Bankers/regulators/government: is everybody not really cross with what has happened?

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Bronte

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Is everybody not really cross with what has happened to Ireland. With the way all bankers and regulators and politicians have played fast and loose with our economy. Or is everybody so depressed that they are cowed, especially those who have lost their jobs?

I thougth there would be more anger, a revolution even. The only think that came close was the medical card fiasco.
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

Maybe it hasn't affected enough people yet, or hasn't affected people badly enough. For most people, the only effect is the the income levy.

As more and more people become unemployed, taxes rise and banks are given more and more of our money, maybe there will be a revolution. When people don't have much else left to pay the banks with.

It's relatively early days. I'd give it another 6 months to a year.
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

The_Banker said:
Im depressed and cowed... seriously.
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And what are you going to do about it? Do you fight it? Fight the system or give in? Will you vote in the next election? Have you lost your job?
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

People are happy so long as they've enough to get by. Sure we've never had it so good. We used to go to school with no shoes blah blah. Give the people Eastenders, Corrie and enough to buy some MacDonalds and they're happy.
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

And what are you going to do about it?
Nothing, carry on as normal trying to keep the wolf from the door.

Do you fight it?
Who do I fight? The Government, the church, the bankers (I work for a bank - low level)

Fight the system or give in?
Who is th "system". We are all the "system" in this shoddy country.

Will you vote in the next election?
Yes, but for who? FF, FG, Lab - any difference there? Greens? No thanks! Sinn Fein or the abundance of small socialist parties? Definately not. Did I miss anyone?

Have you lost your job?
No, but plently have where I work and those remaining are picking up the slack which is leading to its own pressure. I have gotten a pay cut and there is another on the way. Everyone where I work are flat out which is leading to tensions and arguments between fellow staff, meanwhile management keep telling us how lucky we are while we do over time for nothing.
Our new motto "More Work - Less Pay"

So, to sum up I will continue to be depressed and cowed.
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

But Bronte, what do you want to happen?
This is Ireland nothing happens, everything works on who you know and a wink and nod. Even arresting Seanie is a show. Do you see him doing serious time in the Joy. Like it or not we are not North Korea, where they deal with people who get the country into trouble. North Korea execute finance minister for ruining economy
Should we line up Bertie and the boys, Builders, Public servants from the Financial Regulator and Department of Finance along with all the Bank Managers and do the same?
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

Towger said:
But Bronte, what do you want to happen? Should we line up Bertie and boys, Builders, Public servants from the Financial Regulator and Department of Finance along with all the Bank Managers and do the same?
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That's what should happen. Yes. Not to shoot them obviously. Unless people fight and vote for change nothing will ever change. A new constitution and a country for the people by the people. A new way of doing things. Things could be so different if there was someone of vision. We need a new leader.

Don't say you won't vote for the others because they will make no difference. Vote becasue it will change things, vote just for changes sake, to clean out the dead wood.

Banker, I'm glad you have a job, and I do understand the 'lucky to have the job mentality' and the pressure it brings. Luckily I left that behind a long time ago.
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

Nothing will change as long as we have our current electoral system. Irish people think our PR- single transferrable vote system is a great thing (just as they thought the RC Church was a great thing, high property prices were a great thing, benchmarking was a great thing, etc etc etc). Until that changes we’ll have parish-pump local councillors instead of national legislators running the country.

BTW, FG’s proposals for a list system combined with what we have is a good start.
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

Bronte said:
Is everybody not really cross with what has happened to Ireland. With the way all bankers and regulators and politicians have played fast and loose with our economy. Or is everybody so depressed that they are cowed, especially those who have lost their jobs?

I thougth there would be more anger, a revolution even. The only think that came close was the medical card fiasco.
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I do think people are annoyed and "really cross" as you politely put it, however I do wonder if at the back of a lot of people's minds is a feeling that we/they got a bit carried away during the boom years and that some of it is a mess of their own making.

Also if you haven't lost your job then for a lot of people in the country, aside from income levies, the recession is not affecting them. They may have taken a paycut but that if offset by the fall in prices. Fall in house prices is only an issue if you want to sell, and many people don't.

On top of that is a natural Irish mentality of "sure twas too good to last".

I think the most important reason though is that no one has come up with a radically different way of doing things and people don't perceive there being another alternative
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

Bronte said:
And what are you going to do about it? Do you fight it? Fight the system or give in? Will you vote in the next election? Have you lost your job?
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From my perspective the shock has been so big that there is no way we'll get anything but change.

Opinion polls show FF + Greens will not get re-elected.

The regulator has a new head and is beefing up operations.

People are not paying silly prices for houses or land and builders have stopped unnecessary building.

FAS, TDs, etc are under scrutiny on their expenses.

Public wage restraint has been shown.

The banks have replaced many of those most culpable.

Seanie Fitz is being questioned by the guards.

Taxes have been restored to long term sustainable levels.

What are we going to do about unemployment? We pretty much have to cut government spending short term or fall into an abyss. Decreased domestic demand and job losses will follow. The best we can hope to do is limit this damage whilst addressing the sheer magnitude of the deficit and then try rebuild the domestic economy when the deficit is addressed and competitiveness restored. Anyone who talks in non-specific terms about creating jobs through innovation are just playing for soundbites.

What do you mean by fight?

Why didn't you fight when the mistakes were being made rather than when they are being dealt with?
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government

I agree with a lot of what you say, DerKaiser, but disagree with one or two of your points. Yes, the Greens will almost be wiped out but I think FF won't do as badly as many expect, partly because of their core vote and partly because, as The Banker said, there isn't any credible alternative. (Meaning no other party inspires confidence either).

Also, TD's are still doing ok expenses wise. Am I right in saying that they'll now get around €4k in expenses per month?
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government: s everybody not really cross with what has happene

Bronte said:
With the way all bankers and regulators and politicians have played fast and loose with our economy
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I agree 100% but you left out another group ..OJs. Ordinary Joe/Josephine speculators. The ones who feel let dowm by the fat cats, you know the ones who speculated in property and reinvested got rich and lost it all. The ones who believe theres only an upside to speculation and if it doesnt go up its someone elses fault. The born again socialists who chased the millionaire life style only a few years ago. This hit home for me a few weeks when on the news one day there was a couple on who were serioulsy in debt and were in the process of losing their home, it started off as a very hard luck story and how the banks were throwing money at them and they had to take. Why were they in debt... the bought FOUR apartments in dubai, they were complaining about greedy bakers ( 4 apts??)

As i said i agree with you but the greedy OJs have to be part of this mess to. I have no prob with someone making millions from speculation in anything but its a 2 way street. If you go for the quick buck like thousands of OJs did you gotta accept the risks.
 
Re: Bankers/regulators/government: is everybody not really cross with what has happen

I think everyone is peeved off by it all big style, but at the end of the day what can we do about it?

We will continue to vote in the same people, and the opposition, although they tell you different, would have made exactly the same mistakes. Govs and big businesses have always scratched each others backs, and it will continue.

The saddest thing is that this country will be paying for this sorry mess for many years to come (same as most other Western countries).
 
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