Planning permission .... 'occupancy' condition

C

Culchie

Registered User
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Hi,

Delighted to have just received planning permission after being refused initially (North west Region).

One of the conditions of planning is that we must 'occupy' the house for a period of 7 years ...i.e Not Sell.

I've heard before of these conditions.........but ...How can they be enforced?

Unforeseeen circumstances may dictate in a few years time that we have to liqudise our assets.... what are the consequences of this?

Maybe we split up, maybe illness strikes, maybe some American comes along and offers $6M for our house...etc

Surely this sort of restriction is against our Civil Liberties? ... It's our house and our asset? ....Isn't It?
 
Very easy to enforce - noone will be allowed to get a mortgage on it.

It might be a restriction of your civil liberties, but it is a lawful restriction of those liberties. (As the most obvious example, a convict can say "You can't put me in jail - that's a restriction of my civil liberties")

The right to property under the constitution is subject to the common good.
So for example, if land is required for a new road - for the benefit of the population at large - then land can be CPOed.
As another example, if I live next to you, I am not allowed to build a nuclear waste storage facility without getting Permission for such.

Presumably you are in an area with a large amount of one off housing in a greenbelt area surrounding a city.
You should realise that Ireland is the only country in the Western World that allows one off housing to the extent that it does. (Northern Ireland used to have a similarly high rate - but that was recently stopped by diktat from Westminster). One off housing is very expensive for the state, is very damaging to the environment, damages the community, and makes public transport very difficult. For this reason it does need to be controlled.

(rant over)
 
I don't know how they go about enforcing it - I imagine as with all planning conditions that there probably is limited enforcement (ie none!)

It is not a restriction of civil liberties as you have agreed to it as part of a condition of pp - you could have decided that this didnt suit you & gone off and bought a house.
To be honest this is one of the few conditions of pp that I actually agree with & I would be willing to give a committment of more than 7 years if they will just give me pp!
That said obviously things happen that could not be forseen & I imagine that if it is something beyond your control then this could be presented as a genuine argument (except for the american offering 6m!)
 
Superman said:
Very easy to enforce - noone will be allowed to get a mortgage on it.

It might be a restriction of your civil liberties, but it is a lawful restriction of those liberties. (As the most obvious example, a convict can say "You can't put me in jail - that's a restriction of my civil liberties")

The right to property under the constitution is subject to the common good.
So for example, if land is required for a new road - for the benefit of the population at large - then land can be CPOed.
As another example, if I live next to you, I am not allowed to build a nuclear waste storage facility without getting Permission for such.

Presumably you are in an area with a large amount of one off housing in a greenbelt area surrounding a city.
You should realise that Ireland is the only country in the Western World that allows one off housing to the extent that it does. (Northern Ireland used to have a similarly high rate - but that was recently stopped by diktat from Westminster). One off housing is very expensive for the state, is very damaging to the environment, damages the community, and makes public transport very difficult. For this reason it does need to be controlled.

(rant over)
Click to expand...

That's a fair enough explanation. We'll agree to disagree on your views on damaging environment, community etc....

When you are lucky enough to have a choice to build on your own land, versus the option of living in a large town, then it's not a difficult decision to come to....hopefully we might add something to the local community, rather than damage it.

The planning permission comes with a €7800 services invoice with it, so as far as I'm concerned, we're certainly paying our own way.
 
You should go to archiseek.com and look up the threads on one off housing.

Environment:
Septic Tanks,
Use of car (Irish car use is 50% higher than even American (!) usage)
distances mean that car use is higher, which means reduction in pedestrian and bicycle use (distance and then safety), decrease in exercise as a result,
decrease in public transport (particular types of transport system require specific densities of population - one off housing makes all forms of public transport more or less redundant).

Costs to State:
Postal deliveries, (which are independent of cost)
School Bus,
Ambulances,
Cost of upkeep of road. Amount of Road network compared to population density (which in Ireland is very high)
Electricity provision.
Also it means that whenever the State wishes to build a dump etc. - there is nowhere where they can build without being within a mile of some house.


Don't get me wrong - a significant amount of the work I do is one off housing, also if I were in a position to build in the countryside on parent's land etc. (thus saving €200k+) I would. However, I acknowledge the objective detriment to the subjective benefit that I get.
 
Now that you have planning permission, the next step will be to apply for a mortgage to build the house. One of the first things the bank will look for will be a letter from the council stating that they will allow a resale of the house if you default on a mortgage within the seven years. County councils issue these routinely.

This might be one way of getting the house sold but your credit rating won't be too healthy!
 
Usually 'a get out clause' in the permission such as the point above, depends very much on the authority who gives the permission, and the details/reasons that may be cited for a reduction in the number of years of occupancy.
 
If you were to try to sell before 7 years, the purchaser's solicitor would probably spot the requirement and it may be that the sale can't go through. Having said that, I do think the council do make exceptions. E.g. if someone got seriously ill and needed to live near a hospital. However I think an american offering you $6m wouldn't be considered a valid reason to make an exception.
 
If you have valid reasons for moving - eg loss of job, illness etc then you can apply to the council for a 'letter of comfort' for the purchaser to say that effectively they will not enforce the condition. I think practically that even if you wanted to sell if a developer made you an offer you couldn't refuse then you could put pressure on your local councillor to obtain such a letter for you.
 
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