Moving Out & Closing Utilities When Landlord is AWOL

Hi all,

I tried to contact my landlord at the end of July to tell him I wanted to move out at the end of August. I tried to call him several days in a row, and again at various time throughout August but his phone goes straight to voice mail so I haven't been able to contact him, I reckon he has got a number and hasn't told me about it. I don't have an address or e-mail address for him either.

As a result of this I didn't pay my last months rent and I assumed that he would eventually contact me when he realised that I hadn't paid. The weeks started to pass after the date rent was due (1st August) and still no contact from. I actually ended up staying in the apartment for 2 weeks in September as well as I hadn't sorted my next apartment and there was still no word from him.

I after moving out now anyway and I want to close my electricity account. However I believe that in order for the provider to transfer the account back into the landlords name they need to confirm this with them first (which makes sense). However given my landlord is unreachable, is my only option here to have the supply disconnected? I'll get caught for the disconnection fee and when the landlord does eventually surface, he'll get caught for the reconnection fee so we'll all be losers (except the provider)!

Thanks,
Daniel

Contact the PRTB, if the tenancy is registered (and it should be) they will have the landlord's details.

You should also be giving the required Notice of Termination - [broken link removed]

Thanks for the Páid. I doubt that we're registered with the PRTB. I never received a letter from the PRTB once I had moved in and the landlord never asked for my PPS number which I believe you need in order to register a tenancy.

How do I give the required Notice of Termination if I have no means of contacting the landlord?

You can look up the folio here - https://www.landdirect.ie/

The landlord's/owner's address should be listed on it. You might have to pay a nominal fee. I think I paid €5 for one a few years ago.

Send a registered letter to the landlord address on the lease, and/or last address you have. Also leave a copy of the letter in the house. Also call the landlord and retain the phone bills as evidence of your attempts to contact him.

Also send a letter to the utility providers stating that if they cannot contact the landlord within, say 10 days, that you are no longer to be held liable for the account from the move out date and that you should be removed, request written confirmation of this, eg final bill. If that means they disconnect then that is their decision, not yours.

I would also send copies of above to PRTB, again registered for proof of date, etc.

You will certainly have done your utmost. I don't see that you need to contact PRA re folio, etc.

Why go to all this trouble.

Contact the electricity company and tell them you are closing your account, give them the final reading and that is it.

It is not your responsibility or your right to put the landlords name on the account.

I don't know why the landlord is incommunicado but when he does resurface he or she may not thank you for interfering in his business.

@Páid I had a look on the land direct website but I cannot seem to click on my apartment, I can click on others around it but just none in my complex. It does havethe name of the complex though, strange that I can't click on it.

@Gerard123 The landlord actually used to live in the same town and I have that address. However he told me he was moving a few months ago so there's probably not much point in sending a registered letter to that address when I know for sure that he no longer lives there? I will leave a letter in the apartment though. Also I should have mentioned that I never signed a lease, I only know where he lived as he told me himself. Yes sending a letter to the PRTB is something I can do as well.

@cremeegg I agree that I should not be going to too much trouble myself about this as it is not my problem that my landlord has gone off the radar. So you say that it is not my responsibility or my right to put the landlords name on the account? So what is the correct procedure then for a tenant when they are vacating a property? I was always under the impression that I need to transfer the account into the name of the incoming tenant (if known) or the landlord. As long as the account is in my name I'm liable to pay for the usage. On the Electric Ireland website, they have an electronic form for closing an account and it has a field for the incoming tenant / landlord's name and contact number so this would suggest that the correct procedure is for the tenant to provide these details. It is not my intention to interfere in anyone's business, but I certainly don't want to have a disconnection fee applied to my final bill because the provider cannot contact the landlord to get their permission to have the account transferred to their name.

Even if the provider does apply a disconnection fee to my final bill, I have no intention of paying it. I will pay for the usage but I'm sure that the provider will still consider this as an account in arrears so they may flog it on to a debt collection agency who will send out the usual intimidating letters, etc. I just don't want this to have some sort of negative impact on my credit history.

