Is my auctioneer overcharging?

[willbee]

Hello everyone, I recently sold as house to Galway County Council after a long drawn out process. Brief update. I had to do alot with the house before they would sign any contracts which I foolishly did totaling €20K and then they tried to pull out of the sale on a technicality, but after a year of wrangling, it went through for €350K recently. Now as quick as a flash my auctioneer is looking for his cut of 1.5% of the sale price plus 21% VAT + fees coming to around €6K which I think is daylight robbery. He did nothing other than put me in contact with a council engineer who had the list of jobs for me to do before contracts were signed. The auctioneer said to do these jobs or the sale would not go through but when the council tried to pull out I was the one who did all the chasing and jumping through hoops. Nobody would touch the house at that stage as all that was done was to the councils specifications. I know I have to pay him something and I'm not trying to avoid paying but that fee is scandalous. What are my options, Help and advice is appreciated.

 

[Vanilla]

One and a half percent is a standard enough charge. Did you not agree a fee at the outset?

 

[willbee]

I am afraid not Vanilla, for a straight forward sale i would have no problem in paying the 1.5%, my argument is that when the deal was going down the tube and I had no comeback, after all that was spent on the house the auctioneer went missing and said he could do nothing. I had to do all the chasing to try and close the sale.

 

[MrMan]

What you had to spend on the house has nothing to do with the auctioneer, it was your choice. Your other option was ignore the council and hold out for a private owner. Did you get a good price in the end?, I would also say to anyone else that if they are in similiar circumstances with their council, don't make any improvements until they sign contracts as they have a habit of changing their minds and you have no come back. If the OP really feels hard done by, then go to the agent and negotiate a lesser fee. Your response to vanilla is a little confusing as in did you or didn't you agree a fee and is it in writing. If you don't have it in writing then the agent has much of a leg to stand on either and you have a lot more bargaining power.

 

[Green]

If I were selling I would not settle for next or near 1.5%. Under 1% would be more appropriate. However, the real question is what did you agree with the aucytioneer at the outset and was anything in writing.

 

[MrMan]

If I were selling I would not settle for next or near 1.5%. Under 1% would be more appropriate. However, the real question is what did you agree with the aucytioneer at the outset and was anything in writing.

You would do well to get under 1%, but 1% does remain around the average rising to 1.25% and rarely 1.5%. Coinsidering the size of the transaction people would be better choosing the best rather than the cheapest if they want things handled right.

 

[HighFlier]

If nothing was agreed then you have the right to negotiate. I would offer him immediate payment of 0.75% or tell him otherwise to expect a long and protracted debate. tell him if he wants to sue you go ahead. You will have your money and the cards are all in your hands. Dont be fobbed off by him showing you "standard rates" as these are B/S.

Alternatively get a third party to go to him and ask his best fee for selling a normal house and get a quote in writing to put a stop to the standard rate argument.

 

[eoghanlk]

"1.5% of the sale price plus 21% VAT "

I recently agreed a fee of 1.5% of the sale price with an auctioneer.I assumed that included vat. Was I being nieve?

 

[roker]

Surely it is cosumer law that all prices are quoted inclusive of VAT. Is he a member of the IAVI? he must give you a quote in writing

 

[willbee]

To clarify, I got nothing in writing whatsoever from my autioneer. I spoke to a friend today who used this auctioneer before also. In that transaction the auctioneer deducted his fee from the booking fee and forwarded the balance to my friend's solicitor. In my case there was no booking fee, just "DO what the council says and you'll get paid", I was told. I've my lesson learned.

 

[MrMan]

To clarify, I got nothing in writing whatsoever from my autioneer. I spoke to a friend today who used this auctioneer before also. In that transaction the auctioneer deducted his fee from the booking fee and forwarded the balance to my friend's solicitor. In my case there was no booking fee, just "DO what the council says and you'll get paid", I was told. I've my lesson learned.

Well then they have not acted appropriately and they have not operated under the IAVI rulebook (are they a member). Either way they cannot take a figure from the sky. They should learn a very harsh lesson here and you should award them a minimal fee. First ask for an detailed invoice to include advertising costs etc, then pay these costs and choose a % that you think is applicable. If they have done nothing in your favour let your price reflect this. The reason everything is to be put in writing is to protect both parties and in this case he has done neither. But just to be sure, look for any documentation that you have received and make sure that you have not overlooked anything.

 

[MsGinger]

Last May I paid 0.8% + VAT for the sale of an apartment. However, when I negotiated the %, it was before things had started to get quieter in the market. I'm not sure I'd get that good a rate now if I went back.

 

[willbee]

Thanks for all the opinions folks. Just a quick question, the council returned the contracts unsigned at one stage, wanting nothing more to do with me or the house. It was after this that I heard nothing from the auctioneer and I started to do the chasing. Does this mean the auctioneers claim of selling the house for me, are null and void when he didn't get the buyer scond time around?? He is a member of the IAVI.

 

[sidzer]

In my opinion Auctioneers are invariably an overpaid waste of space!

