Contracts signed closing set Buyers trying to pull out

"I wouldn't tolerate these people dicking you around."

You don't know this. There may well be issues that have not been disclosed.

"I would obviously do as the solicitor says. "

"he said we are entitled to keep the deposit. " If they wish.

OP has been given a full range of peoples views. Legally they can keep the deposit but I think the question really being asked is "should they?"

That is a very personal decision. The last time this occurred in my office, I advised the clients of this. As it happened, they sold again quite quickly, they were at little loss, they took a small proportion of the deposit and refunded the rest. They said that they felt bad about taking any more than the situation cost them.

Its a personal decision.

mf
 
I wouldnt agree that its a personal decision as this in itself is a bit simplistic. Every decision made by a person could be charachterised as personal ! MF1 even your post shows that there is a stronf financial reasoning behind this decision .i.e. it did not cost your clients much so they kept what it cost them and returned the rest. The advice you provided may have suited your client but to suggest to the poster (who seems to be reasonable) that they should give it back without first calculating the financial loss that will be suffered by them through no fault of their own is wrong. They should keep the deposit until they calculate their losses . this will take months due to bridging loan and current market circumstances.
 
Yeah I agree with keeping the deposit until the matter is sorted. I would refund them some of it so long as my financials had been covered, that is only fair but they will appreciate getting some of it back too.
 
mf1 said:
You don't know this. There may well be issues that have not been disclosed.
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Regardless of what the "issues" are, they are not relevant. Entering into a contract and then pulling at someone's heartstrings to get out of it strikes me as a cynical ploy. Conceding on this issue merely encourages other people not to take contracts seriously.
Having said that there is another point of view. You could find out why they want to pull out of the sale. If it's merely that they've changed their mind then they deserve the financial penalty. If it's something medical or health related for example then you could return your "profit" on the transaction to them. You would have to be compensated for any decrease in the selling price, extra interest, further legal/auctioneer costs, and the "hassle factor".
 
sorry... advertising fees .25%
legal fees 1%
Bridging loan 4.5%(6months)
Bridging loan further 6 months 4.5%??
for further 6/12 hassle while waiting for funds from sale & anxiety looking at market! 1% is that a total of 12.75% . My figures may be way off but could be something to think about if you feel BAD! for keeping the deposit which may not even cover your costs

sorry and dont forget maybe a 5% fall in the sale agreed price!!
 
"The advice you provided may have suited your client but to suggest to the poster (who seems to be reasonable) that they should give it back without first calculating the financial loss that will be suffered by them through no fault of their own is wrong. "

I did not advise them to give back anything. I simply said that this is a personal decision. They have to make their own mind up. They have gotten a huge range of advice. In the end it is their decision what they do.

"Regardless of what the "issues" are, they are not relevant. Entering into a contract and then pulling at someone's heartstrings to get out of it strikes me as a cynical ploy. Conceding on this issue merely encourages other people not to take contracts seriously."

I think the issues are relevant. I can choose to take the hard line every time if I wish - I can equally choose to do unto others............

I am simply making the point that there are legal issues - yes, you are right, no, you are wrong and there are equally moral/personal/karma type issues. I am a lawyer - but what is legal is not necessarily morally right. The OP must make their own decision based on their own conscience. My conscience would prevent me from profitting on someone elses misfortune. If such be the case. Which we don't know. I would not be at a loss. But nor would I be profitting.

mf
 
Obviously you are entitled to your opinion and given that you are a solicitor that opinion carries some weight. However I think it's disgraceful for a member of the legal profession to start mentioning "karma" when they should be acting in their client's best interest. Put another way, I think it's outrageous and immoral for the would be purchaser to ask for their money back and give the vendor this "dilemma".
 
mf1 said:
"I wouldn't tolerate these people dicking you around."

You don't know this. There may well be issues that have not been disclosed.
Click to expand...

Indeed. The OP has asked for a reason why the prospective buyer won't proceed and none is forthcoming. They won't even take calls.

In these circumstances, I would take a hard line myself and at a minimum keep the deposit, if not seeking also redress for any further losses if they arise.
 
"Put another way, I think it's outrageous and immoral for the would be purchaser to ask for their money back and give the vendor this "dilemma"."

