Return to office

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odyssey06 said:
What's the point of the legislation then?
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To keep the Unions happy. The idea that employees should have a legal right to work from home is ridiculous and a legal right to ask to work from home is meaningless.

odyssey06 said:
And also, are there not considerations re: application of company policy differently to employees of same service and how that could be viewed by the WRC.
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Yes, that could certainly be an issue.
 
Leo said:
And how much of that is down to weak management who don't understand their space, and just want their staff (the real SMEs) always on hand in case their boss asks a tough question!
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absolutely, although it is actually easier using Teams or the like, a manager can message his minions on the QT and then pretend he knows what he is talking about.
 
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Sarenco said:
Nope.

As previously emphasised, that’s draft legislation - it ain’t the law yet.
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The law was proposed in January and still not on the books! Thanks for the clarification.

I wonder though tactically should the person in question ask the grounds? It might make the employer think twice.
 
I thoroughly agree with younger/junior people being in the office. I've seen the toll working from home has on junior trainees in particular. They are missing out on all the networking, learning on the job, craic. The only problem is if all the senior people are at home, it won't be much help to their learning. A balance would be good.
 
I also think remote working is great for high performers, who are intrinsically motivated and can work independently and with initiative, but very much less so for lower performers and here in lies a big problem imo. It's a lot harder to manage poor performers remotely and a lot easier to escape the difficult conversations if you are not performing and you only have to face your manager once a week on a teams call and it's over and done with vs 40 hours in the office!
 
It does sound like they want to get rid of people and avoid paying redundancy. Company sounds pretty unscrupulous as they already said remote working was allowed, and now they want your wife back in office.
Can your wife find a role in another company?
Did the existing company send any communication via email or such like that ALL employees were going remote?
Was the wifes contract updated?
Are they insisting on 100% in the office or hybrid? Is there any way she could do that, even short term? Or take parental leave etc?
 
That's the issue though , how do the younger staff become skilled whenl all the older ones are at home ? How do you then differentiate between those allowed to work from home and those that don't . All the older guys benefited from the traditional system of on site training from their older peers years ago and now it's like they want to pull up the drawbridge behind them. Employers are simply now calling time on this now that the pandemic and mandated WFH is long over.

Another factor never discuss about this is the unfairness on workers that must travel to work and were the essential workers that kept the country running during the pandemic. If you have differentiate working conditions between those that allowed to WFH and those forced to drive to work every day ,it doesn't do much for company solidarity.

Anecdotallying you hear of instances where something was missed or overlooked because so and so was working from home and was not there on site to rectify an issue immediately. Also if you are not on site the repercussions from making mistakes are not immediately evident to you as you are safe at home far away from it all
 
joe sod said:
Another factor never discuss about this is the unfairness on workers that must travel to work and were the essential workers that kept the country running during the pandemic.
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Yep, Supermarket employees, truck drivers, warehouse employees, water and waste water treatment plant employees, power station employees etc all kept the country going during the pandemic. They were the most essential workers.
We shouldn't forget hospital employees either, they were important too.

Most jobs require the employee to be on site. Most people don't work in offices. The whole "getting back to the office" narrative from the Government and Civil Service and this proposed legislation shows a rather myopic view of the world.
 
dubdub123 said:
Did she get an updated employment contract to reflect remote working?
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That’s the ultimate question.

Assuming the original terms of employment specified the place of employment, unless these have been formally amended and agreed, they continue to apply.

The insistence on workers to return to their workplaces, in compliance with their contracts but contrary to recent custom and practice, hasn’t been tested yet by the WRC but it’s surely only a matter of time.
 
True, but in this case the below might have some bearing on things;
johnmck said:
The company had a meeting a couple of months ago in which they said they were happy with anybody remote working and they could continue to do so.
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The company I work for continually say we will not be required to return to the office unless we want to at board level (via 3 montly all-hands) but at the same time, locally, they (management) are meeting to see what 'incentives' they can give to get people to come back into the office. I can see it all ending in tears
 
And have younger people paying massive rents in Dublin ,with no ability to save etc. You'll find younger people flocking to remote working jobs to start saving and living outside rip off Dublin
 
Contract wasn't updated. They've created a rushed remote working policy that states 3 days in office , 2 days from home. Not really remote is it if you're in the office more than home. Anyway, she's highly skilled and will be appreciated elsewhere. We now live in the country away from rip off Dublin and we couldnt be happier
 
There's a lot of remote roles out there, particularly across software development and related roles.
It does sound like this company is trying to downsize, by forcing people to quit, but not pay redundancy. There may be others here who know about employment law etc, but notbsure if thats worth the stress.
If she can hold this job for the minute, while shes looking elsewhere is probably her best bet.
 
ArthurMcB said:
Rip off dublin?

Last time I checked everywhere in Ireland is a rip off. Every, single, nook and cranny.
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1 bed apartment Dublin €2000 per month to rent.
Renting a 4 bed house in the country , €750 per month....
You do the math
 
johnmck said:
1 bed apartment Dublin €2000 per month to rent.
Renting a 4 bed house in the country , €750 per month....
You do the math
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No doubt about it, property is more expensive in dublin and always has been as long as i can remeber and same across the world.

But, my point, is simply that - property aside, the rest of the country is as expensive and as much a rip off as dublin.

In fact more so in some ways. At least in dublin you coukd prob justify a €3.50 coffee on basis of rent. Not so, in parts of the west. Yet the same coffee is still €3.50. Just 1 example, i could give more.
 
True, was in Sligo last weekend. In what used to be a good restaurant, now turned into muck. Worst food I've had in years. 3 of us paid €75 for a lunch. Total rip off. €13 for a indigestible soggy Bruschetta
 

That assumes there is a culture of knowledge transfer in the organization.

But many places complain they can't find People with the right skills and experience. I wonder how many have internal mentoring and training programs in place.

But many people find they have to change jobs frequently to progress. Which suggests this knowledge transfer isn't all that common.

I am biased in all this having worked remotely and in eLearning. I don't think being in office or remotely is inherently better or worse. It depends on the quality of all the people involved. Its too easy to take shortcut on quality doing it remotely or in the office. Then use this as excuse to push an agenda.

Working and learning remotely has been a thing for decades. Bit late to tell people it doesn't work.

I don't disagree with with you that there are advantages to being in the office and for some, many it's the right place for them. I'm just broadening that discussion.

All that said. Employees don't be able to dictate their terms. Other than voting with their feet and changing jobs to those with the conditions they prefer. Be that working in an office or working remotely, or a hybrid of both.
 
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