Parents have no will

And they also do it in case one of them has an undeclared child and may wish to make provision for that child etc ! Great pressure can be brought to bear on people to make wills.
 
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A will costs relatively little, and you can make it include children yet to be born, I've done so.
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I just dont see the point in having a Will if you want your estate to be passed as per the standard inheritance rules. Whats the point? Why over complicate things? A Will is a much weaker document than standard inheritance rules, so why do one? Are you familiar with the phrase "If it ain't broken dont fix it". You've nothing to gain and everything to lose as there is always the risk that there will be a mistake, challenge or legal complication with the Will.

Yes, for non-standard inheritance and special circumstances, you should make a Will, but not if you estate is to follow the standard rules in inheritance legislation.
 
Bronte said:
And they also do it in case one of them has an undeclared child and may wish to make provision for that child etc ! .
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What if one of the children was not fathered by the husband but has been passed off as his? Does this child have the same inheritance rights as the other 3?
 

If a client comes to me to make a will, and it turns out that he wants to benefit the people who will benefit anyway on intestacy I will tell him this.

Many people want to make a will regardless for a myriad of reasons:

To appoint an executor, to detail funeral arrangements, for distribution of trinkets, family heirlooms, jewellry, care of pets, and even to give reasons why they want to benefit certain people ( or not, as the case may be).

There is one technical difference in the extraction of a grant in either case- an administration bond is required on an intestacy.
 
Dove said:
What if one of the children was not fathered by the husband but has been passed off as his? Does this child have the same inheritance rights as the other 3?
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Isn't there some assumption in Irish law that the children of a marriage are de facto fathered by the husband even if this is not actually the case?

Or dealing with the case of a minor where both parents die and trustees/guardians need to be appointed perhaps? Otherwise, as far as I know, the estate is in limbo until they turn 18?
 
Be careful. Intestacy rules may not achieve the desired result.

If assets are e.g. in the sole name of one of the parents and that parent is the one to die first then under intestacy the estate is shared among surviving spouse and children. This can cause major problems when the surviving spouse and the children disagree as to the next steps. It can result e.g. in a situation where an elderly widow's children can force her to sell, what she most likely thought of as, family assets so they can take their share immediately.
 
When my father died intestate our solicitor told us my mother had a legal right to reside in the family home until the end of her days if she wished, despite 'only' owning 2/3 of it and my brother and myself owing the remaining 1/3-we could not force the sale of it. Hypothetically we could force the sale of the non-family home parts of the estate. This may be wrong, but it's what our solicitor told us.
 
Reading the OP's query , my advise would be to do nothing . The parents, particularly if they are farmers are more than likely well aware of the implications if they die intestate. With the other three siblings thinking that they will inherit, unless the OP for some reason thinks that he/she should also inherit, the OP will get nothing but grief from those abroad. Stay out of it, time will sort it out anyway. Your parents obviously are not too bothered about who will get what. Giving advise could lead to being accused of undue influence.
 

It's not wrong exactly, she would have been entitled to appropriate the family home towards her share.
 
Hi


How about your parents make a will that the house goes to you and then on your death it goes to the other siblings? Thats what my grandparents did.

They had 4 daughters (including my mum). They had a farm and my aunt who never married and had no kids was living with them looking after them. The other 3 children lived in various parts of Ireland. The farm and house were in my gran's name - she was an only child who had inherited it from her parents and she made a will that when she and my granddad died my aunt got the place for her life and on my aunt's death it went to the other 3 daughters. It meant when my grandparents did die my aunt stayed in the house and it couldn't be sold from under her. My aunt died and my mum and her other 2 sisters got the place equally between them and then its up to them what to do with their shares.
 

The potential problems there are first that a life estate such as that is virtually worthless for raising a mortgage which might be essential for maintaining the property, and second the potential CAT implications for the other siblings - CAT may be payable on the gift, so they may have to pay tax, and get no tangible benefit for several years. Its something worth considering, but its not necessarily the best option.
 
Slightly off topic - but in case anyone might be misled I point out the following

IMO anyone with young kids should make a will that at least provides for their guardianship in the event of both parents dying. Not a nice thought but very important.