Daniel said:

I agree that I should not be going to too much trouble myself about this as it is not my problem that my landlord has gone off the radar. So you say that it is not my responsibility or my right to put the landlords name on the account? So what is the correct procedure then for a tenant when they are vacating a property? I was always under the impression that I need to transfer the account into the name of the incoming tenant (if known) or the landlord. As long as the account is in my name I'm liable to pay for the usage. On the Electric Ireland website, they have an electronic form for closing an account and it has a field for the incoming tenant / landlord's name and contact number so this would suggest that the correct procedure is for the tenant to provide these details. It is not my intention to interfere in anyone's business, but I certainly don't want to have a disconnection fee applied to my final bill because the provider cannot contact the landlord to get their permission to have the account transferred to their name.

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If you give them they landlord/new tenants name, that is just you acting as unpaid marketing agent for the electricity company. They cannot put some other persons name on the bill on your say so. But if you give them the details they can make a sales call. Maybe the landlord wants to go with another provider, what business is it of yours to give some sales person his number?


[QUOTE="Daniel, post: 1445140, member: 91127"][USER=66915]Even if the provider does apply a disconnection fee to my final bill, I have no intention of paying it. I will pay for the usage but I'm sure that the provider will still consider this as an account in arrears so they may flog it on to a debt collection agency who will send out the usual intimidating letters, etc.[B] I just don't want this to have some sort of negative impact on my credit history.[/B][/QUOTE]

Do you understand how this could possibly happen, I don't.[/USER]

If you are in an apartment complex then the managing agents will probably know the landlord's name and address.

It's quite possible that he is away in foreign parts on holidays and therefore phone is on voice mail.

You are legally entitled to the landlord's name and address and should be on your initial lease agreement. This is the address to which all legal correspondence may be sent.

I do not recommend sending things by registered post as the recipient may not accept the letter. An Post have a service called 'Swift' (I think that is one of the names as there are at least two for the same service) where An Post guarantee delivery without the recipient's signature. An Post provide proof of posting.

Cremeegg is giving the correct advice. Once you inform the Electric co of your meter and the fact you will no longer be there you won't be liable. You cannot put the account into someone elses name. Not even the landlords, but sometimes things slip thru the system and the landlord ends back up on the bill anyway. Not your problem either way.

I don't know anything about disconnection fees, but if they disconnect I imagine that it would be a reconnection fee surely.

@cremeegg I agree that a tenant should not have to give any contact details to the provider in order to close the account. Of course the provider can't just put the name of the landlord on the account because I said so, they will need the landlords permission before they can do this. I thought the reason for this procedure was so that the landlord did not have to pay a reconnection fee when they were handed the property back. If a tenant wants to close an account, the account will either need to be put in someone else's name or if that is not possible, the supply will have to be disconnected which will incur the associated costs. The whole idea of tenants giving contact details of landlords is not entirely appropriate, however I thought the landlord accepts it so they will not have to pay a reconnection fee to get the connection restored for the incoming tenants.

cremeegg said:

Do you understand how this could possibly happen, I don't.

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Well if the provider send me a total bill of €200, €100 of this being usage and €100 being a disconnection fee and I only pay €100 of it, will this not be written off as bad debt? Does the provider not record this unpaid bill on your credit history?

@facetious I never signed a lease so there is no official correspondence address for the landlord, I only have an address that he verbally gave me and I do know for certain that he no longer lives there as he told me himself that he was moving. He never gave me his new address. So I don't think there is much point in sending anything to him when I know that he has moved. I don't have contact details for the management company either. To be honest I didn't even know there was a management company until the weather got a bot better and I saw someone cutting the grass. The complex has no indoor communal areas and we all have or own bins. In fact the only thing that the management company does is arrange for someone to cut the grass. He's been unreachable now for almost 2 months so that's a nice holiday he's having!

