evergreen fund

It would certainly be difficult to confuse the 2, of course if its was up 1/3 then this would not be an issue ,but really no excuse for this kind of careless approach to her life savings.
A full financial factfind would also have been completed to determine the nature of the product suitable for her and her husbands needs, maybe worth making a complaint anyway, but she would have had to sign documentation to confirm she understood the long term nature and risks of this investment, although it is clearly not suitable as an emergency fund and should not be sold as such as should any managed fund that is her only hope of it being upheld i suspect.
On the flip side it is early days yet and if she is prepared to sit it out this is just at present a paper loss and may not be bourne out in the long run despite the present difficult market conditions.
No guarantee on this of course but i would be of the opinion that it would be best left invested after such a heavy fall, and given sufficient time to recover which will no doubt be several years.
 
Sorry the finish of my last post on B of irel funds didn't appear properly. Just to let you guys out there know, I did get a mobile number of the boss in charge of bank of ireland fund managers in dublin and gave him a piece of my mind as to why our money was not being managed and now down wait for it 52% and 40% on some funds. Why no communication for twelve months with annual statment, why no advice after being paid to manage your fund so that you might actually cop it has been plummeting before you get your statement and give you an acutal chance to switch to a safer or stable fund. I was told, they don't meet or speak with members of the public, they are faceless fund managers, your local branch investment manager should meet with you once a year and of course will speak with you if you ring him. He agreed to meet us in Cork immediatedly given the seriousness of losing over half our money almost, to go through it with us.

He met us , told us we were given v bad advise from the local investment bank of ireland manager on what funds to invest in originally given our circumstances, and that the trilogy,evergreen and smart funds are so heavily exposed to commericall property , some are geared funds too within these , and also heavy investment within these funds in irish shares means these funds are going to continue to plummet downwards, He suggested we immediatedly switch to a cash fund and he will come back with suggestions next week as to how what we should do with the money left now .No apology as to bad fund management, no apology as to why they don't tell you your money is wasting away, nada except that it was up to us to ring if we wanted to know how it was doing sooner than a yearly statement, and we would go from here on once the rot has been halted .

Beware, get your money out of these funds now, the head of investments has told us too late for us I am afraid after losing over 200k to switch to cash unless you can wait seven years to hope it will recover with no guarantee.

GET OUT NOW, manage it yourself if you have to, you can't do worse than bank of ireland fund managers anyway. We will never invest with them again, and from now on, it will be manage our money ourselves and try to get an education in the meantime on how to self fund manage. Be Wary and don't get caught like us naive people who believed they knew what they were doing and getting paid instead to lose up to half your money.
 

With all due respect are you saying that you invested this kind of money without even knowing what kind of assets or risk that you were taking on, and of course the possibility that the fund could go down as well as up? of course no one expected the falls that we have seen but this seems to a recurring trend that no one here has a clue what they have invested in until after fund has fallen in value, i do not understand how careless and how little thought people have for their hard earned funds.
Its an expensive lesson if your pulling out now, are you confident you will be abe to recover these type of losses on your own or in a cash fund?
I think its unlikely, these funds are long term options best advice would not be to make a panic decision and to evaluate your chances of recoevery in present fund over the next number of years..
 
johnnygman, I have to agree with you.Post after post looking for people to blame,pulling money from funds thereby ensuring this just gets worse and worse.Mad mad mad.Calm down everybody!
 

You say stay in, why not sell , let it drop further, and if you still feel its a good fund (its not in my opinion) buy back at a lower price ??

Too many people giving advice to stick with little understanding of specific fund in thread
 
After reading the Posts of Johnnygman and Bilberry and others it is very difficult to blame the Fund Managers for the downward movement of World Markets. However I have a very significant amount invested with BoI through their subsidiary New Ireland. Did you all know that Bank of Ireland Life is a Tied Agent of New Ireland ?? Did you all know that if you invest in the same funds through New Ireland rather than BoI Life you can get a better investment deal ?? Did you all know that New Ireland investment products are offered on better terms by Non-Tied agents for which they are fully aware but do not bother to advise their customers ?? So if you go to the Bank to invest and they advise you they are giving you the best deal available do not believe them. You are better shopping around.

I presently have two cases with the Financial Ombudsman against this organisation which will then be referred to the Regulator. I have spent 18 months trying to sort out a mess with an original offer in writing but was then refused after they had my money. However I was offered to enact the original deal in writing from their Tied Agent if I paid him a CASH FEE. The main office then sent me figures to show I was on a better deal than the original deal in writing. The figures were false which is totally contrary to the Consumer Code. I could write a book about this and intend in making the entire story public as soon as I can.

We are all reading concerning the mistakes the Banks made in relation to their lending book. What has happened to me is an occurrence of disgrace, for which the largest provider of lump sum investments in Ireland seems to acting in a very irregular manner.

So to all those that have invested or intend to invest large lump sums be very careful and do not believe by going to a Bank directly will post the best deal. Be very careful.
 
crumdub12 said:
You say stay in, why not sell , let it drop further, and if you still feel its a good fund (its not in my opinion) buy back at a lower price ??

