Buying family home after grant of probate - stamp duty

[bmount]

I am evaluating buying the house that my dad left us (4 children).
My brother is the executor and is agreeable in principle.
The probate has been granted to proceed.

So I would pay 75% of the market value ( i e give 25% of the agreed purchase price to each of my 3 siblings)

I would be getting a mortgage for the full amount (this is still a "75%" mortgage as well).

My question is:
Do I have to pay 1% stamp duty or not, and if I do is it on the mortgage amount of the agreed price ?

many thanks for any replies.

 

[mf1]

Stamp duty is payable on the market value of the shares being acquired - you already own 25% so you pay stamp duty on the rest.

Simple example - house value ( i.e on the open market) 200k. You are acquiring 150K. Stamp duty is 1% of 150K = 1500.00

mf

 

[bmount]

Mf, many thanks for the quick reply.

The damage is a little less than I thought (i e 75% of the 1%) but I'd obviously be looking to avoid this as much as possible. If you know of anyway in Will/Executor type situations to eliminate stamp duty please let me know.

 

[Billo]

Stamp duty is payable on the market value of the shares being acquired - you already own 25% so you pay stamp duty on the rest.

Simple example - house value ( i.e on the open market) 200k. You are acquiring 150K. Stamp duty is 1% of 150K = 1500.00

mf

Where can I verify this information ?

I am in a similar situation to above and solicitor intends to charge stamp duty on full market value , not on the 75%.

Rgds

Billo

 

[mf1]

Start with Section 52 (8) of the 1965 Succession Act.

In broad (very broad before anyone starts picking holes!) terms, where an executor is carrying out the terms of a Will in relation to the vesting of property in a named/specified beneficiary, it says

"This section shall not operate to impose any stamp duty in respect of an assent."

So - where there is a Deed of Family Arrangement to vary the terms of a will, it changes the nature of the operation from an assent to a conveyance on sale and that is where the stamp duty liability arises. Since you already own X% under the will, then you should not pay stamp duty on that percentage.

Revenue will adjudicate if the solicitor is uneasy about this.

mf

 

[Billo]

Thanks mf1

Good news but does the following apply in Ireland ?

"Deeds of Variation are very useful instruments and can be utilised up to 2 years after the date of death as long as all the effected beneficiaries under the Will are in agreement to the change being made."

2 years ?

Thanks

Billo

 

[mercman]

Just another point, and as far as I am aware, but the stamp duty should be half of the regular amount as the transaction is between blood relatives.

 

[mf1]

Thanks mf1

Good news but does the following apply in Ireland ?

"Deeds of Variation are very useful instruments and can be utilised up to 2 years after the date of death as long as all the effected beneficiaries under the Will are in agreement to the change being made."

2 years ?

Thanks

Billo

I'm not aware that we have any such time limit in Ireland.

mf

 

[mf1]

Just another point, and as far as I am aware, but the stamp duty should be half of the regular amount as the transaction is between blood relatives.

Consanguinity relief has been abolished for residential property. I have an idea it still subsists for non-residential property until

2014.


mf

 

[Billo]

Thanks mf1,

I rang Revenue to double check and they agree that in this situation stamp should be based on 75%.


Rgds

Billo

 

[osullivant]

Depending on the situation, If Your siblings disclaim their gift of the share it will fall into residue, if they were to subsequently disclaim this then would it pass to you.??

The revenue site gives details on this as a means of avoiding CAT on disclaimed gifts, you can also disclaim for consideration this has implications but I think the outcome would be that the gift would pass on assent.

Just my thoughts, use them or not at your peril.