Just recieved original information from bank,coming off 5yr fixed.

Hi, can anyone help me to discover if I am entitled to go on a tracker.

I requested the original contract,On the letter it mentions the conditions which will apply if I pay the loan in full or part before the end of the fixed rate period..however it also states;

Notwithstanding that clause the bank and the Mortgagor(s)shall each have the option at the end of each fixed period to convert to a variable rate loan agreement which will carry no such redemption fee.
I presume That would mean that if the mortgage was paid in part or full during the fixed rate a redemption fee would apply,I didn't pay off early..

Importantly I also have a copy of the letter I had sent with the contract which is hand written by me and dated and stamped by the bank twice.

It states,
This letter is to state that we wish to change our mortgage account number xxxxx from a TRACKER to a fixed rate.

On the desired options list ( ie; the list of rates they gave me at the time)
It has variable rate option and one to ten year options but not tracker,so I choose the 5 year.
This was done in November 2005.
My question is ,it would appear I was on a tracker and need to know if I can revert to a tracker?

If anyone could let me know what they think and any advise about who I shold contact? A solicitor? Mortgage brooker? the Bank itself? or who do I get to look at this for me?

Extra information; It doesnt state on the document what my mortgage rate would revert to after the fixed rate ends!
Thanks.

Unfortunately from the information you have provided, it looks to me like you will have no chance of getting a tracker off them.

Notwithstanding that clause the bank and the Mortgagor(s)shall each have the option at the end of each fixed period to convert to a variable rate loan agreement

Click to expand...

My original contract does not say what options are available to me after the fixed rate is finished.
Should I have that?

Permanent TSB to issue refunds for ‘misclassified’ mortgage holders
22 August 2010 By Emma Kennedy

More than 300 Permanent TSB mortgage customers are to receive refunds totalling €1.5million as a result of an error made by the bank.

A spokesman for the lender said that a number of Permanent TSB’s mortgage customers, most of whom had taken out their mortgages in 2006, had been ‘‘misclassified’’ by the bank.

The spokesman said the customers, who had initially opted for a fixed-rate loan, should have been offered the option of switching to a tracker mortgage when the fixed-rate matured.

However, in the case of the 300 or so customers receiving letters from the bank this week, the option of a tracker mortgage was not provided.

The affected mortgage customers will receive an average refund of €5,000.

The refund figure is based on a calculation by the bank of the difference between the customers’ current mortgage rate and what they would have paid had they opted for a tracker rate when their initial fixed rate matured.

Customers will also be paid interest.

Customers affected by the error will also have the option to switch from their current mortgage rate to a tracker rate, which could mean significantly lower monthly repayments.

The tracker rate to be offered to the customers will be based on the rates that would have applied when they should have been given the option of a tracker rate initially.

According to the spokesman, this means the affected customers will be able to avail of rates of roughly 1.75 per cent to 2 per cent.

The mortgage processing error was identified by Permanent TSB staff.

The spokesman said the company had notified the Financial Regulator of the mistake.
with the PTSB and have found the following on line.

The spokesman said the customers, who had initially opted for a fixed-rate loan, should have been offered the option of switching to a tracker mortgage when the fixed-rate matured.
That last line is what concerns me.Could I be one of those?
My contract doesn't give me what options are available after my fixed rate ends.

DonDub said:

T
The spokesman said the customers, who had initially opted for a fixed-rate loan, should have been offered the option of switching to a tracker mortgage when the fixed-rate matured.
That last line is what concerns me.Could I be one of those?
My contract doesn't give me what options are available after my fixed rate ends.

Click to expand...

From the information that you have given, it seems that nowhere were you ever told that you had a right to go on a tracker at the end of the fixed rate period.

Your contract did not say "At the end of the fixed rate, you have a right to a mortgage at x% above the ECB" which would give you the right to go on a tracker.

Oh I hope so!! I want to get as much information as I can before I phone them.

I did ask them ( a few weeks ago )if I was entitled to go on a tracker and they said no.
All the advise was to get the original contract which I now have.
To be honest I had no idea that I would never be able to go on a tracker again,when I signed up for a five year fixed.
Anyone know who I should contact to get this moving?

DonDub said:

The spokesman said the customers, who had initially opted for a fixed-rate loan, should have been offered the option of switching to a tracker mortgage when the fixed-rate matured.
That last line is what concerns me.Could I be one of those?
My contract doesn't give me what options are available after my fixed rate ends.

Click to expand...

It's unlikely.

As far as I know PTSB had a clause in the original loan offer giving these clients the opportunity to revert to a tracker rate.
When the fixed rate expired and PTSB sent out options to their clients, this option was "misclassified" i.e not offered.

The only way you would be entitled to a tracker rate is if you were given the option to revert to a tracker rate on the original 5 year fixed rate loan offer that you signed. From what you have posted, it looks like the bank only offered the variable rate which they were entitled to do.

[broken link removed]

My heart is soaring and sinking as each poster answers.

