Hourly pay cut

Missladycakes

Registered User
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Hi

Need to ask about rules on receiving a pay cut.

My kid has been working since they were 16, they are now 18.5. Their current job has been for 17 months and is part time. Original contract was for 6 months and they never received another one after that. The first week they were paid 6.15 per hour but they were told that was just for training for a week. They contacted the employer and agreed to adult minimum wage after the first week of training.

Fast forward to today. Their employer has given them a verbal warning. They close at 10pm at night. During their shift they were told by other staff members that they had to work until 11pm. They messaged the owner letting them know they couldn't stay as they had plans. He proceeded to give my kid a verbal warning. Then today they were told that their wages was being cut and put to 18 year old pay, which is 8.80 ph, they were on 9.80 per hour and of course the Minimum wage was going to 10.10 as of the 1st. Now just so you know a staff member quit just before Christmas and my kid worked two weeks with only 2 days off to help the employer out. They had to make the schedule themselves with the one other person left working with them. They cover shifts all the time. When my kid asks for time off (usually only 1 day) they get grief, they have to constantly remind their employer of the day off and they also have to arrange another staff member to cover them. My kids employer wanted to know why they were taking the day off. My kid said it was personal. The employer started harassing my kid to get the information but they wouldn't tell them as it is very private matter. Clearly you don't have to tell your employer whey you need to take one day annual leave. Especially when you have earned the time off and gave 3 months notice.

Googled changing of hours and employers have to give 24 hours notice to change work times unless it's an emergency such as another member of staff was sick. In this instance that was not the case. The employer just decided to change closing time and didn't even inform my kid. No where on the premises is the schedule posted.

As for the pay cut. What's the law on this? I can't seem to find anything concrete? While I know the employer doesn't have to give my kid the Minimum wage increase as they are 18, can they legally cut my kids wage to the 18 year old rate? My kid is the longest person working there aside from the cooks. My kid arrives early, is never late and even goes to work then they are sick. All to avoid grief.

Please help and my kid is ready to quit but is also saving to buy their first car.

Thanks
 
Your kid is working a minimum wage job for a very poor manager. I would recommend he gets another job and leave this one.

There are plenty of good employers out there who appreciate someone who would work 12 out of 14 days to help out when short staffed.

Thanks appreciate that. They have applied for a few but nothing has come through. The manager is the owner. There is so much more to this story and they way they are treated but I'm just looking for law advice to see how they stand.
 
Do they have a contract? If the rate of pay is not specified in teh contract there is probably not much recourse given the employer's attitude - unfortunately for your child :-(
 
Trying to locate contract, I do recall it being very short. They have a screen shot of the employers wife stating "we always start at the minimum wage." Their first pay was in cash and lower rate as training. The next playslip that they can find is September 2nd and it's 9.50 per hour. Apparently they sent the others to the incorrect email. These show the minimum adult rate at the time. So can they reduce it from that?
But if rate isn't stated in the contract can they reduce the rate?
 
Trying to locate contract, I do recall it being very short. They have a screen shot of the employers wife stating "we always start at the minimum wage." Their first pay was in cash and lower rate as training. The next playslip that they can find is September 2nd and it's 9.50 per hour. Apparently they sent the others to the incorrect email. These show the minimum adult rate at the time. So can they reduce it from that?
But if rate isn't stated in the contract can they reduce the rate?
They cannot unilaterally change the contract like that, regardless of whether it is written down.
 
Reading between the lines I reckon the employer wants to get rid of your kids. Certainly, he is not recognising their value. I bet the employer is short of the mark upstairs. A meeting with himself and his wife probably will confirm this.

But, if it were my children:- I'd pull them out of this employment instantly and without notice. I bet the employer will negotiate then. And if they wanted to return to the employment I'd want money upfront from him. Don't worry about recommendations from him, I reckon they would not be worth the paper on which they'd be written.
 
Your child has a contract with their employer. It may not be written down but that doesn't matter.
The employer cannot change their terms and conditions of employment without their consent and they certainly cannot change their rate of pay. The employers behaviour is, from what you have said here, utterly outrageous.
If your child has been working the hours you have outlined for more than 6 months, i.e. when they were 17 years old, then their employer was breaking the law.
 
Thanks for the comments guys. My kid has been working there for 18 months. He has also done something else illegal to another member of staff but that there business to say. It's just heart breaking as they work hard and well. Plus they just saved enough for a car and if my kids employment stops then no car. So they are kind of stuck until something else comes up.
We are waiting on the payslip to see if it's reduced and there they are going to ask for the reason why in writing. I'll keep you all posted.
Thanks
 
You might consider contacting the WRC.
The notion that employees can or should employed at the whim of their employer is, thankfully, a thing of the past and, more importantly, illegal.
 
