How much is enough?

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Bamhan

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When can you decide that you are where you want to be?
How do people know that they are satisfied with their lot?

I am a full time working mother with two small kids and a very hard working husband.

The thing is I feel like we are constantly working towards some ideal in the future rather than concentrating on the here and now.

We are saving money in our SSIAs.
Buying investment properties.
Working every hour God sends.
Thinking maybe we would like another child.
The list is endless.

How do people decide they are satisfied with the life they have?
I mean that their family is complete, they like their house, their car, their lifestyle, their income, their work/play balance of time.

I sometimes wonder if we will ever get to that point we seem to be constantly striving towards somewhere in the distant future.

Is anyone at a stage in their life where they feel this is it, this is what it was all for and this is how it should be?

I'd love to hear from someone who is in the utopian land we seem to be struggling towards.
 
I've been there (the "utopian land"). I think it's a nice place to visit, but I don't seem to get to stay there (so far anyway) for long enough. The key seems to be "The NOW", and being contented living in THE NOW. If you're into reading ... "The Power of Now" by Eckhart Tolle (spelling?) has some good thoughts on the subject, but it is quite deep and complex, and is something you dip into rather than read avidly. I don't know what the answer is, but I do know what you're talking about, and I have experienced where you're at, and I have also been able to step outside of it and just live in the now, for as long as months at a time. Somehow, some time, reality clicks back in (or is it that reality leaves?) and I'm back to the humdrum that you describe. Am I making any sense? Anyway, I think some of the answer lies in reading about these things (thus mention of book above) and thinking more deeply about such things, and (dare I say) in praying occasionally that we might somehow be content in the Now and happy with what we have, and hope that we can just "stop and stare" rather than be "full of care". Is this too deep? Were you looking for something else??
 
Interesting post Bamhan - a lot of people may say that this is part of what's wrong with our modern society. We judge ourselves and our sucess, and others judge us as well, based on "how much" not on "how well" - ie how much money / things / status / power we have and not on how well respected / loved / loving / kind we are.

It's a question of what's more important than money I suppose - I think I read recently that people who have good friends and a hobby and are religious are generally happier than people without these things, regardless of how much money they have!

I know from some of the people I know that money does not bring happiness - in many cases it just deepens the underlying problems
 
The meaning of life/why are we here type question comes up every now and again. The best way Ive had it explained is via a poem by [broken link removed] that someone posted on AAM a long time ago. worth a read. I think the meaning is that when you come to the end of the road, if youve had a fruitful experienced life and the journey has been worthwhile then you'll be happy. I would say if you dont think youre happy yet then youre still on a journey and to enjoy it. Fill the journey with experiences.
And, except for the rear window thing in my car not properly demisting the window, I must admit to being very happy too. :)
 
There was an interesting program on BBC2 last Thursday, think it's on for three or four weeks - Making Slough Happy.

One point that was made was a result from various "happiness" studies/research that have been done throughout Europe (or possibly worldwide) if they graphed the result of level of happiness against income, happiness increased with income up to a certain level (if I recall correctly it was 15,000, not sure if it was STG or Euro) and after that happiness levels will usually only increase due to other factors.

The program is trying is illustrate what they call the science of happiness. Their contention is that as research and analytical methods have become more and more sophisticated it is now possible to fairly accurately measure people's happiness. Regardless of whether this is possible or not it was an interesting program to watch - not least to pick up ideas about how to make changes in your own life if so inclined. Complete with a Happiness Manifesto. It sounded a bit cult-like in parts but the ten thoughts on the manifesto are all fairly common sense things, most of which I've heard suggested before. The manifesto and more details on the program are on www.bbb.co.uk/lifestyle by the way, in case anyone's interested.

Generally though I would say that happiness is very difficult to measure. I do feel that financial security plays a big part. However it's up to each person to decide what level of financial security they want and then, if they have achieved that, to concentrate on other things. Hopefully not having completely ignored other things while getting to the financial situation they want. There are no hard and fast rules about this (but if you search I think you'll find at least one other thread on the same topic), it really is a case of you deciding what things are important to you and why.
 
car said:
if youve had a fruitful experienced life and the journey has been worthwhile then you'll be happy. I would say if you dont think youre happy yet then youre still on a journey and to enjoy it. Fill the journey with experiences.
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Exactly, I believe its the journey that counts - you only live life once. Sure we all think a few million would make us happy - but personally i'd rather enjoy earning €45,000 a year than to hate work and earn €90,000... but then again i'm proably too young to comment!
 
I always liked some of the quotations about money . One particular favourite is:

"Never keep up with the Joneses. Drag them down to your level. It's cheaper." -- Quentin Crisp.
 
Bamhan said:
When can you decide that you are where you want to be?
How do people know that they are satisfied with their lot?
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Only you can decide where you want to be! Although you can take ideas from other peoples experiences but in the end its you that has to produce the ambition and enthusiasm to achieve your goals and dreams whatever you choose them to be.
 
Yawn ... Get off the stage the lot of you :)

I agree with the earlier poster about reading and looking more deeply into your life as a means of stopping the searching. I think these can help replace the spiritual solace that might have been found when we were more devout. It is a very fine balance between accepting genuine injustice (which I personally feel organised religion is often reponsible for) and struggling to attain the unattainable in life.

Books I've read that have helped are Charles Handy's "The Hungry Spirit". This is a business management guru's take on "life management" and it really appealed to me because the theories are rational and the advice is practical and easy to adopt. No psycho babble, no hippy-dippy speak.

Any of Nigel Warburton's introductory books to philosophy give a great start to understanding different approaches that have evolved surrounding the various issues that make up the human condition.

