Management Fees (apartment) & Legal Fees

[lorraine2008]

hello there,

I am not sure its the same situation and i have read through your replies to see if my query can be answered, but its quite different.

I had over due management fees, due to the fact that the management company didnt exist for a number of years. a few tried to step in, but to no avail. when i had problems, there was no management company in place. loss of rent due to tenants having to move out due to fire damage and no management company there to help out with insurance etc etc. bins and garden and general maintenence was neglected for about 3-4 years.

Now a new company stepped in last year and while they seem to be getting it together, which is good to see for the development. They were looking for all to pay any arrears for the years ' there was NO management co in place'. I found this odd, as i was paying for something that was not there. Other owners who had set up standing orders and had allowed payment to go through each year without questioning it, agreed that i shouldnt be let away with out pay it, as they all had paid it over the years. No other tenant had encountered the grief that i had with fire damage, and NO joy with mgt co over the years, so didnt notice the frustration, or lack of rent as a result.

I did ring and contact the new mgt co, and he told me we would sort it out and could i at least pay that year, ie 2008, and we would come to some arrangement for the rest. I did pay up that year, as they were in operation and it seemed like things were being done. However, the balance of over 5k was put on hold. i had emailed my grievences and he told me he would put it to the committee to see what they had to say.

Without getting back to me, the legal letters started to come in. I still asked him what 'arrangement' we were going to come up with, and no answer. more legal letters coming in to me at this point. I contacted their legal representative, and filled them in. They asked me to fwd the emails/correspondance i had with the mgt co., and i did. long story short, the mgt co threatened judgement, a very short time after telling me the committee are saying ' tough luck... pay up' (not quite in those words of course). so i reluctantly, borrowed the money, and paid 5649e to them.

Now i just got a letter with all the legal fees attached, 1252.54euro. Can they do this? I received letters from the solicitors, about 4 of them and that was it. And a judgement letter, AFTER I had paid the fees.

Can someone please help me with some advise on how to deal with this.
Many thanks

 

[mathepac]

If could reformat your post to improve the readability - sentences, capitals, paragraphs, punctuation - it may increase your chances of getting a response.

As it stands, it looks to me just like a huge apparently unformatted "wodge" of text (or txt even).

BTW, double-posting in this and another thread won't sit well with the moderators either.

 

[JoeB]

Hmmm.. the management company is working on behalf of the tenants.. it does seem very strange that they would want payment for periods when they weren't in existence.

You need to be polite but firm.. ask for info on what outgoings there were during the AWOL period.. i.e there may have been bin collection charges, public liability insurance... necessary repairs after the new company came in.... etc etc

This info should be provided to the tenants..

It seems the other tenants are pussycats.. paying money for a service they didn't receive, or may not have received... however you are just one person.. if all the other tenants are happy to pay you may be in trouble.. or maybe money was spent, on insurance etc..

You should try to get the other tenants to agree with you, and then the whole development can consider a class action suit or something to get any money back that shouldn't have been paid in the first place... if it is the case that monies paid weren't spent on the development and are simply lining the pockets of the new company.

However as I say you are just one person.. if everyone else in the development wants to pay for solid gold knobs on the doors and they are happy to pay 30,000 a year for this priviledge you might have to pay too... one of the joys of living in a shared development. (Simply because the people who want solid gold knobs may be in a majority and can win the vote.. and then everyone has to pay for them)

The tenants can take over the management if a majority vote for the new system, however there may be some problems with the developer still owning enough of the apartments that ensures he has majority voting rights.. in which case he may be able to inisist on solid gold knobs as I say... and although you vote no.. the motion may be passed by a majority..


Tough situation.. as I say you need to be firm but polite.. you need accurate and up-to-date info on spending.. and you should really drop leaflets into each house outlining any issues you uncover.. a lot of work.. and the leaflets have to be accurate, well written etc in order to get a good response.

It is tough, without more info I'm not sure if I'd pay or not...

 

[lorraine2008]

thanks for your reply. sorry about the 'wodge' of text. im not great at typing and got carried away, from pure frustration. I posted it twice, as i thought that as my other entry was a reply, it may not get read, so i started a new thread.. sorry

i did ask the mgt co to outline the costs that were incurred, and i was proposing that i pay the portion that was to do with monies actually spent (ie insurance and bins), and not to pay for fees and commisions. i also agreed to pay promptly an amount that i deemed fair (as was suggested to do so in email from the mgt co), to pay, in light of being done out pocket myself over the previous years.

seems like they just had me doing the runaround, and pay up for that year, and they said they would come up with an arrangment for the rest. which didnt happen but was instead followed up by legal letters.

 

[purpeller]

Hi Lorraine,

I'm not sure if you are clear on the difference between management company and management agent. I would be surprised if there was no management company in existence for your development. The management company is made up of all the owners in the building/estate. The management agent is appointed by the management company to manage the day to day running.

Having read your post again (it really isn't easy!!), if they already have a judgment against and you paid up then it is very likely that they are adding the cost of the legal fees on. It is a standard procedure when chasing up outstanding fees. You will most likely have to pay them but they may agree to a monthly amount rather than all at once.

Best advice of all I can give is to get hold of Robert Gogan's book (mentioned at the top of this forum). It is very readable and informative. I think it's an essential read for anyone living in an apartment block/estate with a management company these days.

 

[shesells]

Hmmm.. the management company is working on behalf of the tenants.. it does seem very strange that they would want payment for periods when they weren't in existence.

You need to be polite but firm.. ask for info on what outgoings there were during the AWOL period.. i.e there may have been bin collection charges, public liability insurance... necessary repairs after the new company came in.... etc etc

This info should be provided to the tenants..

It seems the other tenants are pussycats.. paying money for a service they didn't receive, or may not have received... however you are just one person.. if all the other tenants are happy to pay you may be in trouble.. or maybe money was spent, on insurance etc..

You should try to get the other tenants to agree with you, and then the whole development can consider a class action suit or something to get any money back that shouldn't have been paid in the first place... if it is the case that monies paid weren't spent on the development and are simply lining the pockets of the new company.

However as I say you are just one person.. if everyone else in the development wants to pay for solid gold knobs on the doors and they are happy to pay 30,000 a year for this priviledge you might have to pay too... one of the joys of living in a shared development. (Simply because the people who want solid gold knobs may be in a majority and can win the vote.. and then everyone has to pay for them)

The tenants can take over the management if a majority vote for the new system, however there may be some problems with the developer still owning enough of the apartments that ensures he has majority voting rights.. in which case he may be able to inisist on solid gold knobs as I say... and although you vote no.. the motion may be passed by a majority..


Tough situation.. as I say you need to be firm but polite.. you need accurate and up-to-date info on spending.. and you should really drop leaflets into each house outlining any issues you uncover.. a lot of work.. and the leaflets have to be accurate, well written etc in order to get a good response.

It is tough, without more info I'm not sure if I'd pay or not...

No, no, no!! Tenants have nothing to do with management companies. You probably mean owners but using the wrong language over complicates an already messy subject.

The bottom line is the OP signed a contract to pay management fees, and it looks like there was no Management agent in place but the management company has to have been there and in fact she is a member of that company. By not paying fees for the other years she has breached her signed contract.

Lorraine as purpeller said, you need to find out what your rights and responsibilities are as an owner in a managed development. That book is the best start.