Penalty Points, should i appeal?

Status
Not open for further replies.
sam h said:
I also think you you should fight this. The rules of the road state that when you are being overtaken:

[/list]The guy in the truck should not have sped up & you moved back onto your side of the road as soon as it was safe.
Click to expand...

Thats all very well but the issue is with the OP not the truck driver.
 
television said:
Yes it does if part of the overtaking manouver involved him cross continous white lines.
Click to expand...

Agree with television here, thats exactly what it means.

Obviously the police can't prove if the lorry sped up or not, thats just the OPs word. Its not a nice situation but the OP did cross a continous white line, which is not allowed.
 
television said:
Yes it does if part of the overtaking manouver involved him cross continous white lines.
Click to expand...

Rediculous arguement. Technically he didnt cross over the white line when he initiated the over taking manouvre. Think of the amount of road that is covered when you are over taking a vehicle at 80 to 100 KM/h.

From rules of road:

All traffic must keep to the left of the line (except in an emergency or for access).



Note for access - if driver has committed to manouvre then he must get access back onto left side.

Taking this a step further check out the over taking rules:



I dont see here where it says the user must not cross back over a continuous white line when completing the over taking, or should check ahead in case there is a continuous white line which could be 400 or 500 metres ahead. Its common sense.

Anyways if the user does encounter a continuous white line doesnt he/she have to cross back over it either way whether he passes the car out or waits till the car he is attempting to pass passes him out.

I would contest it OP.
 
Yes, people focusing on the continous white line and saying that it's black and white need to explain what should be done??? If you start a perfectly legal over taking manoveur on broken white lines and then it becomes a continous white line what can be done? The unbroken white line must be crossed again.. it seems immaterial to me whether the driver continues to overtake.. or slows down to re-enter behind the truck.

Some poster said that an early warning will be given of unbroken white lines... (a double broken white line) I personally don't know about that.. probably because there were no rules of the road available for about 8 years... when I was learning to drive, and for about 4 years after..

Contesting a case like this is a bit of a nightmare.. it's unlikely that the detective would turn up.. anyway the OP seems to have a reasonable point. However I have contested cases like this, and seen it go nowhere.. depends on the judge I think. At least the judge may be able to advise how you'd get back across the unbroken white line once you've been effectively tricked into crossing it.
 
From Cayne's link above the thing about the double broken white lines indicating a unbroken white line ahead is accurate... and it mentions that such a double broken white line should not be crossed...

However how can one know whether the double broken line will become a unbroken line, because it may become a broken single white line?
 

Not sure all that makes any sense!!!! Any of it!

And as for my argument being ridiculous; im afraid its actually the law. Again if you cross over a continous white line to overtake you have broken the law. Simple really.
 
JoeBallantin said:
At least the judge may be able to advise how you'd get back across the unbroken white line once you've been effectively tricked into crossing it.
Click to expand...

Its about taking personal resonsibility really. When you are driving you have a duty to be careful, not to take unncessery risks and read the road conditions ahead. If you fail to read those conditions take unnecessary risks than it is likely you will get into the kind of situation the OP got into. He needs to stop blaiming the truck driver, guards, etc and admit he was wrong and stop trying to get out of it.
 
JoeBallantin said:
Yes, people focusing on the continous white line and saying that it's black and white need to explain what should be done???
Click to expand...

that kind of logic could be used as a defence against all cases of someone who overtakes on a continous white line as long as if it begins on a broken white line!!
 

But television, if ahead of you the line is broken when you overtake (as far as the eye can see) this surely is not an unnecessary risk and it is a correct reading of the conditions? You can read conditions but not predict conditions - indeed predicting conditions and making decisions on that would be dangerous. If you are then in a position where you have to cross a continous line it seems unfair that you are breaking the law - is it just tough luck?

It would seem to me, if that is true, to remain within the law you should only overtake in areas you know. I had a driving experience where I overtook someone (something I very very rarely do - Im usually being overtaken) on a route that I drive everyday however road works had taken place and what was a broken white line the previous Friday became a continous white line. Luckily it was 2 lane road so I just had to remain in the faster lane rather than overtake back into the slower lane. However if it had been one way each way I would have had no choice but to break the law.

My point being you can read conditions correctly but still find yourself very easily in the OPs position. It does seem unfair.
 
television said:
Again if you cross over a continous white line to overtake you have broken the law. Simple really.
Click to expand...

But he didnt cross the white line to over take!

Anyways I think your winding people up here. Quote the rules of the road where it says that you cant cross back over the continuous white line after completing an over taking manouvre.

I accept you cant cross over white line to initiate an over taking manouvre. But the OP didnt do this.

As a matter of interest how long are you driving?
 
Smashbox said:
Agree with television here, thats exactly what it means.

Obviously the police can't prove if the lorry sped up or not, thats just the OPs word. Its not a nice situation but the OP did cross a continous white line, which is not allowed.
Click to expand...

