BMW Dealer Rip Off?

Mr2 said:

As part of Main dealer standars only 4th year apprentice can do a first service and at that the service manager has to sign off on all his work.

You get a qualified technician, who checks lights/ levels, greese door locks, check suspension, engine , gearbox, windows, boot, spare wheel, adj, tyre pressure, checks brakes, coolant boiling point etc and the list goes on. If you get you car back from "fred in the shed" and it only takes a half an hour, do you think he has done everything?

We get more repair work out of people who get private Technicians to do there service than we do from the cars we service. Fact is there not done to dealer standars. Even a Technician who has left a main dealer after only one year is not up to date with the systems and practises we use every day.

One a week I get new service update's for M.B, for better maintained cars for our customers that stay in the dealer network. If your not in it you wont know and when a problem arises you suffer.

It does take 30 mins to do an oil change, the rest is preventive maintaince, tightning and adjusting etc. How do you do something correct if you don't have a ramp or a cumputer to tell if you had a minor elec fault that the light flashed on and off and you thought nothing of it, but when we service it, it's stored.

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I simply do not believe any of this. Sorry. Technicians me eye. They are mechanics. My experience of all marques is that preventative maintenance is laughable. Problems are solved as they occur. The workshop manual may list procedure after procedure, but this is Ireland.

Not 1 of them in the country is worth €150 per hour either.

rs2k i have too agree ,,some people dont feel right unless there paying through the pecker for it so leave them at it

RS2K said:

I'm not suggesting BMW are not a good car. 3 series sells more than Mondeo model range against model range.

They are a volume manufacturer. To suggest otherwise is simply misguided.

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Do you have the numbers for Ireland or bigger countries like the States, or is it just the UK and perhaps Germany? What about world stats for total Mondeo sales (or equiv) compared to 3 series?

but one thing i have to say there is a big difference between a technican and a mechanic,no average mechanic these days would have a clue with the level of electronics these days on vehicles but one thing you gotta remember is there is no technican in ireland getting 150,per hour the garage may be, but top technican would be lucky to get 20 per hour

Every market is different, you cant compare even England to us so please don't. Spec and engines that are over here compared to there are bought in different quanities so it's not the same.

RSK2: Please for the crack, take 5 mins from your day and let us know how far you get into changing the oil you get. Would you even have it on the ramp safetly and bonnet open? Get real.

Also do you work in a garage every day, do you see the training they go through each year. I'd say you and poss wife get a car serviced once a year or so, so your information is very limited to the experience you have had. And if you only go to a main dealer for problem work and not main line service experience as in my other post's on other threads, your already annoyed your car has broke down etc and now you have to wait
for a slot in the workshop and parts etc of course your not going to be thrilled about the experience.

To be honest if your buying a car for safety etc and a Technician is €150.00 per hour but I know that my family are going to get the best service I can get for them and the car will be right when I get it back I'd pay it. It goes the same for buying cheap tyres, brakes etc.

I cant put a price on what my wife or family are worth but you can because your not willing to pay the best qualified person to service your car. And the best qualified person is a fully trained dealer technician.

ford jedi said:

there is no technican in ireland getting 150,per hour the garage may be, but top technican would be lucky to get 20 per hour

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And if the technician got €150 an hour what would the garage use to pay the bills? The rate you pay your staff in a capital-intensive business should be somewhere between 20 and 25% of the hourly rate you charge. More than that and you risk being eaten by your competitors, less and you risk going out of business.
Therefore if the mechanic or technician (to me a technician would be less skilled than a mechanic) is getting €20 an hour then the punter should be charged €80 - €100 an hour for labour.
Main dealers who are required to carry high levels of stock and/or have big mortgages on their spanking new showrooms may need to charge at a higher multiple.

Mr2 said:

Every market is different, you cant compare even England to us so please don't. Spec and engines that are over here compared to there are bought in different quanities so it's not the same.

RSK2: Please for the crack, take 5 mins from your day and let us know how far you get into changing the oil you get. Would you even have it on the ramp safetly and bonnet open? Get real.

