time it can be soul destroying for those who have to listen to the message and rather than winning converts, one tends to lose respect for the perhaps well-intentioned messenger.

You know as well as I do (and you have accepted this) that there are very positive aspects to living in Ireland. Why do we have to rubbish everything by labeling the country as a –Rip off Republic or a No Frills Country?

To be honest I find the terms are cheap – they suggest that we have a type of business ethic whose real aims are to steal, cheat and exploit people – aka consumers or employees.

We are too intelligent a people for this nonsense!

Unlike you, I’m not a business person; I’m a public service employee. But my immediate family has been in business for over 137 years and I know that they have never exploited their employees and I believe their customers. Granted, there have been complaints from consumers, but they have always been informed that if they are not happy to pay the price, they can take their business to the bigger establishments. (I grew up listening to this) In general, the consumers stayed!

Complaints about prices are not a Noughties phenomena!

I think the message that we should be giving to consumers is that if we were are not happy with the price of a service or good that we should:


a) Query it
b) Ask for a discount
c) Take our business elsewhere if we are not happy
d) Alter our lifestyle and cut out the product/service which we feel is too expensive
e) Cut back on our usage of the product if we cannot achieve any of the above


Sometimes the solution to a perceived problem is easily achievable.

Marion
 
At the risk of fuelling accusations of engaging in a Moderator love-in and a concerted collective effort to rebut the arguments of the "rip-off Ireland" merchants I have to say I consider this one of the most reasonable and mature posts on the issue to date. Having said that I'm not sure that this thread is capable of yielding much more in the way of constrctive discussion at this stage.
 
I had to jump in on this one...
I've heard an awful lot about Mr. Hobbs (not least on this forum) and while I agree with some of the things he has to say [as reported by others] (and more power to him/them) I have me doubts. [I have tried to find Eddie on the RTE website for realmedia and no luck!]

I've lived in the Netherlands for the last 5 years so I've lived the 'high-tax, good public services' thingy and no it's not all it's cracked up to be. The Dutch tax bands go something like this: 25%-40%-55%, and that 25% is charged from a lower cut off than the Irish one too.

So what do you get for it?
Good roads? Yup, but here in Holland they're full with cars all the time, so no, you don't get where you want to go, faster.
Good rail? Well, yes, but that's full too. You can only have so many trains and carriages moving in the morning rush-hour so they're usually jammed and convoluted commutes are pretty normal - for those that will take them. The majority take the car despite the fabulous public transport.
Buses are no better than in Ireland, although off-peak service is usually better(except on Saturdays)
Health care? well yes, everyone has access to great outpatient and dental plans. If you earn above 25k you are legally obliged to pay into a private health insurance, but this is part of NLs 'ability to pay' principle and could be taken as fair enough. Anyway because everyone has access they are VERY slow to treat. I have a Brazilian friend diagnosed with cancer in Holland who had to wait SIX WEEKS for a biopsy of the tumor to find out if it was malignant after the preliminary diagnosis. After this she would have had to wait another 3 weeks to 'discuss' the options available to her with a consultant, and still no treatment date in site. She was lucky enough to be able to go back to Brazil for treatment (hardly a Mecca for medical procedures) and was treated immediately and well and is now recovering.
I have 3 other nightmare stories from work colleagues in A+E in the last 6 months, all from people who were willing to pay and wanting to pay but who couldn't get a look in because everything was booked - like Jem's example of the 6 week appointment in Liverpool.

Also driving: buying a car is marginally cheaper new, a LOT cheaper second hand (cheap German models) but running it is very expensive. Petrol has been over 115c for a long time here, I think it's at 128c now. Car tax is also expensive, and they're restructuring it to be based on miles travelled.
There is a park+ride here in Leiden, as far as I can see no-one uses it...

Home owning: Taxed yearly on the entire surface area of your home, including garden. This ramps up to a higher rate once your mortgage is completely paid off.

Credit cards: No stealth tax, but a user fee of E40+ is usual. (Paid to the CC company, not the gov.)

