Pre deceased by a child and similar questions

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GOGOGONE

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Just wondering how this works out.

A parent (of 5) with dementia (ie not going to be changing their will) has a will to divide a home property between 2 and the residue between the other 3.

One of the 2 (who will receive a joint share of the property) is now terminally ill and is leaving all they have to nieces and nephews (no kids or spouse).

So three questions;
a. if the child dies first, where does the joint share go?
b. if the child dies second can the other joint owner be forced to sell (to get funds for the care of the ill child)
c. is it possible in any way for the property to be sold if desired to cover the care costs of the parent? There is no power of attorney in place to activate and the children are unlikely to agree to a collective effort to ask a court for power to sell.
 
a. As they have no children, their share may lapse but it will really depend on the wording of the will.
b. That depends on the circumstances, yes of course one can go to court if necessary to get an order to sell but the court will decide on the merits of that case.
c. Yes, by making parent a ward of court or, under the terms of the Assisted Decision Making Capacity Act 2015 which was enacted in December, but not yet signed into effect, there will be a way to apply to the circuit/high court to appoint a decision maker who can apply to sell the property to cover care costs- the department of justice has stated they hope it will be in effect in the third quarter of this year. In the alternative can apply for a care representative under the Fair Deals scheme.
 
A parent (of 5) with dementia (ie not going to be changing their will) has a will to divide a home property between 2 and the residue between the other 3.

So, one property left to two children and estate residue left to other 3?

One of the 2 (who will receive a joint share of the property) is now terminally ill and is leaving all they have to nieces and nephews (no kids or spouse).

They can only leave what they actually own, they cannot leave the share of the property that is willed to them, because it is not theirs if the parent is alive when they pass.

So three questions;
a. if the child dies first, where does the joint share go?

No children and no spouse - I am not a legal expert, but to my mind this goes back to the estate to be divided between the other children.

EDIT: If child dies before person who willed property to them, then child cannot will what they have not received.

b. if the child dies second can the other joint owner be forced to sell (to get funds for the care of the ill child)

If the parent dies and leaves half of property to the second child, who in turn wills it to the nephews and nieces - then to the best of my knowledge the joint owner has to either have their permission or have the funds to buy them out. Each owner cannot be forced to sell if they do not want to.

c. is it possible in any way for the property to be sold if desired to cover the care costs of the parent? There is no power of attorney in place to activate and the children are unlikely to agree to a collective effort to ask a court for power to sell.

The only thing I am thinking of here is the fair deal scheme, if a person went into a state run home then they could have come to an arrangement with the state that on their death and on the sale of their home, their cost from the home could be deducted from the sale.
 
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Reading this with interest and a question comes up. If the child dies first then what happens to the wishes expressed in the parents will of leaving them half the house. Does it get divided among the surviving children or is it still applied to the estate of the dead child.
 
"If the child dies first then what happens to the wishes expressed in the parents will of leaving them half the house"

It really depends on whether the child had children, in that case his/her share is divided between the deceased child's children.

"Does it get divided among the surviving children"

If the sibling has no children.

"or is it still applied to the estate of the dead child."

Well in a sense you could say it is when it's divided between his/her children, if you understand what I mean.

But if there are no children and the child (sibling) is dead - then it simply goes back into the estate which is then divided equally between the remaining siblings.

Just a caveat here - this is based on my own experience, not knowledge, it's always best to seek legal advice.
 
@GOGOGONE: To my knowledge it all depends on the wording in the will regarding the bequest of the house. If it is left jointly as joint tenants to both children and one child dies in the lifetime of the testatrix then the lapsed share goes to the other joint tenant. On the otherhand if it is left equally (as tenants in common) then the lapsed share falls into the residue. This is in the situation you have described where the ill child has no issue.
 
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