English - one of the most difficult languages to learn

Im looking for assistance in an arguement I had with my girlfriend. I claimed that English is one of the most difficult languages to learn but my girlfriend point-blank refuses to believe this. Her opinion is that Chinese and Japanese are more difficult to learn which I do not disagree with but I believe English to be quite high on the list also. Does anyone agree/disagree with me?

Zapa.

I always thought Finnish was the most difficult language but on refelction aren't there some tribes in the Amazon whose language is made up of clicks and sounds. I would have thought this fairly difficult to learn.

I don't think English is that difficult in principle but fluency with regard to slang and idiom is probably fairly hard...

Several people told us growing up that English was the hardest language, I remember one teacher in particular telling us this. Just because other languages like chinese have more letters that look completely different, doesn't make them more difficult.
English has tons of meanings for one word for example, won one, nun none etc.
Even after 27 years of speaking English, what I don't know could fill a warehouse.

tallpaul said:

I always thought Finnish was the most difficult language but on refelction aren't there some tribes in the Amazon whose language is made up of clicks and sounds. I would have thought this fairly difficult to learn.

I don't think English is that difficult in principle but fluency with regard to slang and idiom is probably fairly hard...

Click to expand...

Well English is my second language and it was not that difficult to learn. Basic proficiency in English is actually pretty easy, as the grammar is simple compared to other European languages. Even the multiplicity of tenses have a reasonable logic to them. The idioms are harder alright, but English in not unique in having those and IMO this is where the joy of learning a language really starts!

Hungarian, Finnish, Chinese etc are hard in that there is no common underlying european root to them, so you are starting from scratch as it were. Most kids in Europe learn English in primary school, so it is certainly not the hardest language to learn.

Basque is meant to be fairly inscrutible as well and its syntax is fiendishly indirect. Has a lot of language constructs not seen in other european languages - e.g. similar to the distinct nature of the likes of the orm, ort, uirthi type constructs in celtic languages, and not seen in other tongues.

Re clicking languages, I believe they come from the kalahari in southern Africa. I worked beside a South African last year who "clicked" when talking to his girlfriend on the phone. It was amazing because it was obvious the clicks had meaning. Infuriating for your average ear-wigger

Yeah, I remember hearing about English being one of the hardest languages to learn. I think it was a teacher who said it. Its hard to compare it when English is your first language, as the older you are when you learn a language the harder it is.

gearoid said:

Re clicking languages, I believe they come from the kalahari in southern Africa.

Click to expand...

The language in question is Xhosa.

I'd largely agree with earlier posters' comments about English - its grammar is very simple compared to many other languages, but to get beyond basic proficiency is difficult because of the range and variation of its vocabulary/pronunciation and its very idiosyncratic 'idiom/usage' features. Quite apart from all the UK/US/Australian/Irish versions (and the considerable regional variations within each of those strains), it's worth bearing in mind that there are far more speakers of English as a second language than there are 'native' speakers. Some readers may have witnessed the phenomenon of Japanese/Germans/Russians/Scandinavians, etc. conducting business in what's usually referred to as 'World English' - which of course they usually speak/understand better than 'native' English-speakers...

Oriental/Arabic/Cyrillic languages, of course, bring the additional difficulty of trying to learn a new script - but their grammar/morphology is not necessarily more complicated than, say, that of Gaeilge...

Well this article says it's the most difficult European language to read if that's any help to you
I think you're right to say that it ranks highly on the most difficult list alright.

Gearoid: so if you were listening in, they were speaking in English? But interspersing it with clicks? How interesting - woulda loved to have heard that

farmer said:

Well this article says it's the most difficult European language to read if that's any help to you
I think you're right to say that it ranks highly on the most difficult list alright.

Click to expand...

the New Scientist article is about learning to read, not learning the language. These are very different things. English is not as phonetic as other languages, so learning to read takes longer. However, with a phonetic alphabet such as Russian or Greek, you can learn to read relatievely easily, without learning any of the language. They are very different skills.

English is certainly among the most un-phonetic languages in the world. Even in RP (so-called 'received' pronunciation... ) there are 13 different ways of pronouncing the group of letters '-ough'.

The other old chestnut all EFL teachers know is the (probably apocryphal) anecdote about G. B. Shaw writing the word 'ghoti' on the blackboard and asking his pupils to hazard a guess at its correct pronounciation.

Anyone care to have a go..? (no googling, now!)

There are definitely more difficult languages out there. I pick up languages very quickly (can't count to save my life, must be something to do with the brain make-up?), but there have been a few over the years that were really difficult.

Xhosa has already been mentioned - I worked with Xhosa's for about 2 years and only picked up a smattering, such as hello, how are you, please and thank you. You get to know when they're cross tho', every second 'word' is a click!

Cantonese - lived in Macau for a year and came away with haggling skills in the market and the ability to give taxi drivers directions. Really difficult with the intonations - you may think you're ordering a bowl of soup in a restaurant and they bring you a bowl of sugar instead!

Arabic - spent 5 years in Arabic speaking countries and came away with very little - perhaps we had too little contact with Arabic speakers who didn't want to practice their English?

European languages are definitely easier to learn - even dialects like Swiss German - but would be, IMHO, not as easy as English.

Diziet: Yes, I know the link I put in is about reading rather than learning the language. Perhaps that's why I used the word "read" and qualified my post by adding "if that's any help to you". One could also argue that a part of learning a language is learning to read and write it.

> anecdote about G. B. Shaw writing the word 'ghoti' on the blackboard and asking his pupils to hazard a guess at its correct pronounciation.<

see if I can remember this....
gh = F (rough)
o = I (women)
ti = SH (any word ending in -tion - attention!)

therefore ghoti is pronounced - fish!

(I came across this at about age 8 - it obviously made an impression)

Right in one, O Gordanus..!

This is a very interesting debate.
I always thought that we were taught Irish and English in an unusual way in school in that we were thought about the poetry and the prose far more than the grammar and syntax.
When it came to learning European languages the emphasis was on the grammar hence a lot of people in school with me had a far better grasp of French Grammar than of English grammar.
Drives me absolutely crazy when people say things like:
"I seen" and "used of" just two of many.....
We may think that we are fluent English speakers but for many people our grammar usage is appaling.