On the plus side, you get brilliant creche facilites (still not for pennies), after school programs, programs for autistic children, good care of the elderly etc. etc. so it's not all bad by any means, just don't try to do anything in a hurry.

I shuttle back and forth quite a bit so I have the opportunity to compare other things: haircuts are cheaper in NL, but I get mine done at home because I can better explain what I want in English. Drink is marginally cheaper in the pub, supermarket purchases are often quite a bit cheaper, and housing is cheaper these days (last two were the other way around when I first moved here).

Mr. Squid and I rent a 50m2 apt. for about 400 a month, rent controlled. I'm lucky to work within cycling distance so we save on commuting, and TG we've had no health problems, but if we moved or got a car things would dramatically change. So while we are very lucky we could be quite a bit worse off.

That said, we're moving back to Cork at the end of the month. If I had had to take a job in Dublin we wouldn't have moved (Mr. Squid is Dutch and doesn't really mind) because I do think that the excessive commutes and house prices negatively impact on the quality of life in the area.
So we will have to get a car, because my house is in a suburb of a suburb (Rushbrooke) but we're determined to manage on one. More updates on adjustment to modern Ireland as they happen.

2 last points:
I find eating out in Ireland uninspired and generally poor quality for what you pay. We (as a nation) have the best of ingredients available locally, and if I can cloddishly throw together something more tasty in my own kitchen, something has to be going wrong )

ClubMan mentioned VdP opposing the Groceries act: Big multiples WILL bring down the cost of goods, but they will do so on the town margins. Until there is proper public transport going to these shopping centres (which almost never happens, whereever you are) poor people can't get there to make the savings, and the place they might be able to get to could be driven out of business. Simplistic, maybe, but please show me better.

IMVHO as a nation we have much to gain from better public transport rather than better roads taking people faster to new bottlenecks... or maybe better broadband so people can telecommute?

I think a bit of this (ROI) is the Irish propensity to pull the long face, so I have to give my 2 cents in my usual rambling fashion....

micro.
 
Yes, but when people are very negative all the time it can be soul destroying for those who have to listen to the message and rather than winning converts, one tends to lose respect for the perhaps well-intentioned messenger.
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I wasn't aware that anyone was oblighed to read this stuff. And I have to say that the happy clappy brigade who tell us all that we should be changing our lifestyle to be more like them is just as annoying as anything I've written.

Of course someone living close to the city center surrounded by public transport options is going to be confused when people talk about the cost of running a car. Of course they'll wonder why we don't all do what they do and get rid of our cars.

It is valid to point out that you pay tax and crimes go uninvestigated, and in some cases unrecorded. People need to know this stuff so there not suckered by the Crime figures at the end of the year.

It is valid to point out that when the government claims to be concerned about Inflation, House Prices, etc, etc, etc, that the government is the main cause of these things, so people don't make the mistake of voting for these people next time.

I wouldn't mind if the government said, House Price Inflation and General Inflation are necessary, it's part of our plan, but the policies will benefit us all long term. I might disagree with their policies, but I'd respect their honesty. It's the lying and hypocrisy that gets me.

It is valid to point out that we build QBC's but don't bother with Park and Rides and peopleare going to continue to drive into the city center, or park in residential areas.

It is valid to point out that high prices in Pubs, Supermarkets, Electronics stores, Restraurants, are high for a reason and it's not all explained by the fact that we have jobs and disposable income.

Finally and most importantly it is valid to constantly compare ourselves Good and Bad to other countries to see how we stack up. Just as we're advices to compare pubs, restaurants etc. It is valid to shop around for countries. What are other countries doing better, or worse than us.

What we get on here is that if you point out something better about another country you get .... "Yeah but they have the Death Penalty", or "Yeah but their literacy rate is 5% lower than ours".

This thread isn't going to get any further. But there will be many many more rip-off threads on this and other boards. I don't think I've started them all. I may have started one once. I'd love to get to the bottom of the feeling that's spreading throughout the country. It's not the same as your mother complaining about the price of ham at the local butchers 15 yeras ago. This is widespread, accross the board.

Anyway. Enough of this. You'll be delighted to know I'll miss next weeks show so I won't be able to participate in the debate. Enjoy.