Smashbox some things are unavoidable like for example if your driving down the road with a continous white line, now on the other side of the line the road is empty and suddenly a pedestrian falls or is pushed onto the road a few yards in front of you in your lane, now you can stay on your side of the road, just break and hope the pedestrian magically dissapears or you will hit him but all's well as long as you don't cross the white line because thats now allowed right . If you think people 100% shouldn't cross a continous you shouldn't be driving as this narrow mindedness is dangerous. Just making a point guys, safety first..


television said:
Thats all very well but the issue is with the OP not the truck driver.
Click to expand...

No television the truck driver is the issue, thats why this whole incident happened and why i posted in the first place
​
 

Just because it does not specifficaly say that is does not mean it is legal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Obviously the rules of the road cannot refer to all possible senarios as that would be completly impossible!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are you seriously telling me that it is okay to finish an overtaking manouver on a continous white line if it begins on a broken white line??? Can you see the complete chaos that kind of logic would cause in the courts. Any insane driver could use it to as a defence to drive like a mad man. Traffic rules are made to be clear to stop people trying to use any excuse to dodge the law and stop people acting like idiots.

Cayne said:
As a matter of interest how long are you driving?
Click to expand...

WHat kind of a question is that? I could tell you I have been driving 30 years and wht would that matter really. Just to say I have been driving a a long time and i have 0 PPs on my licence.
 
blueblood said:

No television the truck driver is the issue, thats why this whole incident happened and why i posted in the first place
Click to expand...

Oh I see now. I thought the issue was you asking wheather or not to appeal. The issue happened because of the way you were ddriving. Again blaim the guards, the truck driver, your mammy etc, but you were still driving the car!!!
 
If you think people 100% shouldn't cross a continous you shouldn't be driving as this narrow mindedness is dangerous
Click to expand...

I didn't say that. You are not allowed to overtake on a continous white line, surely this white line was there for a reason ie. corner, hill crest, etc. Its there for a reason, its unsafe to be on the other side of the road at that time, and the OP WAS on the wrong side of the road at that time.
 
My reading of the rules of the road (I had a look yesterday & it doesn't give an exact answer
- You should not start to over take on a continuous white line - there does not seem to be a reference to completing an overtaking manevour where a broken line become a continuous one
- where there is a white line - you should not start to overtake & you should keep to the left of the line => the OP was endevouring to keep to the left of the white line by pulling back in. The OP may have completed the manevour while the line was still broken if the the truck driver had not speed up.

There are many short stretches on broken white line that return to contineous and there is not way a car could complete within the broken line part.
 
television said:
Just because it does not specifficaly say that is does not mean it is legal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Obviously the rules of the road cannot refer to all possible senarios as that would be completly impossible!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Click to expand...

Doesnt make it illegal either which is the bones of your arguement. If you were to over take some one and the line changes to continuous the onus on the driver is to quickly get back on the left side within the speed limit. No where does it say they must hold back - this would be a reckless thing to do in my opinion.

Anyways enough said as I think we re all entrenched in our views on this one. But I do take your point.
 
television said:
Oh I see now. I thought the issue was you asking wheather or not to appeal. The issue happened because of the way you were ddriving. Again blaim the guards, the truck driver, your mammy etc, but you were still driving the car!!!
Click to expand...

Television are you for real?You know that one of the reasons there's an appeal system is because not everything in the real world is black and white, there's also a grey area. Stop trying to wind people up as a number of people here think you might be doing. If your not doing this then seriously take a good look at yourself .
​

B.T.W i'd be very interisted (more curious tho) to know what would you do in this situation without upsetting anyone and without crossing the continous white line -(since i'm still waiting for a responce to this question from Smashbox)

some things are unavoidable like for example if your driving down the road with a continous white line, now on the other side of the line the road is empty and suddenly a pedestrian falls or is pushed onto the road a few yards in front of you in your lane, now you can stay on your side of the road, just break and hope the pedestrian magically dissapears or you will hit him but all's well as long as you don't cross the white line because thats now allowed right . If you think people 100% shouldn't cross a continous you shouldn't be driving as this narrow mindedness is dangerous. Just making a point guys, safety first

There's loads more hypothetical questions where through no fault of your own or circumstances outside your control you might be forced into a split decision and have little choice but to brake the law to prevent a tragedy. If you cant think of any then poor poor you, tut tut tut
 

i am not trying to wind you up far from it actually, if your driving had caused an accident you or someone else coudl have been hurt. It actually winds me up that you think your so innocent.​



blueblood said:
B.T.W i'd be very interisted (more curious tho) to know what would you do in this situation without upsetting anyone and without crossing the continous white line -(since i'm still waiting for a responce to this question from Smashbox).
Click to expand...

I would never and have never overtaken over continous white lines, I just dont do it. If I ever did like your situation I would except that I was driving take and accept personal responsibility


this is a very different situation. You would have no choice but to break the law to save a persons life, now if a guard had giiven you two points in that situation then he would be a muppet and Id say youd probably have a good defence to give to the judge on appeal! However in your suituation you were not faced with a huge ethical/moral delema, you just took it opon yourself to overtake a truck without due regard to the road conditions. The guards were behind you seen you breaking the law and pulled you up on it. End of story.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Menu
Log in
Register