I suppose what I'm saying is that PTSB according to that statement should have given me the option of reverting to a tracker?
Just wondering why when I was on a tracker originally that I wasn't offered the option to go back on it at the end of the fixed rate?

DonDub said:

Just wondering why when I was on a tracker originally that I wasn't offered the option to go back on it at the end of the fixed rate?

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Simply because PTSB realised that trackers were bad news and would end up costing them money. If you leave a tracker rate now and fix, you are not guaranteed to get the option of a tracker rate at the end of the fixed period. You have to weigh up the benefit of fixing short term against losing the benefit of a long term tracker rate.

My reading of it is that only those that were offered a tracker rate in the first instance but then were "misclassified" and not offered it at the end of the fixed rate period are now entitled to the tracker rate.

Mine was taken out in 2005 ,so I understand that now the banks wont go near tracker rates..
My issue is should I have been given the option to revert to it when I took out the fixed rate in 2005?
It is important to note that my contract states.

"The conditions of your existing mortgage, save those altered in this offer apply".

What Im saying is that the conditions of my existing mortgage were in fact tracker.
The " altered " part is that I fixed,so would that not mean that I altered it for five years and then the conditions of my existing mortgage apply?

Ok ,Ive been on to the National consumer agency and they will phone me later today to see if I have any entitlement to a tracker.

My argument is based on the following;
1) The conditions of your exsisting mortgage,save those altered in this offer APPLY.
So I was on a tracker and that is the condition of my existing mortgage.


2) In reference to the terms of breaking out of the fixed rate ,PTSB lay out what the redemption fees will be should I either break out of the fixed rate or pay the mortgage in full before the end of the fixed rate.it goes on to say that notwithstanding clause 3 ptsb and the mortgagors shall each have the option at the end of each fixed rate period to convert to a variable rate loan agreement which shall carry no such redemption fee.

This means that when the fixed rate comes to a natural end no redemption fee applies.

3) I have not been given the information required ie;what the mortgage will revert too after the fixed rate ends.

4) My mortage was on a tracker,and the fixed rate was taken out in 2005,and ends 2010,so this is not a fixed rate taken out one or two years ago.

5)Ptsb have been taken to task about tracker mortgages,

.

A spokesman for the lender said that a number of Permanent TSB’s mortgage customers, most of whom had taken out their mortgages in 2006, had been ‘‘misclassified’’ by the bank.

The spokesman said the customers, who had initially opted for a fixed-rate loan, should have been offered the option of switching to a tracker mortgage when the fixed-rate matured.

Click to expand...

6)Your contract did not say "At the end of the fixed rate, you have a right to a mortgage at x% above the ECB" which would give you the right to go on a tracker.

7) I was never informed that I could not get back on to a tracker.

I have a letter dated and stamped by them twice stating that I was on a tracker.

Probably all be a waste of time but Im going to try and see what can be done,if anything.

Ptsb are saying that the five year fixed rate contract means nothing,that it is only concerned with the original contract.
So that even if you have a 40 year mortgage and take out a five year fixed ,when you are 25 years into the original term that it all reverts to what the original contract says.
I understood that if you were on a tracker (which I was before I fixed ) that this was the term?

I think your points 3 and 6 (& 7 as an extension of 6) are really what your argument hangs on - the bank didn't explicitly state the type of variable rate you would revert to so it may have been reasonable for you to assume you would be offered a tracker as it is a type of variable rate.

The bank was vague enough to protect itself in the event that cost of funding increased significantly (which did happen) or you in the event that the cost of funding decreased significantly or other very low cost variable rate products came along (which admittedly was very unlikely). It seems to me that by the T&Cs of the letter you probably aren't entitled to a tracker (I disagree with your point 1 in this regard, changing from the tracker rate to a fixed rate was the condition changed), and that you weren't misled at the time because in 2005 people didn't appreaciate how valuable a tracker would become so weren't as focussed on it and were happy with the vague wording of "revert to a variable rate". Otherwise you would have clarified this at the time.

I wouldn't be overly optimistic on chances of getting the tracker

DonDub said:

3) I have not been given the information required ie;what the mortgage will revert too after the fixed rate ends.

6)Your contract did not say "At the end of the fixed rate, you have a right to a mortgage at x% above the ECB" which would give you the right to go on a tracker.

7) I was never informed that I could not get back on to a tracker.

I have a letter dated and stamped by them twice stating that I was on a tracker.

Probably all be a waste of time but Im going to try and see what can be done,if anything.

Click to expand...

1234, when you say you had a similar clause in your terms and conditions,do you mean when you first took out the mortgage ie;your original mortgage terms and conditions or do you mean it was mentioned on the fixed rate contract?

Hi Don Dub..

I can understand your frustration. I came off a two years fixed this year and was not offered a tracker from PTSB. I initially was offered a tracker in early 2008 but I decided to fix for another two years because of rising interest rates (I regret this every day).

I hope you have luck in getting a tracker honoured by PTSB....