-Rd
 
daltonr said:
This thread isn't going to get any further.
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And since Eddie isn't on tonight, lets just start another thread reviewing the Rose of Tralee instead.....
 
daltonr said:
I wasn't aware that anyone was oblighed to read this stuff. And I have to say that the happy clappy brigade who tell us all that we should be changing our lifestyle to be more like them is just as annoying as anything I've written.
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Who are the happy clappy brigade? Are you referring to people who point out flaws in the whole "rip-off Ireland" argument and rebut some of the more sweeping generalisations in this context? Obviously nobody forces you to read what they write either.

Of course someone living close to the city center surrounded by public transport options is going to be confused when people talk about the cost of running a car. Of course they'll wonder why we don't all do what they do and get rid of our cars.
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I presume that this is in reference to my earlier posts. Just to clarify I was not "confused" about the cost of running a car. I simply said that I was not au fait with all the costs involved since I don't run one myself. Not exactly the same thing. Neither did I suggest that somebody who needs or wants to run a car should get rid of it. Desisting from inaccurately representing the views and comments of others would improve the chances of discussions such as this actually being constructive.

It is valid to point out that when the government claims to be concerned about Inflation, House Prices, etc, etc, etc, that the government is the main cause of these things, so people don't make the mistake of voting for these people next time.
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I asked you before which political party or movement would do a better job that the current Government but I don't think that you got around to answering. Maybe you could comment now? By the way I have no party political affiliations or allegiances myself just in case there is any confusion about that.

Do you respect Michael McDowell for commenting [broken link removed] that he didn't agree with the whole idea of equality in society and that things should be run on meritocratic lines?

It is valid to point out that we build QBC's but don't bother with Park and Rides and peopleare going to continue to drive into the city center, or park in residential areas.
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Doesn't the Luas have P&R facilities? Not sure about the DART and other rail services.

It is valid to point out that high prices in Pubs, Supermarkets, Electronics stores, Restraurants, are high for a reason and it's not all explained by the fact that we have jobs and disposable income.
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Yes - some pubs, supermarkets etc. have high prices. Some do not. Just this morning on the way into work I noticed that a local butcher was offering 10 chicken breasts for €7 and I bought 10 apples and 1KG of grapes in Moore Street for €1 each. Last week I bought six cans of Bavaria lager for €7 (€1.17 each) and on Saturday I bought two cans of lager for €1.15 each and two cans of Bass for €1.05 each. All of these items would have cost a lot more from other sources. A few small examples but I could provide many more.

Yes - good and bad. Many of the rip-off Ireland merchants seem to focus only on the latter.

What we get on here is that if you point out something better about another country you get .... "Yeah but they have the Death Penalty", or "Yeah but their literacy rate is 5% lower than ours".
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Following on from my previous point I posted some details such as this simply to balance your seeming bias towards accentuating the negative things in Ireland compared to other countries.

And one other comment in responsed to one of your earlier posts:
The typical Dublin house buyer today is squeezed out to areas like Firhouse and Lucan. Four out of five first time buyers buy outside Dublin even though 29% of the population live there.
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So what? Do you think that everybody has an automatic and inalienable right to live where they want regardless of market forces and supply and demand constraints? If so, why? As for first time buyers being "squeezed" how do you explain the results of a recent [broken link removed] which found that 44% of first time buyers surveyed claimed that their mortgage repayments were "no burden at all", 49% said that they were "somewhat of a burden" and only 6.5% said that they were a "heavy burden".

On a final, completely anecdotal and unrepresentative, note I was having a few pints with a friend on Friday night in Dalymount and he started moaning about "rip-off Ireland" when I stopped him in his tracks and countered some of his arguments with the result that he eventually had to agree that things were not as bad as he initially assumed. There are indeed problems and rip-offs but I don't think that they are as pervasive as some would like to make out and I think that attributing most or all problems that exist to a nebulous, but admittedly catchy, phrase as "rip-off Ireland" doesn't really help to identfy and focus on the real problems/rip-offs and set the scene for coming up with constructive solutions.
 
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