Hi, I spoke with a lady from WRC and she said he cannot reduce my kids wage. They also don't have to raise it to 10.10 from 9.80 due to their age. But that isn't as bad as going down to 8.08. Waiting on payslip on Friday to see what actually occurs. Also she never got any "terms or employment" which is against the rules. And they also have to give 24 hours notice to change work times, which didn't occur.
Advice given was to log everything dates, times and if any other staff member was there.

I'll update on Friday.

Thanks
 
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Hi, I spoke with a lady from WRC and she said he cannot reduce my kids wage. They also don't have to raise it to 10.10 from 9.80 due to their age. But that isn't as bad as going down to 8.08. Waiting on payslip on Friday to see what actually occurs. Also she never got any "terms or employment" which is against the rules. And they also have to give 24 hours notice to change work times, which didn't occur.
Advice given was to log everything dates, times and if any other staff member was there.

I'll update on Friday.

Thanks
Legally the employer must give an employee written terms and conditions of employment within 3 months of starting. If they don't get them they have an additional 3 months to ask for them. After that time they accept custom and practice within the workplace. Do remember that all the legislation protects the employee and not the employer (and rightly so as it is not an equal relationship) so not having them in writing only strengthens the position of the employee.
 
I am not God, but I bet your children will never get a written copy of terms of employment from this employer. Even if they do I'll bet further that it won't be worth the paper on which it is written.

My Advice:- Get your kids out of there. Try and convince them to return to education and get a 3rd Level qualification. They can always work parttime elsewhere.
 
Update

My kid is in secondary school doing the leaving cert so no convincing to return to school there.

Payslip shows hourly rate has been reduced from 9.80 to 8.08, against the law. Wages in bank confirms this.

A letter was typed and given to the employer asking for the following:
A) Reasons for reduced hourly rate,
B) Statement of terms of employment
C) Copy of contract.
Withing 10 minutes of the employer receiving the letter the employer sent a whatapps message saying "You can take tomorrow off as well please, Thanks" I'm actually stunned that they would now punish my kid for asking for information that they are legally allowed to ask for. A reply was sent asking why and the response was "Because not busy". Finally my kid was told not to message via whatapp that all work related conversation are to be in person (even though employer sent the message first!) and that is would be discussed on Saturday when the shift starts.

Question as my kid has to go to work on Saturday and then discuss it with the employer can it be recorded?? Otherwise there is no proof of conversation. I know a telephone conversation can be recorded once one party agrees to it but I can't find anything else.

Thanks
 
My kid is in secondary school doing the leaving cert so no convincing to return to school there.

What doe this mean? They are going to do the Leaving Cert or they aren't?

My advice ... get your son to walk away from the job. It isn't worth it. He may win a battle but could lose the war.
 
My kid is in school doing the leaving cert, currently taking mock exams. I mean't "no need to convince to return to school" as they're in school.

Just bought a car so the walking away isn't a great option, although I have said this myself. Employer actually told my kid that work is more important than study!!

BTW it's a girl. Funny how most think my kid is a boy.
 
Your daughter (I guess when someone says kid, I automatically think of a boy) needs out of this negative situation. Educationally, she is facing an important couple of months , months that will determine the course of her life/her career/her work.

For the sake of it, I'd be telling the employer where to stick his job. He'll have your daughter's card marked now and it's less and less work that she'll get from him. Surely there are other jobs that she can take on?

Your daughter's main focus should be on study/her exams.... time enough in the future to deal with awkward employers.
 
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Your kid has a bad boss.

Bad boss will make it miserable for your kid to carry on working there no matter what the pay.

As a parent you need to step up and be a good parent during the leaving cert year.
Tell your kid to stop work
Pay your kids car loan until June
Get you kid to focus on the leaving and help her to stay relaxed, rested and stress free in her down time.

This is not what you came here to be told and I understand you may not want to hear this, but I think you are focussing on the wrong thing.

The boss is a bad boss
You need to be the parent
 
Your kid has a bad boss.

Bad boss will make it miserable for your kid to carry on working there no matter what the pay.

As a parent you need to step up and be a good parent during the leaving cert year.
Tell your kid to stop work
Pay your kids car loan until June
Get you kid to focus on the leaving and help her to stay relaxed, rested and stress free in her down time.

This is not what you came here to be told and I understand you may not want to hear this, but I think you are focussing on the wrong thing.

The boss is a bad boss
You need to be the parent

Hi,
I thank you for being up front and I agree with you on all pointsBut it’s not that simple. I’m disabled and can’t afford to pay for the car loan. If I could I would have done it a long time ago.

She’s making official complaint with WRC regarding all of it. If she walks away he wins and she’s not one to let that happen.
Meanwhile she has applied for other PT jobs and us studying away.

I’ll keep you updated
 
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