Buying a House in France ?

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polo1

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Hi
I am thinking of buying a house in the South of France.. Does anyone know any good websites or where I could start looking for places.. Not too bothered on location once in driveable distance from beech etc..
How different is it from buying here in Ireland.
Any advise most grateful?

Thanks, Joanne
 
We are buying in France at the moment and it is painfull. Talk about dotting the I and crossing the t. We did the deal in September and we are not closing untill end of March.
They never heard of such a thing as a survey and the legal people take such a long time to do everything.
There are loads of great websites to choose from. Just google "property for sale France"
 
If you are looking to buy (rather than leaseback) here are a few sites to get you started :D (some are in French, and if you can read it, I would recommend you use the English ones for reference only, why give a cut to the English agent ;) as well as the French one and the notaire):

http://www.wanadoo.fr/bin/frame.cgi?service=utile_et_pratique&u=http://immobilier.wanadoo.fr

http://www.pro-a-part.com/default3.asp?secteur=IDF

http://www.vefuk.com/

http://www.bluehomes.com/blue-en/

[broken link removed]

http://www.french-property.com/

We bought a couple of years ago with absolutely no hassle. The French don't usually do surveys as we do, although there are obligitory lead, termite, flood-zone mentions on the legal side. The notaire appointed by the seller is the one to use. He/she will be completely neutral, you may wish to appoint your own Irish solicitor if you are worried about inheritance issues (clause tontine etc.). You may also want to hire a translator.

A good forum for the buying/selling process is
http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/ and also


bonne chance!
 
As frais d'agence or EA fees are 6/5% it is worth looking to buy direct from the notaire. If you use and enter your preferrred town or village, the the department number this will bring up a list of notaires in that area. If you are looking for a bilingual notaire in the Languedoc Region I can help so feel free to PM on that. You can also use the above site to find "agences immobilier" which are estate agents. When using an agency make sure they are a member of FNAIM - National Federation of Estate Agents www.fnaim.fr.
 
There are a number of issues you should be aware of:

1. Inheritance - Already mentioned.

2. Tax - CGT. France has recently introduced a new tax similar to CGT which is not covered by the Current Double taxation agreement altough it is expected to be ratified soon. Until it is ratified you pay CGT in both countries and can't offset the tax paid in France against the Irish liability.
 
Hi Polo,

At the moment, one of the very attractive areas on the cote d'azur are Beausoleil (at the door of Monaco), Cagnes sur mer, Cannes la Bocca... all walking distance from the beach...

Have you an idea of what you are looking for? Leaseback, buy to let....

[Advertising deleted by DrMoriarty — please respect the posting guidelines]
http://www.eupp.co.uk
 
Hey,

regarding the CGT - my understanding is that you pay it in France (what is the rate in france?) & then pay CGT in Ireland on the net amount. Is that correct?
asdfg - do you know when they intend to include this in double tax treaty?
 
I have just come across a house for sale in the Aude region near Carcasonne airport for €190k. It is a beautiful house with 2 bedrooms and a 2 year old pool in the garden. What would the final bill come to when all would be added up. Just at the initial stage of looking
thanks
Dave
 
Just a few points to add to all the above...

Watch out for planning issues if buying a one-off house, especially one that has been built in the past 10 to 15 years.

French law is very weighted in favour of the buyer, so buying there is not the nightmare that sometimes be encountered in other places like Italy for instance.

Notaire system is very good and completely neutral as someone already said

Most leasebacks are not a good long term investment; although they usually deliver in terms of returns promised, they are hard to offload at end of life and do not usually provide a good return overall. Issues with common areas and pools etc can add costs that were not planned at the outset. Be very wary of leasebacks, although not all are bad.
 
Thanks for the information. As part of the finance will come from a mortgage, has anyone got info on wheither this should be done in France or Ireland? Does anyone know of an Irish based advisor that can be relied on to give legal and practical advice? Is there anyone on the east coast that would be willing to meet up to share their own experiences. Lunch or dinner in Dublin, Dundalk ,Belfast?? my treat, your choice of time and venue.
Many thanks
Dave
 
Hi Dave,

I work in an estate agents in Nice, so maybe I can provide some info.

French mortgages are cheaper than Irish mortgages. The lowest rate we have found at the moment is a 15 year mortgage on 80% for 3.4%. (variable)

The quote above is with a French lender. I don't think they have an English-speaker in the whole office. The lenders that have English-speaking divisions will charge a premium for this 'luxury'. My advice is to get a translator.

I don't know anyone in Ireland who can help you out with this one. Try google.

Also, the general rule on this website seems to be to add 10% on the listed price. Its around 8%, in my experience, in France.

The listing price is inclusive of agency comission of around 6% (of which, 1% is vat). Agency fee is, on average, a set 10k commission until 150k. Then 6% or 7% thereafter. Several agencies could have the same property at completely different prices, so its worth shopping around.

The 8% above the listing price covers Notaire's fees, who are very regulated and buyer-friendly.

Buying in France shouldn't be a lot of hassle. Once you know the system and the culture, its a breeze.
 
