birth registration /marriage annulment query

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snowdrop

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My irish national sibling and his philipina partner have just had a beautiful baby boy. They are not married and his partner has a philipina annulment from her philipina marriage.

They are trying to register the birth of their son here with his irish father's surname and are getting conflicting advice as to how to do this as apparently the annulment is not recognized here.

Does anyone have any advice or experience of this situation. I should also point out that he has an appointment on monday with his solicitor regarding establishing his legal guardianship etc. of his son.

Any advice much appreciated, thanks.
 
Nor should the recognition of the anulment be relevant either.

Was the baby born here? As far as I remember the hospital got the ball rolling for us.
 
They are not married and his partner has a philipina annulment from her philipina marriage
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As you are using the word "annulment", I assume you mean a catholic church wedding annulment as opposed to a divorce.

This comes back to the fact that generally, two types of wedding take place simultaneously in a church ceremony. The first part is the religious ceremony whereby a couple become married in the eyes of the catholic church. This is NOT legally recognised in law in Ireland (or most places). The catholic church sometimes annuls these weddings for various reasons, but again, as the original ceremony is not recognised in law, neither is the annulment. The second wedding that takes place is the civil ceremony which is the signing of the civil marriage register which takes place at the end of the ceremony. This part IS what is recognised in law. It cannot be annuled (by the church). Only a civil divorce through the family law courts can break this marriage.

If it is the case that your siblings OH got married (in Philipines?) in the past in a church ceremony with the usual religious and civil components (as with most wedding), and then at a later date, was granted a (church) annulment, then in the eyes of the law, she is still legally married to the person in the Philipines and will not become "single" unless she goes through civil divorce proceedings.

Where you are having problems is that in Ireland, a married woman can generally only register a birth with either her own surname and/or her husbands surname (remember that she is still regarded as legally married). A partners name can only be used if the woman is legally single.
 
AFAIR, the hospital will not register the birth if the parents are not married to each other, or one or both of the parents are non Irish nationals. Your best bet may be to ring the general registars office and ask, who has been giving the conflicting advice? I *think*, and I'm really not sure about this, that if his partner is still recognised as married, then the child is automaticaly assumed to be her husbands, which is where the problems come in.

http://www.groireland.ie/
 
I've just checked with my sibling; the annulment is a civil annulment not a religious annulment. It's an annulment because there is no divorce in the philippines.
The cert of finality document was issued from the supreme court regional trial court of the lanao del lorte 12th judicial region branch 2 family court of the city of iligan, dated february 2006.(all forms are in english)

No-one in the registrars office seems to know exactly what to do. They're saying that the registration can't take place because they see the ex-husband as the father as she's still considered married. (i wonder if this is because they think "annulment" only means a religious one??)
They've told him he (my brother) has to get guardianship of the baby first. So they both signed the guardianship statutory declaration today in front of solicitor/commissioner of oaths and he's now been told they both have to turn up at the district court with the said declaration.

However, I see nothing on the citizens information site to indicate that they also need to go to the district court as they have both signed the statutory declaration. The cit. info. site would indicate that the court visit is only necessary if the mother doesn't agree to the joint guardianship. Is that the case?

Also, the cit. info site section on birth registration says "It is also possible to enter the father's details if the mother is married to someone else." - so even if her civil annulment is not being recognised surely my brother can still be listed as the father?

Even more bizarrely, when my brother asked today if he wasn't in the picture would his partner be able to register the birth, he was told no. Surely this can't be right?

I have a suspicion that the various people he's been talking to are ill-informed - in general he says, they're anxious to pass him on to someone else.

BTW - I'm doing the posting here as he doesnt have access to the net at the moment so apologies for the third hand reporting.
 
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I've just checked with my sibling; the annulment is a civil annulment not a religious annulment. It's an annulment because there is no divorce in the philippines.
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One thing you need to clarify is the status of a Phillipines legal annulment. Is the same as a "legal separation" in Ireland whereby the two parties are legally living separate lives, though still officially married (as was common before divorce was brought in here) OR is it that, it spite of both parties having had a wedding ceremony, the marriage was not legal as one of the parties was incapable or ineligible to be married? - the reason they got an annulment may clarify this.

I could understand why people in Ireland are misunderstanding this. Maybe they are aware that divorce does not exist in Phillipines, so are taking the view that an "annulment" is like a legal separation? Is there any way the Phillipine authorities could be brought in to confirm exactly what the situation is?
 
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