Opinion and Discussion: Household Charge.

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And where do you think they should get the money to provide you with this basic service?
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I don't know because I'm too busy paying off the banking debts while the bankers and politicians pay nothing.
I don't have any money left after helping my children in negative equity and who now have to pay this as well.
I pay for my waste collection and will have to do same for my water and need money for the carbon tax, the extra tax on petrol put on by BrianL, my car tax on the car the Gov persuaded me to buy is going up.

Ever hear of not getting blood out of a stone????
 
thedaras said:
And where do you think they should get the money to provide you with this basic service?
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Perhaps if the local authorities budgets were not slashed so that money could be poured into the black hole of bank debt there would be money to pay for a basic service.

I live in a privately managed estate which will never be taken in charge by the local authority and I already pay management fees each year to cover services.
 
monagt said:
Ever hear of not getting blood out of a stone????
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I don't know how you private finances stack up, but the state is paying €5k more per household than it takes in and it's pretty much exhausted all other sources of funds.

Expecting that we can continue to enjoy the same level of services from the state without paying more tax also fits in with the 'blood from a stone' analogy.
 
thedaras said:
Seems to me that they are using vast amounts of energy on problems and zero on solutions!
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Agree 100%. It's like the 'Occupy' protests in terms of a lack of one single killer argument.

When you get 20 different reasons as to why people won't pay it it sound more like excuses.
 
DerKaiser said:
Expecting that we can continue to enjoy the same level of services from the state without paying more tax also fits in with the 'blood from a stone' analogy.
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Except the states stone is bloated with PS pay and SW payments that could be looked at. Whereas my personal stone has nothing left in it.
 
truthseeker said:
Except the states stone is bloated with PS pay and SW payments that could be looked at.
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An therein lies the issue. The state could obviously allocate its resources in a way you would perceive as being fairer, but someone in the PS or on SW would not agree with your view.

We've collectively elected a government to make decisions on what's a fair way of raising revenues and allocating spending. I would do it one way, you would do it another, someone in the PS might have a different view, whilst someone on SW will have other ideas.

We can't all get our way. Collectively we need to stump up that €160m from somewhere. If we don't pay a flat tax amounting to €160m, we will either get €160m less of services or pay €160m extra taxes in some other form. The democratically elected government has made a decision.

In all honesty the €160m is actually a sideshow when you consider an addiditional €5bn-€10bn is needed in cuts/taxes.
 

I agree with you but fundamentally I think that people are angry about this particular tax for a variety of different reasons and it is unpalatable to what currently appears to be the majority of people liable for it to pay up under those circumstances. Its clear that people see this as an opportunity to protest by not paying.

The democratically elected government have gone back on their pre election promises and not followed through with their manifesto that allowed them to get elected in the first place. Not only that but if you remember back to the General Election, many many people claimed they were only voting FG to get rid of FF and that FG were the best of a bad lot - so I dont think there is a huge amount of government loyalty out there.

DerKaiser said:
In all honesty the €160m is actually a sideshow when you consider an addiditional €5bn-€10bn is needed in cuts/taxes.
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Agreed - so why such bully boy tactics from the government on this drop in the ocean?

Even if I had been intending to pay, the recent behaviour of the government in relation to this issue has disgusted me and would make me far less inclined to do so. My FIL is actively worried that someone is going to knock on his front door demanding money or that somehow his electricity will be cut off because they bandied about ESB bills in the media as a way of tracking people down. Disgraceful behaviour.

Edited to add - and now on foot of the government issuing threats of people calling to your door - the con men have taken the opportunity - it was obvious that this is what would happen.

 
ajapale said:
Is a precursor property tax levied on property owners.
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The problem I have is that for the overwhelming number of those liable, even a property tax instead of a charge like this is a tax on their debt not on their wealth. Capital gains or inheritance tax is a tax on wealth. Why don't they just introduce capital gains tax on the family home instead if they feel so strongly about taxing wealth ? At least people would then be able to feel secure in their homes in their old age, homes they worked hard for and already paid huge taxes for without fear that the taxman can ''evict'' them.
 
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