@Bronte I intend on telling the provider that I have moved out and providing them with a final meter reading and basically not worrying too much more about it. What I'm concerned about though is that they will say that the account needs to go into someone's name or else they will have to disconnect the supply. In that case there is a €100 disconnection fee (the reconnection fee is also €100) and given that I'm currently responsible for the bill I'll be landed with that charge.

Daniel I agree that as landlord I'd prefer if the tenant put it back in my name, but it's always been me that rang up the ESB to do this. But odd things do happen and ESB wants there to be someone on the bill so they may put it in his name without his say so. (I once, recent past, had a vacated tenant bill back in my name as I usually do, and I forgot to pay it, not DD, but my communal hall bill in another property in my name, by DD, ESB put the vacant property bill I hadn't paid onto the bill of the hall, no idea how they were allowed to do that but there you go).

If ESB don't know your new address they cannot bill you the disconnection fee. I'd pay them on the phone now what you owe based on the meter reading.

Bronte said:

Daniel I agree that as landlord I'd prefer if the tenant put it back in my name, but it's always been me that rang up the ESB to do this. But odd things do happen and ESB wants there to be someone on the bill so they may put it in his name without his say so. (I once, recent past, had a vacated tenant bill back in my name as I usually do, and I forgot to pay it, not DD, but my communal hall bill in another property in my name, by DD, ESB put the vacant property bill I hadn't paid onto the bill of the hall, no idea how they were allowed to do that but there you go).

If ESB don't know your new address they cannot bill you the disconnection fee. I'd pay them on the phone now what you owe based on the meter reading.

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That definitely doesn't sound right that they were able to that, you just couldn't be up to them really! Surely someone must of breached some of their internal regulations doing that.

The thing is that when I contact them to close the account they will ask for a forwarding address so they can send the final bill to me, I guess I could just tell them that I don't want to give them that information, I wouldn't see why I would be obliged to give it to them in order to close an account.

Maybe I'm going a bit off topic here, but are unpaid utility bills recorded on your ICB record?

Daniel said:

Maybe I'm going a bit off topic here, but are unpaid utility bills recorded on your ICB record?

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No

cremeegg said:

No

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Well in that case I guess I don't really have anything to worry about. The provider can send me a bill for the disconnection of the supply if they want and I can just ignore it knowing that it will not have any negative impact on my ICB record. Only in Ireland would you get away with that carry on, I'm sure non payment of utility bills would be recorded on your credit history in any other EU state.

Daniel said:

Well in that case I guess I don't really have anything to worry about. The provider can send me a bill for the disconnection of the supply if they want and I can just ignore it knowing that it will not have any negative impact on my ICB record. Only in Ireland would you get away with that carry on, I'm sure non payment of utility bills would be recorded on your credit history in any other EU state.

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Even in Ireland a private company cannot publish adverse information about an individual to damage their credit rating with going through the legally prescribed process. If the electricity company believes that you owe them money and wished to damage your reputation by publishing that fact, they must first go to court and obtain a judgement against you. Only when a judge says that you owe the money are you legally obliged to pay it. Up to that point the company only have a claim against you.

When the company obtains a judgement against you, you then have a period of time to pay the amount owing. If you fail to do so within the allowed period the company can then go back to court and seek the courts permission to publish the judgement, which may or may not be granted. This is the situation regarding an unpaid electricity bill. The rules arising from bank loans are different, and you accept that when you take out the loan.

The legal protections afford by the law to private individuals against powerful businesses in this country are meagre enough as it is without you being sarcastic about them.

Daniel said:

@Páid I had a look on the land direct website but I cannot seem to click on my apartment, I can click on others around it but just none in my complex. It does havethe name of the complex though, strange that I can't click on it.

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Land direct only has details of properties that are with the land registry. These comprise almost all rural properties and those urban properties that have changed hands recently. The system will eventually be extended everywhere. The web site is an example of how public services should be delivered.