Riviera,

Very interesting on the mortgage rates. Can't a translator be found independently in France ?

I've been told it's better to get your mortgage in France as it's easier to offset rent & exps that way. Also my contract gives me a way out if the mortgage is refused.

Would you agree ?

I'm buying a buy-to-let in Perpignan. I think prices there are a bit more reasonable than Nice
 
Perplexed,

Presumably, translators can be found in Perpignan. Or at least someone who can be a 'translator for a day'.

When you buy an apartment in France, you first sign a 'compromis de vente', which takes the property off the market (whilst giving the buyer a 7 day reflection period).

There is a section on the 'compromis' which states whether you require financing or not. If you apply for a french mortgage, and get refused, you get your deposit back. If you don't apply for a french mortgage (and apply for an irish mortgage), and you don't get financing, you lose your deposit.

On the compromis you have to state something to the effect: 'i plan to apply for mortgages with the following banks..'.

Always apply for a French mortgage. It covers you.

Interest on (french) mortgage interest, any renovations/works and transaction costs (such as agency and notaire's fee's) can be written off on tax.

Capital gains tax is 16% for foreign residents.

Us, French Residents, are hit for 24%. Still not bad.

The next section is very biased. I sell buy-to-lets in Nice.

I'm not that familiar with perpignan as a buy-to-let location. Returns are good in Nice due to the holiday rental market. You can rent an apartment per week for the same price you can get per month on a long-term contract. For a decent apartment, you should be getting 20 weeks a year. thats a hefty profit after mortgage repayments. And the apartment is yours for the other 30 weeks.

Nice is good for capital appreciation too. The tramway will be finished Sept 2007 (add 2 months or so :) ). The marketing potential of an apartment in Nice (or anywhere on the Riviera), is better than the South-West of France.

Your money probably does go a longer way in the SW, but returns are higher in the SE.

What price range are you buying in Perpignan?
 
Remember Perplexed, your money will go a lot further if you avoid lease backs which are sold at inflated prices and go and check out the local market personally. Also remember when arranging a mortgage in France that the bank will charge you a fee for your mortgage- quite hefty too- so this has to be taken into account too. French banks love red tape, expect lenghty delays. If you can, better to go for a broker who has some english, which will help enormously! Also be very careful of the type of property you buy. In my opinion some of the leasebacks currently being sold won't appreciate, and when guaranteed rental period is over I forsee problem in sales- these are the hotel room type leasebacks. Of course an apartment which is decently sized will always have some potential, depending on location. Was targetted recently for a leaseback scheme in south france ( advertised as near coastal holiday resort)- when I looked up area, it was 40km from coast, tiny studio, who is going to rent this? So really, don't let common sense out the window when viewing potential buys.
 
What are the best areas in Nice for buy-to -let's and what is the price range for such properties. How would Nice compare to Perpignan as regards price for similar properties.
 
I'm not familiar with property in perpignan so I have nothing to compare to.

Give me an example of something in Perpignan and I can tell you about something similar in Nice.

Best place for holiday lets in Nice: pm me.

There are a lot of tourists in Nice - strong market for short term lets.

I agree with Vanilla. Keep away from Leasebacks. They are for 'depressed' areas with no suitable tourism infrastructure.

Leasebacks are very very rare on the Cote d'Azur.
 
riviera said:
I'm not familiar with property in perpignan so I have nothing to compare to.

Give me an example of something in Perpignan and I can tell you about something similar in Nice.

Best place for holiday lets in Nice: pm me.

There are a lot of tourists in Nice - strong market for short term lets.

I agree with Vanilla. Keep away from Leasebacks. They are for 'depressed' areas with no suitable tourism infrastructure.

Leasebacks are very very rare on the Cote d'Azur.
Click to expand...
I personally don't think you can compare properties in Nice and Perpignan as they are two very different markets.

Perplexed, you may find riviera's responses useful / helpful, but bear in mind that he/she is an Estate Agent in Nice and may have an agenda other than offering friendly advice.

IMO, you need to be very careful when dealing with estate agents abroad. I don't think it's advisable to give them any information prior to viewings i.e. what your budget is, your financial position etc.

As an example: we recently bought an apartment not far from Perpignan. We paid €156,000 - a fair price for the unit on offer according to research and information from others who own property there.

We were decorating the apartment last month and happened to meet two Irish people in the lift who were looking at an identical apartment directly below ours, save that theirs was in better decorative condition.

They had been in contact with the agent from Ireland and had given details about their financial situation, budget etc., and had pre-arranged viewings of properties 'within their budget of 250,000' with this agent.

The apartment he showed them was on the market for €220,000 - that's a whopping €64,000 more than ours. We warned them that the price had probably been inflated based on the fact that they were Irish and the information they had given the agent.

As with anything else, caveat emptor!

If you need the assistance of a translator, there is an English language magazine [broken link removed] in which there are some ads for such services. [broken link removed] offer a 'hand holding' service in the area right through the finding and buying process.

I have no affiliation with either of these sites and cannot vouch for any of their services.
 
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