NPPR disproportionate interest - paying principal only for now and taking a case?


I just posted a comment on this tax on this thread http//www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=188893 and especially the consequences it has on emigrants living abroad. I want to wish Mat the best of luck in his appeal, please keep us posted.
 
wbbs said:
Let the Joe Duffy public know you are planning an appeal, lots of people on there all week who would be interested I imagine.
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Covered in the program today (though thankfully Joe himself was away).

I didn't hear all of it, but what was striking was that (a) everyone was saying they had no issue with paying the original charge and (b) how disproportionate the penalty is.

To those who say: it's up to you to make yourself aware of charges and taxes, there was a couple of examples of people who emigrated. They didn't know about the charge, not being aware of the radio and newspaper ads which were apparently the only way that it was signalled (and apparently many of these misleadingly referred to second homes).

It all seems grossly unfair: as someone pointed out we've had two amnesties on the past where penalties were waived for people who knowingly evaded tax, so why insist on them for people who are willing to pay once made aware they had to? I'm sure some proportionate residual penalty would be accepted by those affected, but the existing penalty is way over the top given the circumstances, much less the increased one from next month.
 
I'm Interested Mat - I'm the OP on a previous post below, got stung for 2+k while living overseas. I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to round up a few more to add to your case. Personally I'm aware of one other couple in the same boat - a bit of googling will uncover hundreds.

http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=180288

PM me if theres anything I can help with.

Cheers,
Justin
 
Many thanks for all the goodwill and advice out there from posters like Dermot, Sahd and Brendan and others...

Just to say I will now move forward with the case, once the legal advice stays on my side to do so. As mentioned at the start of this thread, I did pay the principal last week along with a letter of appeal regarding the extortionate penalties for late payment.

One has to feel a bit sorry for the local Councils dealing with this, it can't be easy. The Joe Duffy show outlined the fact they were simply overwhelmed by the NPPR issue.

Cheers folks!
 
P.S. I will contact pilotsnipes and Justin once I get my act together - re: appeal.
 
I'm writing from the UK on behalf of my elderly parents. They're both Irish but living in England. They bought a small cottage in Co Offaly some years ago and all of the family use it for occasionally for holidays to Eire.
They, nor any of us, knew anything about this tax until a family member living in Eire was also 'caught' as they have a second home on the coast.
Like Mat they've been hit with a bill for €4200 for something they knew nothing about.
They have owned the house for over 20 years and pay all their local taxes and bills. The first actual written bill they had was for the figure mentioned above which was posted to the Offaly address a few weeks ago.
I find the whole thing appalling. It would never, ever happen like this in the UK. How can they be expected to know of a tax imposed in another country having never had any correspondence from the Irish Government.
To me this is a mean, unpleasant and underhanded way to raise revenue.
My parents are law abiding citizens who love the land of their birth. They are both in their 70's and really could do without this upset.
Had they known about this years ago, they would have paid as they do with all the other charges relating to the cottage.
Personally, this has left a bad taste in my mouth.
 

So who collects post from the Offaly address? Is there a possibility that the initial letters were sent but ignored, or got lost in junk mail? In fairness, if you have a house in a country, you need some way of managing your affairs there. How do you expect the Govt to deal with the property owner?
 

The main point at issue here. There was no postal communication Good Bad or otherwise about the NPPR for anybody until about August of this year and that was to notify people that if they did not settle the bill etc there would be an extra large penalty coming into force on the 01/09/2014.
I have a lot of sympathy for ex Pats in this particular scenario.
BTW. I did not suffer from this extortion as I was fully compliant.
 
On a (totally unrelated but potential amusing) follow-up note to Dermot about ex-pats (near and far) getting absolutely zero correspondence regarding NPPR liability until the recent 15 August 2014 letter they sent me and stumpymonkey's unfortunate & needlessly upset elderly parents in England ...

I was a little amused to see that Irish Water found me here in the wilds of Northern Ireland... their letter about water charges for the Dublin house arrived promptly yesterday! They must have their Revenue records straight at least. Fair play to them.