A. We don't actually know what their circumstances are - they may very well have foolishly placed themselves in a terrible situation. They may have been badly advised. They may have been downright stupid.
B. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
C. "However I think it's disgraceful for a member of the legal profession to start mentioning "karma" when they should be acting in their client's best interest."

I don't agree. I and my clients can profit endlessly on other peoples misfortunes. They may well be legally right. They may be morally wrong. I will advise my clients of their legal rights but they have to make their own decision on the merits, I don't make their decision for them and it is equally wrong for people to say ( as a lot of people do) Hey, its not me, its the lawyer.
D. In 25 years of legal experience, nothing holds truer for me than "what goes round, comes round."

mf
 
mf1 said:
We don't actually know what their circumstances are - they may very well have foolishly placed themselves in a terrible situation. They may have been badly advised. They may have been downright stupid.
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Once again, the OP has asked for reasons why the buyer doesn't want to proceed and they are being stonewalled. How would you advise a client in that situation?
 
OP - what is the market like at present in your area ? Is it depressed at all - is there a chance the buyers could pick up similar house for a lower price ? Is your price any way near the current stamp duty thresholds ?

I'm just suggesting that all of these factors may be in play giving the buyers quite a large potential saving, placing you at a financial loss (if house prices are deflating in your area).
 
"Once again, the OP has asked for reasons why the buyer doesn't want to proceed and they are being stonewalled."


"Hopefully the soliticor will hear something back by the weekend."

Let it play out. Then make your own decision.

mf
 
It is totally reasonable for the OP to know why the vendor wants to withdraw and then to decide whether to retain all, part or none of the deposit - assuming they can accept or check that the reason is valid and non-negotiable. If the buyer won't give a valid reason then I don't see how the seller can make a decision on moral grounds and he/she should therefore retain all of it.

Sarah

www.mortgagesoverseas.com
 
What happens if the deposit was paid with "dirty" money? Proceeds from tax evasion, drugs, crime etc.?
 
MrKeane said:
What happens if the deposit was paid with "dirty" money? Proceeds from tax evasion, drugs, crime etc.?
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A touch extreme, don't you think?
There would be no consequences for the OP...the "buyer" would get a phone call from someone at the CAB though!
 
How about turning this situation on its head for a second and see how it would pan out:
  • OP sale agrees with prospective buyer at agreed price
  • Prospective buyer lodges deposit
  • Contracts are signed
  • Deposit becomes non-refundable and is cashed
  • OP pulls out of the deal as he has noticed that prices have risen by over 10% during the sale agreed period, but will not give a reason to the prospective buyer as to why he wantsto pull out of the deal
Now do you think the prospective buyer in this situation would have a 'moral dilemma' invoking their legal rights????????????

Thus why do people think the OP should be in a dilemma in the reverse of this scenario?
 
I've been though this before - pre-contract - cost me a lot of money in terms of bridging. I don't get all this talk of morality. Look, it does not take much to explain ones reasons for trying to pull out of a contract. It's only common courtesy - a quality singularly lacking in a lot of house sales in my experience. Nothing is more frustrating as a vendor than dealing with non-communicating buyers. In my experience radio silence from the other sides solicitors only ever means one thing -they are having second thoughts. In this case they went as far as signing the contract - their solicitor will have advised them exactly what they were letting themselves in for. Now maybe the sale of their own house fell through - but that's their problem - you are not selling two houses. If I were the OP I would ask my solicitor to send notice of continuance. The buyers have made a financial mistake - it should not be for the vendor to shoulder the cost in this instance.
 
amgd28 - once the contracts are signed the seller cannot pull out. The buyer can sue to enforce the contract.

mf1 - I agree with you in this respect, I would not profit but I wouldn't be at a loss either. That's the right thing to do. But if they were messing me around I would take the whole deposit which I don't think would be immoral in these circumstances.

OP- at this stage the total losses are unknown. Looking on the bright side, maybe you'll sell again for an even higher amount and the buyers will have done you a favour. You'd be very happy to give them back the deposit then I guess.
 
If i hired a solicitor at great expence for legal advice and they based their advice on "karma" i would burn a track in the carpet running out the door. I would then probably report them to the law society!!
 
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