Other E-scooters and insurance.

The legislation about e-scooters still seems to be at draft stage i.e. we don't have a finalised version.

An e-scooter would be very handy for me for local runs. I am extremely reluctant to get one because there does not seem to be any insurance company offering cover AFAIK. Specifically, I am thinking about liability cover in case I hit someone or something due to my negligence.
Is any insurer offering cover ?

I saw an argument recently to say that they might be covered under the public liability part of a household insurance policy.
I am not confident about that proposition.
I believe that e-scooters are actually mechanically propelled vehicle as defined under the RTA 1961- section 3 [interpretation].
I suspect that a house insurance policy would not cover me as public liability insurance usually excludes liability arising from mechanically propelled vehicles.

AFAIK the draft legislation will redefine e-scooters as powered personal transporters [PPTs].
I doubt if that will solve the problem. I can see a conflict of laws being created whereby the same two wheeled gizmo is a mechanically propelled vehicle under the RTA 1961 and not under the Road Traffic Miscellaneous Provision act as it will be called.
How will insurers deal with that ?

you won't legally need insurance for a PPT, assuming it falls under that definition and the legislation is ever actually enacted. If you hit someone with one and they were injured, they could presumably sue you, in the same way as if you hit them with a bike or barged into them while jogging. They'd have to prove liability obviously. I doubt you'll find an insurance policy that covers you for that though.

As an aside, if you're a cyclist and a member of Cycling Ireland (which most clubs require) you have some insurance cover, but I'm not sure if it includes 3rd party liability.

daveinchcape said:

An e-scooter would be very handy for me for local runs. I am extremely reluctant to get one because there does not seem to be any insurance company offering cover AFAIK.

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They are still illegal to use in public spaces, and so you won't find an insurer willing to cover an illegal activity.

daveinchcape said:

I saw an argument recently to say that they might be covered under the public liability part of a household insurance policy.
I am not confident about that proposition.

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True, you would need to be cautious here, some policies limit liability cover to incidents arising in or around the home. A broker might be best placed to advise on policies that have the cover you want.

daveinchcape said:

I can see a conflict of laws being created whereby the same two wheeled gizmo is a mechanically propelled vehicle under the RTA 1961 and not under the Road Traffic Miscellaneous Provision act as it will be called.

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That won't arise, the new legislation will amend pre-existing legislation as required.

Leo said:

They are still illegal to use in public spaces, and so you won't find an insurer willing to cover an illegal activity.

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Sorry if this sounds pedantic but are they actually illegal in public places as distinct from not being legal in a public place.
Hair splitting by me ? Yes, But is this not the worry and the confusion about them ?

Whatever the legality, there are literally thousands in the streets of Dublin every day.

I don’t see the liability situation being any different from riding a bicycle.

I’ve used bicycles and electric scooters a lot. I feel much less likely to hit someone on a scooter simply as it has less momentum. For my scooter the speed is capped at 22km/h, the brake is better, and there’s much more rolling resistance so it comes to a dead stop much quicker

A bicycle isn't technically illegal though. And insurance isn't required.

The issue is if you get public liability insurance will it be void by riding an illegal scooter. Thus really an issue to ask the insurer and check the policy.

daveinchcape said:

Sorry if this sounds pedantic but are they actually illegal in public places as distinct from not being legal in a public place.
Hair splitting by me ? Yes, But is this not the worry and the confusion about them ?

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Yes, actually illegal as they still fall under the definition of a motorised vehicle in the Road Traffic Act, and to use a motorised vehicle legally on the road it must fall under one of the allowed type definitions and then meet the further requirements of that type in terms of type approval, licensing, insurance,etc.. There has been lots of media coverage of Gardai seizing them as such.