I went to an auctioneer a few years ago as I wanted to sell my house. He said that the house was worth £80,000 but a 'Specialist Buyer would pay more probably £100 - £110,000 pounds. It was a cottage down a narrow lane.

I put an add in my local paper £10 and the phone was hopping. I did the viewings and within a few days I had two serious punters. I simply asked for £120,000 and got offered it by one of the interested parties.

In my opinion its easy enough to asses the value of your house if it is in an estate. The key is getting a good solicitor and making sure all the legal checks and paper work is done. (shop around here too as they vary significantly in price).

Unless you have signed a contract of sorts - it sounds like you have done the bulk of the work and therefore should not pay the full fee. I would remind the auctioneer that even though it was him who set up the engagement only for you the sale would not have gone through - as you did alot of work to push the sale through. Therefore - I think it is not unreasonable for you to look for a reduction of these high fees.

S

 

[eoghanlk]

Roker,
I got no quote in writing and the auctioneer is a member of the IAVI and works for a large firm. I found him quiet unprofessional in his approach to things but I felt he would have a lot of contacts due to the firms size.

Sidzer,
I wouldn't agree with calling auctioneers a waste of space. Despite their faults I have found them useful. The best thing I did was engage 2 different auctioneers on the understanding that whoever sell the property gets paid. One firm refused to do this and so didn't get the business. I've recently received separate offer through both of them. They've become more 'attentive' now that they fear losing the comission to a competitor! I'm a novice house seller but I'm at least getting some satisfaction for my 1.5%

 

[sidzer]

I suppose its not right to tar everyone with the same brush - but I had more than my fair share of bad experiences when trying to buy a house in Cork a few years ago....

I understand that some people don't want any hassle and are happy with the service they receive... However, in the flying off the shelf days of the past - I think that the fees were too high for what they do...

Best of luck with the sale...

S

 

[MrMan]

In my opinion Auctioneers are invariably an overpaid waste of space!

I understand that some people don't want any hassle and are happy with the service they receive... However, in the flying off the shelf days of the past - I think that the fees were too high for what they do...

You take the rough with the smooth. For what we do is generally more than stick a 10 ad in the paper and watch it sell itself. I don't think anyone who achieved higher than asking is kicking themselves for hiring a waste of space.

 

[HouseOfCards]

For what we do is generally more than stick a 10 ad in the paper and watch it sell itself.

What sidzer said was that he was told by the EA that the house was worth 80k, maybe 110… so he stuck a 10 euro ad in the paper and watched it sell itself. There’s no arguing that it took anymore because it didn’t, and he didn’t have to fork out 1.5% to hire anyone who’d lead him to believe it was taking anymore effort than that.
If I didn’t have to get back to work I’d have a quick look on daft and post a few of the many links to properties that have a one line description, single photo that someone took with a mobile phone and a finger-in-the-air-price just to demonstrate how in plenty of instances, it had better sell itself.

You take the rough with the smooth.

.... are you kidding me? Why should I take any rough? My gaff is up for 425,000 so at 1.5% = just under 6.5k.
Afraid there’ll be no rough coming my way if I’m paying someone 6.5k to do what sidzer did for a tenner and his time. After many ignored calls placed to the last guy who tried to charge me 1.5% for not very much, he was only spurned into life when I walked into his office, retrieved the keys to the property and asked for the ad to be taken out of the window. I would suggest this approach for anyone who was promised smooth and delivered rough

 

[MrMan]

What sidzer said was that he was told by the EA that the house was worth 80k, maybe 110… so he stuck a 10 euro ad in the paper and watched it sell itself. There’s no arguing that it took anymore because it didn’t, and he didn’t have to fork out 1.5% to hire anyone who’d lead him to believe it was taking anymore effort than that.

He said he put a €10 ad in the paper and asked for €120k and bobs your uncle, someone kindly offered it and he accepted it, and thats all it takes to move a property.

If I didn’t have to get back to work I’d have a quick look on daft and post a few of the many links to properties that have a one line description, single photo that someone took with a mobile phone and a finger-in-the-air-price just to demonstrate how in plenty of instances, it had better sell itself.

Don't know who your getting at here are you saying private sellers are doing this or agents? You do realise that there is alternatives to daft and myhome when it comes to selling a property.

.... are you kidding me? Why should I take any rough? My gaff is up for 425,000 so at 1.5% = just under 6.5k.

I think you may have taken things up wrong. The rough with the smooth comment was aimed at how the market has changed, i.e it was easier to sell in days gone buy (as sidzer might tell you) than it is now, not at the level of service that you should accept.

Afraid there’ll be no rough coming my way if I’m paying someone 6.5k to do what sidzer did for a tenner and his time

I think sidzer would have a little more difficulty in naming his price now let alone get an ad for a tenner. Why don't you do yourself a favour and start saving money now by negotiating your commission rather than having a grievance about your perceived lack of value for money.

I would suggest this approach for anyone who was promised smooth and delivered rough

You're right its your property so look after your interests keenly, thats about all we agree on.