But back to the topic - should anyone else want to add themselves to my list for appeal - please do so today/tmoro - as I get the act together this week to proceed.
 
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Hi, my fathers brother-in-law collects thee post on a regular basis and forwards it on. The ONLY correspondence on this matter was the bill for €4200 with the threat to claim and extra €3000 if the demand wasn't settled by 1 Sept.
You'll never meet a more law abiding couple than my parents. They visit Eire at least 4 times a year and knew absolutely nothing of this charge until the final demand!
As I said, all taxes etc are paid to Offaly Council and have been since they bought the house some 30 years ago. The Council know exactly who owns the place and sent no communication whatsoever about this tax. They should be ashamed of themselves.
 
=MAT= said:
But back to the topic - should anyone else want to add themselves to my list for appeal - please do so today/tmoro - as I get the act together this week to proceed.
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@Mat - out of interest, do you recommend sending a letter of appeal as well.

I like yourself, have paid the penalties last week - but I haven't sent in a separate letter about this issue and i'm beginning to think it might be a good idea to at least have some record of objection to the fees.
 
Sorry for belated reply. I would personally advise you to lodge a letter to appeal the disprportionate penalties paid by you and explain your grounds for making an appeal.

As regards the appeal discussed in this thread:
the AAM administrator has kindly agreed to email a note from me about the upcoming NPPR-appeal meeting planned to interested parties.
 
Mat, I am an emigrant living in the USA and just became aware of this ridiculous charge in the last few days. I am also in the process of selling the Property and it looks like I will have to pay the Euro 7.2k charge on a property worth about 200k. It seems like extortion and grossly unfair on people living in a different country who were unaware of this. It makes Ireland look like a banana republic. I would like to join the legal challenge also , although I will probably have to pay the charge to be able to sell the place. Please keep us posted and let me know if you need contact details to join this legal challenge. Whoever the idiots are that decided these grossly unfair penalties, should be held accountable.
 

I too wish to point out RainyDay that I as a non resident did not receive correspondance, until after, I registered in the first year of this. And this notification did not come from all county councils to me or others that I know in my family who are landlords.

Advertising in the national media is useless to foreign residents, even if you read online news you are not going to notice an ad.
 
Gman said:
, although I will probably have to pay the charge to be able to sell the place. .
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Yes you will have to pay the charge to sell. But you ought to separately object to your local council council.

In addition the solicitor for the purchaser will require proof that you have paid the household charge, and the LPT (local property tax).
 
Gman - I send my sympathies to you! It is a bit of a bad dream for most of us - but I am by now over it and want to take action and try to fight this if we have a quorum of people with energy to do so. Bronte is right that the three different taxes to be paid before you can sell, but the local propoerty taxes are reasonable amounts so I imagine you will be happy to pay them and they do not carry any disproportionate penalties like NPPR.

The NPPR appeal group has not gathered yet, so you are in time to join us. Since you and I and quite a few of the people who want to appeal this matter are away, we would need to skype perhaps? I am currently looking to options for a face-face meeting in Dublin or M50 in October and/or a virtual meeting and am very open to ideas.

MAT
 
Collective challenge to the NPPR

Mat I am interested. I live in New Zealand and knew nothing of the tax. My Council is Dublin City Council

There is at least one individual posting on the thread below, whom you might want to contact (scroll right down to the bottom)
mcgibney.ie/2012/06/14/nppr-deadline-only-2-weeks-away

I would be interested to see what can be acheived collaboratively

I can receive emails from other Askaboutmoney users, if you'd like to email me directly

Dublinjan
 
Re: NPPR open meeting:

For those interested in meeting up about penalties for late NPPR payments - we are considering a hotel just off the M50 on a weekday evening 8pm. (If you have thoughts about better location/time, do mention it asap. The date is in 2-3 weeks.)

We will be in touch later this week by private email through the AAM administrator.

cheers
MAT
 
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