Also do you work in a garage every day, do you see the training they go through each year. I'd say you and poss wife get a car serviced once a year or so, so your information is very limited to the experience you have had. And if you only go to a main dealer for problem work and not main line service experience as in my other post's on other threads, your already annoyed your car has broke down etc and now you have to wait
for a slot in the workshop and parts etc of course your not going to be thrilled about the experience.

To be honest if your buying a car for safety etc and a Technician is €150.00 per hour but I know that my family are going to get the best service I can get for them and the car will be right when I get it back I'd pay it. It goes the same for buying cheap tyres, brakes etc.

I cant put a price on what my wife or family are worth but you can because your not willing to pay the best qualified person to service your car. And the best qualified person is a fully trained dealer technician.

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I change the oil in the classic car myself. It takes me 10 minutes tops. No ramps are needed, but I use a trolley jack and axle stands for convenience.

A "technician" (or indeed a receptionist) would take even less time using a proper lift.

BMW must love you. Happy to pay €150 per hour for a spanner monkey

What training do you need to change oil/filter or brake pads?

RS2K said:

I simply do not believe any of this. Sorry. Technicians me eye. They are mechanics. My experience of all marques is that preventative maintenance is laughable. Problems are solved as they occur. The workshop manual may list procedure after procedure, but this is Ireland.

Not 1 of them in the country is worth €150 per hour either.

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Well said. This is rip off Ireland. full stop.

Mr2 said:

I cant put a price on what my wife or family are worth but you can because your not willing to pay the best qualified person to service your car. .

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Whether you like it or not you put a price on your family, Now you might claim that it's a higher price than the target of your rant puts but you still put a price.

I didn't put a price on it, someone else set the price.

RSK2 I'm sure maintaining a classis car is not the same as a new(ish) BMW or new(ish) car.

I'd love to see a receptionist change a set of brake pads and do it correctly.

Training: on what temp the car should be to change the oil, how the car needs to be level to get all the oil out of the sump, how to know to replace the washer on the bung every time, how not to tighten it to tight so as you dont crack the sump. Put the right grade of oil into the car. Don't over tighten the filter. How after you put the recomended level of oil in the car you let it run for a few mins and then re-check the oil level. I shant go into brakes or anything else because I'd be here all day.

Do you think everyone is born with this knowledge and ability?

I can guarantee you would not be able to do this at home with axel stands and a jack in five mins. And if you were actually truthful about it, the 5 min job that you do is not correct.

Ah come off it!

An oil change is an oil change. It consists of running the engine until it's warm (a 5 minute drive will do this ) then removing sump plug and draining old oil out, then removing oil filter. Then you prime and fit new oil filter, replace sump plug, and fill with the correct amount of new oil of an appropriate specification.

It's the same for every car, modern and classic, & even something as special as a new BMW 316i

Nobody is born knowledgeable, but we do learn simple tasks easily. A receptionist could do an oil change with marrigold gloves on, with perhaps 10 minutes of training.

But if it makes you happy to pay €150 p.h. for this magical task, please carry right on.

Changing brake pads is very simple too btw. I had a seized piston in one of the callipers (classic car) recently, and despite having no training nor help whatsoever (bar a Haynes manual), I managed to remove the pads, and retract the piston, and eventually freed it up. The brakes worked perfectly afterwards.

I also changed the brake fluid, coolant, and removed and reverse flushed the rad. before refilling, and bleeding both systems. Following all this I drove the car 700 miles, without it missing a beat.

This will shock and no doubt amaze you, but I could do exactly the same to a new BMW. Any model. It's basic skills, not the stuff of 4th year apprentices, never mind "technicians".

p.s. The 10 minute oil change is a reality. It doesn't concern me if you don't believe it is.

I have to agree with RS2K. An oil change on any car is basic stuff that 1st year apprentices do. I'm not the most technical but have done loads of them on both old and new cars. Its not exactly rocket surgery!

RS2K said:

p.s. The 10 minute oil change is a reality. It doesn't concern me if you don't believe it is.

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I believe you!

How do you dispose of the old oil?