The advice of posters to make no will and leave all to the intestacy laws overlooks the underage children.
 
 
I don't think they had to pay a huge amount of tax. Also someone a neighbour was working the land (it was a farm) and was paying rent so the place was generating an income. Also it prevented rows about who inherited what as everyone got an equal share.
 
Apologies in advance if I repeat anything mentionned above. I haven't had the time to go through it all. This was new to me too until my father in law died last year and my own father earlier this year. My father in law died intestate while my own father had left a will.

My advice having lived both situations is to strongly encourage your parents to leave a will. There is absolutely no penalty, hidden or otherwise to not leaving one. One thing which does make a difference though is that if one of your parents dies intestate, then a solicitor MUST deal with probate. For a start, this is going to cost money (for a modest estate, possibly in the region of 7 - 10 thousand Euro).

The only way to avoid this is to have a will and to deal with probate yourself (as a named executor on the will) after a parent's demise. I dealt with probate on my fathers demise and believe me, it is not difficult provided records of accounts, property title deeds etc are reasonably easily found. Of course you can employ a solicitor to do it but why waste that amount of money on a solicitor? While my father in law died almost a year ago now, his solicitor is not even close to achieving probate, my own father died in Jan and I received probate a month ago. This means that funds that may have been 'tied up' in accounts under my fathers name are now my mothers to do with as she pleases (and because there was a will, and the estate was left to her, there is no messy division of assets equally between surviving family members). I assume both of your parents are alive. If this is the case, if one dies intestate the estate will be divided equally between ALL remaining family members (including widow / widower).

From experience also - the lack of a will can cause serious family issues after the demise of a parent. This is not something I would recommend to anyone!

Good luck! W&P
 
Wing you are incorrect about the division of the estate on intestacy, if there is a spouse and children the spouse gets 2/3 and the children get 1/3. See Clubman's post for the details.
 
I stand corrected Bronte, thank you.

Another issue that merits investigation is whether or not the family home (and any other properties held) are in joint names, or one name.

If their is a will, and the property/s are in joint names, the property is automatically excluded from calculation of the deceased persons estate, as it reverts to the remaining joint name. This can save thousands in solicitors probate fees.

Food for thought!
 
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I presume you are also aware of the law relating to resulting trusts were joint property does not pass to the remaining joint tenant?

Sometimes the thousands in solicitors probates fees is money well spent because should anything go wrong (despite how simple it may seem) every practising solicitor is covered by professional indemnity insurance and any loss suffered will be compensated for.
 
No, Dazza21ie, unfortunately I am unaware of that law (not a solicitor!), and yes, sometimes the money spent on solicitors fees is indeed money well spent.

My points are simple.

1. 'No will' means default solicitor involvement in taking out probate, equals unnecessary expense. Some people may elect to employ a solicitor anyway.

2. Where a will exists, a named executor may take out probate on the deceased persons estate. It requires some work (and exercise) on the part of the executor, but it is very achievable, and possible to complete in many instances sooner than a solicitor (obviously depending on the solicitor!)

Having done it myself, I found it to be painless, and in my particular case I saved approximately €16,000 for my mother. I would rather that money remain in her pocket than in someone elses.

I found www.citizensadvice.ie to be an excellent service in this regard. Believe me, I have nothing against solicitors, but this particular exercise does not require one in the majority of everyday cases where a will exists.

VBR, W&P.
 
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I will reply using same numbers.

1. You can make a personal application with or without a will. The only difference is that if there is a will then the executor should be making the application. If there is no will it is governed by law as to who makes the application. Not everyone knows this law and most of them are solicitors so a person might employ the solicitor for their wisdom!

2. It is possible for an executor to take out a Grant of Probate. It may also be quicker to do this way also as a solicitor may have hundreds of files to work on but the executor may only have the one application to make. However, if the executor or any other person applying isn't careful it s/he could get into trouble. There is quite a few scenarios where an executor could be held secondarily liable e.g. payment of C.A.T, C.G.T on sales from the estate, claims by Department of Social & Family Affairs, claims by beneficaries etc.

It has been said on this site numerous times that for a simple estate DIY. The problem with that is the only people who really know whether it is a simple estate are solicitors who are trained to deal with the estate.
 
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