Reform of the 'L' drivers system: after husband's death on St Stephen's Day, 2004.


The poor standard of driving in Ireland is not just learner drivers fault. There are plenty of people on the road who got an amnesty from ever sitting a test. As someone who sees the standard of driving on the M1 every day, I can tell you it is not young inexperienced drivers that have a death wish.

It should be reformed but I have yet to see the statistics to show that provisional/learner drivers are responsible for the amount of deaths on our roads. They shouldn't be on the road but other road users can't use them as a convenient excuse for the crap driving on Irish roads.
 
from how they are driving - surely you can see if the driver behind or before you is experienced or not, even if both are not sticking to the rules, you can differentiate between mistakes due to lack of knowledge or simple ignorance
 
haminka1 said:
from how they are driving - surely you can see if the driver behind or before you is experienced or not, even if both are not sticking to the rules, you can differentiate between mistakes due to lack of knowledge or simple ignorance
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I see plenty of 40-50 year olds drive carelessy, ignorantly and dangerously. I see so called experienced drivers cut lanes without indicating. I see them mis-using the fast lane on motorways. I see them tailgate. I see road rage.
 
jhegarty said:
But we have a lower death rate than Australia and NZ.

Why would you take a model from a country where more people are killed ?
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In absolute terms maybe, but what if we do the comparisons in terms of RTA fatalities per million vehicular kilometers travelled, per licenced driver, per capita, per mile of roadway or per registered vehicle? Some of these comparisons seem to indicate we are marginally worse than NZ but in almost all cases significantly worse than Oz.
 
Sunny said:
I see plenty of 40-50 year olds drive carelessy, ignorantly and dangerously. I see so called experienced drivers cut lanes without indicating. I see them mis-using the fast lane on motorways. I see them tailgate. I see road rage.
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so do i, that's what i'm saying - ignorance - but surely this behaviour starts to certain extent with poor standards set for driving? and this includes the possibility to drive on the road without any previous lessons and tests passed?
 
There are some L drivers who are extremly careful and there are some who are dangerouse. Likewise there are plenty of drivers who've passed their driving test and don't know how to drive properly and safely, drive cars that are too powerful for the skill-set and have no respect for anyone on the road. Personally, I'd like to see another driving licence category be introduced for anyone driving an SUV/4x4 or cars over a particuler engine size with a requisite test before they are allowed drive those cars

However what I don't understand in this country is our reluctance to prosecute someone for manslaughter where they kill someone on the road due to their reckless and irresponsible behaviour. That to me is the big issue. In the US they have the crime of vehicular manslaugher, why not have it here?
 
Just out of interest, how many of those objecting to the system involving provisional licences took advantage of the old lax approach while they were learning?
 
Does anyone have a figure on how many L drivers are responsible for causing crashes on our roads?


Got some here:


So 1 in 5 in 2008. That's 20% for the L's and 80% for the experienced.

For 2009 they were accounted for 17% of road deaths. It seems to me that the more 'experienced' drivers are the real threat on our roads.

Learner drivers accounted for 13pc of all drivers killed on the roads in 2008 -- 17 out of 125 driver fatalities. And around 32 learner drivers were injured in serious crashes.
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But how many of the 13% were responsible for the crashes? More scare mongering by the government.

http://www.independent.ie/national-...rivers-caught-in-garda-clampdown-2152393.html
 
jhegarty said:
Given L drivers make up more than 13% of driver , it would make them the safer type of driver.
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According to the CSO, in 2008, 12% of the 2.6M licenses in the state were learner permits,

This was down from 18% in 2007.
 
huskerdu said:
According to the CSO, in 2008, 12% of the 2.6M licenses in the state were learner permits,

This was down from 18% in 2007.
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ah, didn't know about the dropped number.

So basically both groups are just as safe.
 
Anyone got stats for drivers of 95-02 Micras ? They're bleedin' lethal !!!

I avoid them like the plague, but one of them still managed to crash into me (driving big red saloon) on clear bright day. He was an unaccompanied L-driver too, but not that it matters as we've just determined (and the Garda didn't bat an eyelid at that fact either!).
I swear, they're like the Jonahs of the motoring world. Inevitably drawn towards creating mayhem and carnage !
 

North of the border, newly qualified drivers have to display an R in their windows where their L would have been, they have a reduced speed limit and the number of penalty points needed to lose your license is halved so two speeding offences would put them off the road.
 

Doesnt stop them speeding and doing dangerous overtaking on the M1 betweeen Dundalk and Dublin.
 
csirl said:
Doesnt stop them speeding and doing dangerous overtaking on the M1 betweeen Dundalk and Dublin.
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Aye, it's only the nordies that do it as well. I'm a regular on that stretch of motorway and I've yet to see a Garda car on it. Maybe that's the problem, people speed where they know they'll get away with it.
 
I'm also a regular on that road and i too am yet to se a Garda car on it. I'm also yet to see an 'R' Plate displayed in a northern reg car on it. The northern reg cars do drive faster. They also drive far more competently.
 
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