Too many people giving advice to stick with little understanding of specific fund in thread
Click to expand...

With respect my friend i happen to have a very good & detailed knowledge of the breakdown on this fund/assets/spreads etc.. the fact it is relatively heavily weighted in UK commercial property is working against it at present/(price sterling/downgrade assets)obviously equity content struggling also. Though if this fund has not been one of the better/best funds on the Irish Market then i must be seriously misguided (The 14th annual MoneyMate and Investor Magazine Awards today (Friday, 23rd March 2007) awarded New Ireland's Evergreen Fund the title of Best Balanced Managed Investment Fund and Best Balanced Managed Pension Fund in the Irish market.)

What you are essentially suggesting is that this person crystalize their loss and then try to time the market, surely you are not advising the investor now to start gambling with their hardearned and break the fundemental rules of a long term investor.

Again my advice is only that, you may have your own ideas, but im pretty sure that the majority of people who have any experience of investing for the long term will agree with me despite the current difficulties which are of course worrying, but the fundamental investment rational has not changed has it?

Again this is nothing personal we are all feeling the pain at present.
 
crumdub12 said:
You say stay in, why not sell , let it drop further, and if you still feel its a good fund (its not in my opinion) buy back at a lower price ??
Click to expand...

If Revenue allowed you to offset losses against gains on unit-linked policies, this would possibly be an option. But they don't, so this transaction would make no sense.

You would get hit with any gains on the 'new' policy (lower amount invested) @ 23% (2008) / 26% (from 01/01/2009) when a 'chargeable event' (eg.surrender,partial encashment, 8th policy anniversary) took place.
 


Most people have lost money on initial outlay, so no capital gains involved
 


Thanks for the info,

To hang on would assume that UK Commercial property will bounce back, if thats your assumption , hang on in ....


By long term , I assume (maybe wrongly) you are talking 10+ years ....
 
crumdub12 said:
Thanks for the info,

To hang on would assume that UK Commercial property will bounce back, if thats your assumption , hang on in ....


By long term , I assume (maybe wrongly) you are talking 10+ years ....
Click to expand...


Your welcome i think its fair to say you needed it.
I also think its fair to say the whole point of my post has been lost on you even the bit about Sterlings weakness against the euro"being a large reason for the current poor performance of the Uk commercial property asset, in that i dont think this will continue over the longer term, you have provided no rational for your advice and seem to have no understanding about managed funds or the current difficulties the markets are experiencing.
Judging by the history of your previous threads and posts you are not someone who has shown any interest in this type of area to any regular degree.There are now alot of armchair Eamon Dunphy's out there, similiar to the type who knew everything about the propertry market up until recently but who have now gone quiet and have switched expertise to the financial markets without having any rational behind the move only that they are hearing alot about it and feel they have a right make themselves and their ideas heard.
You might want to make a case for your advice before you get to worked up, remember you are advising people on sometimes their entire life savings as seen here and if you have no reason for advising people to encash? then do everyone a favour and put away your crystal ball.
Don't take this to heart my friend i am just speaking my mind here.
 
crumdub12, better still why don't you pick another fund run by another fund manager.
 
crumdub12 said:
You say stay in, why not sell , let it drop further, and if you still feel its a good fund (its not in my opinion) buy back at a lower price ??
Click to expand...

crumdub12 said:
Most people have lost money on initial outlay, so no capital gains involved
Click to expand...

If I invested €10,000 in a fund last year and it's now worth €7,000 but I'm happy to stick with it, I'd be mad to cash in and re-invest, even if I could do so without transaction charges.

If I leave it where it is and it recovers to €12,000, I only pay Exit Tax on the €2,000 gain.

If I cash it in and re-invest the €7,000 now and it too rises to €12,000, I pay Exit Tax on €5,000 of a gain.
 


Johnny,

Still lookin for answers to why this fund will recover, hopefully you can provide them, and maybe a timeframe.

I pulled my money out, and have stated that.

I,m not the one getting worked up ..
 


Would the capital loss of first policy not be taken into account ?? , this is a genuine question.
 
crumdub12 said:
Johnny,

Still lookin for answers to why this fund will recover, hopefully you can provide them, and maybe a timeframe.

I pulled my money out, and have stated that.

I,m not the one getting worked up ..
Click to expand...

I am not a fund manager for NEW Ireland or BOI or any other fund and have no intersted in whether it does recover or not,trying to be objective here. its fair to say you have no understanding of the markets or the fund and have shown that in what you have already posted, try reading my replies and responding with fair comment instead of repeating yourself, ill add this in just to make it more obvious what one of my points was.
I do not have a crystal ball though so ill leave the guessing game up to yourself you obv have a chip on your shoulder about this fund as you lost money i assume and have lost objectivity.

Quote from earlier "I also think its fair to say the whole point of my post has been lost on you even the bit about Sterlings weakness against the euro being a large reason for the current poor performance of the Uk commercial property asset, in that i dont think this will continue over the longer term"
 
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