I think creativity, in the broadest sense (i.e. including creative thinking about our own life), also plays a part in our contentedness (I think "happiness" is a misleading word and concept incidentally). "The Artist's Way" by Julia Cameron is one book that tries to tap into our creative potential. Great book but be warned, hippy-dippy language abounds and makes it difficult to swallow at times.

I personally find the poetry of TS Elliot kind of consoling (for want of a better word). I think poetry could have a fantastic part to play in lives that no longer include quiet contemplative prayer time.

But the best thing I've done for myself lately is to turn off the telly more often (it helps that I only have the Irish channels and never seem to sort out what satelitte package to get).

Rebecca
 
Have to agree with a lot of what you said there Rebecca - especially the bit about turning off the TV. For a long time now I have gravitated towards listening to the radio instead and find that I can get a lot of other things done at the same time which I would not be able to do while in a semi-vegetative state in front of the TV. In terms of general lifestyle/happiness reading material I have enjoyed reading some of the late Peter McWilliams's books. Years ago I would have been too cynical to read that sort of stuff! :)
 
I am not interested at all in TV.
I will certainly look at some of the books mentioned.
I suppose in essence my situation is one where life has fast forwarded for me in the last few years and I am still catching up.
 
Happiness manifesto point no. 5: cut your TV viewing by half. Am I really the only person who saw that program? Anyway, I don't watch a huge amount of telly but this weekend I very deliberately didn't switch it on at all on Saturday or Sunday and I have to say I had one of the best weekends I've had for ages. It probably helped that the weather was so nice too.
 
Bamhan,
To me , you`re asking the right question and know the answer for you.
Maybe, you could discuss setting a pace you can both live with.
 
What makes someone happy is a very individual thing but for me I think it might take more than reading a few self help books or turning off the telly.

Going back to what I was trying to say before maybe spending more time with people / friends / family; doing something not for money but for the enjoyment or for the good feeling you get out of it eg calling an old friend and meeting for lunch or a pint: you know you promised to keep in touch but never did. Or doing some work for a charity or local support group or local club.

I think the enjoyment and feel good factor you get from doing these kinds of things is much more than you would get from having paid off your mortgage or from investing your SSIA money. Money can only buy things it can't buy feelings or memories and it's feelings and good memories that make us happy.

At the end of the day does it matter if your mortgage is paid off in 2025 or 2030 - does it really make you happier to have a six bedroom house and not a five bed - are you a lot happier in an '06 Primera than in an '03
 
efm said:
Money can only buy things it can't buy feelings or memories and it's feelings and good memories that make us happy.
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Brilliant. If only we all thought like that.
 
efm said:
What makes someone happy is a very individual thing but for me I think it might take more than reading a few self help books or turning off the telly.
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I don't think that anybody suggested that reading a few self help books and turning off the telly was the way to some sort of recipe for achieving a satori like state. :)

Money can only buy things it can't buy feelings or memories and it's feelings and good memories that make us happy.
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I agree that there should be some balance but to suggest that money does not help in attaining some level of comfort and happiness is at best trite and at worst simply wrong. I'm not talking about pursuing money for the sake of it but earning/having enough (whatever that is to different people) to maintain the lifestyle and options to which one is accustomed or to which one aspires. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater here. Too often there is an undertone abroad these days that we should somehow feel guilty or unworthy of enjoying the benefits that accrue from money. I hold no truck with that. I have no time for keeping up with the Joneses (as per Quentin Crisp earlier) but I don't believe the "poor but happy" myths that are sometimes promulgated in various quarters. I only need to talk to people of my mother's generation (who grew up during The Emergency/WWII) to know that not everything was rosy in the garden back then or in following decades and that for all the hand wringing that sometimes goes on we are not necessarily worse off these days just because we have money.

At the end of the day does it matter if your mortgage is paid off in 2025 or 2030 - does it really make you happier to have a six bedroom house and not a five bed - are you a lot happier in an '06 Primera than in an '03
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For some people - yes. Since we cleared the mortgage several years ago and several years early we have never looked back. Doing this caused us no financial hardship and being debt free since gives us a warm fuzzy feeling. On the other hand we certainly don't check daily on how much our house is worth or how much we have gained on paper or anything like that. Being debt free means that we have additional dispoable income available for other uses many of which give us pleaseure/comfort.
 
>> Or doing some work for a charity or local support group or local club><

I know that not everyone has the time for this but the volunteer work I did was without a doubt one of the most rewarding things I've ever done. Maybe even the most rewarding. It made me so elated. There's probably plenty of things where people do things and get no thanks, I know that. However it mightn't be obvious how much you can get out of giving your time or whatever.
 
The only thing that can really make people happy is interaction with other people. Money is a necessary ingredient of the cake but too much or too little will spoil the mix.
As for the big house and new car, if you can have them while enjoying what you do and not neglecting the people around you then go for it. If acquiring them is a barrier between you and those around you then maybe you should look at your priorities.
The thing is that we all have responsibilities to those we work with and in some cases those who work for us. If you have employees then how hard you work will affect their job security and happiness so some people may be working hard because they feel a responsibility to others outside their family. Nothing is black and white.
 
I don't agree with that really purple.

Nobody except yourself can find your own inner contentedness. Other people are often a distraction and a means of avoiding asking yourself questions as much as the TV, depending on the quality of the relationships. Conversely some relationships can be really inspirational.

I also think it is hugely worthwhile to evaluate the state of the relationships in your life; some of which will probably not be the healthiest and take assertive action to address that. Some can be cultivated or corrected and some cannot and people that need to be exluded (partly or wholly) should be.

BTW, none of the books I mentioned would be conventional self-help books (with the possible exception of The Artist's Way"). My advice would be not to knock the other two before you try them. Charles Handy's, in particular, is all centered around the theory of "enough".

Rebecca
 
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