Key Post Attic Conversion.

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

We got retention for an attic conversion. The space was habitable. Cost us about €500 for the retention.

Seems one of the important things is the fire regulations. If you're going above 3 stories (for habitable space) a whole bunch of rules kick in - like having to have autoclosing doors, fire strips, fire escape windows in attic etc..

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

if the seller is happy to stand over his work he should have no problem getting it certified for you - get them to organise and pay an engineer to certify the conversion - should only cost €300 - €400.

if he won't do that i'd ignore the fact that there is a conversion as it's literally not worth owt and drop your bid accordingly.

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

if the seller is happy to stand over his work he should have no problem getting it certified for you - get them to organise and pay an engineer to certify the conversion - should only cost €300 - €400.

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I'm still a bit confused... is it possible to get a certificate of compliance on a 'non-habitable' attic conversion ??

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

as far as I know the cert of compliance states that the conversion is stucturally safe, the conversion was done in keeping with building regulations, the stairs are safe etc. Most attic conversions are considered "non-habitable" due to ceiling height, however they should still have a cert of compliance. the lender will probably look for this as part of the loan conditions so you need to get it asap!

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

gianni said:

I'm still a bit confused... is it possible to get a certificate of compliance on a 'non-habitable' attic conversion ??

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The certificate of compliance encompasses the entire building. The only time you would get a seperate cert for the attic area would be in the event of a cert having previuosly been furnished for the original house and the attic has been developed after that

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

Most attic conversions are considered "non-habitable" due to ceiling height, however they should still have a cert of compliance. the lender will probably look for this as part of the loan conditions so you need to get it asap!

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Thanks stresshead. If it's not too intrusive can I ask how you know this info i.e. have you had first hand experience of this in the past or are you in the building/planning industry etc...

Also is it possible to have a 'non-habitable' conversion that has a bathroom? I would imagine that it's a strong indication that the space is intended to be habitable. And that the CoCo would view it that way too!

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

have a read of the faq's on this website - [broken link removed]

it should give you an insight into attic conversion !

also [broken link removed]

and yes - you can definitly get a certificate for it and should as this will protect you (indemnify) against the fact that it could look great but be built out of 2*1's as no engineer/architect will Certify a building as being structurally sound but non-habitable if it is not - make sure he gets an engineer that is registered , certified and insured.

if the person selling the house is involved in the building game he should know all this and there should be no issue unless the conversion is not up to standard.

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

Habitable rooms have a floor to ceiling height of 8'.
Certain rooms do not need to be habitable: bathrooms, storage, halls, kitchens - rooms you don't have to spend much time in.

It is possible to have a "storage" room with a bathroom off it.

If I were you my biggest concern would be whether the house has been converted to a 3 storey building or not - it does get very complicated in that case. In a 2 storey building, the normal means of escape in the event of a fire is through a window. In a 3 storey building, internal fire protected structures need to be provided - like in an apartment block. Is the house now 3 storey?

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

In a 3 storey building, internal fire protected structures need to be provided - like in an apartment block. Is the house now 3 storey?

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It is indeed Superman... it was originally a 2 storey with attic...

Do all the fire regs etc apply even if the room is officially a 'non-habitable' storage area ?

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

all that information is in the links i posted - no it does not have to conform to the fire regs if non-habitable.

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

True enough Nai, but if it is in fact used as a habitable space (e.g. a bedroom), then it should have fire protection in case there is an actual fire.
It might also invalidate your house insurance.

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

I take your point Superman... from a peace of mind point of view it would be foolhardy to have an unsafe room as a bedroom. (My intentions would prob be to have it as an occasional b'room / guest room).

But at this stage I'm more concerned about having it's 'non-habitable' state being legally ok. Once this is established I could take further steps to improve the safety of the area.

Attic Conversion Quote - SSIA effect?

I got a quote for what seems to me a fairly standard attic conversion. The house is a mid terrace house and I would be putting a permanent stairs above the present stairway. There would be 2 large VELUX windows and one smaller window. The floor area is about 250sq foot. I am not installing an en-suite. The first quote I received is for 38k including VAT. There is no breakdown

Is it me or is the quote another great example of RIP OFF IRELAND. I was trying to break the costs down myself. I was expecting something like below. Has anyone else recieved a quote for an attic conversion lately.

2-3K for the stairs
5K for Windows
5K for floors other materials
10k for labour

Re: Attic Conversion Quote - SSIA effect?

sandymount said:

I got a quote for what seems to me a fairly standard attic conversion. The house is a mid terrace house and I would be putting a permanent stairs above the present stairway. There would be 2 large VELUX windows and one smaller window. The floor area is about 250sq foot. I am not installing an en-suite. The first quote I received is for 38k including VAT. There is no breakdown

Is it me or is the quote another great example of RIP OFF IRELAND. I was trying to break the costs down myself. I was expecting something like below. Has anyone else recieved a quote for an attic conversion lately.

2-3K for the stairs
5K for Windows
5K for floors other materials
10k for labour

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Just finished building a house so the numbers are fresh in my mind..Stairs was about 2.5k (your stairs would be much smaller).We have 9 windows downstairs and two doors and a patio door which all cost 5k...We did not get Velux but the cheaper and just as good Fakro (cannot remember price)..Based on my prices alone 38k is a major rip off

Re: Attic Conversion Quote - SSIA effect?

Got an attic done just a few weeks ago, standard job like yours, in Dublin area for 21k. (Move bedroom wall, put stairs in place, 3 velux windows and flooring for the eaves+ plastering, electrics etc)

That's not a bargain price by any means but its bearable.

I did received another quote for 28k for same job so the quotes do vary. In the words of the great Mary Harney??..."Shop around"

IF you want the details of who did our job let me know, though they did take a good deal longer than originally estimated, and their communication with me was atrocious. However the finish on the job is of a good standard.

Muz

Re: Attic Conversion Quote - SSIA effect?

sandymount said:

.. There is no breakdown ..

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This is just a quote, not an invoice, so you're not being ripped-off.

If you engage with the builder on the basis of this quote and the final amount is the same as the quote, they you're not being ripped-off.

You should not progress with a large amount of spend unless there is a detailed breakdown. It should be agreed with the builder that any increase in cost needs to be advised and agreed at the time of purchase so that there are no shocks at the end of the build.

The price of work is not what you think it should be - it is what the builder is willing to do it for. If you're not prepared to pay that amount and find someone willing to do it for materially less, then you need to understand why the lower quote is lower.

We're currently getting work done at home and ended up having to pay more than we (and the architect) expected. We could have paid less, but that may have meant getting a builder who didn't have his own insurance, or one who didn't have a good track record in the same type/scale of work.

You should get what you pay for.

Re: Attic Conversion Quote - SSIA effect?

I got my attic done a couple of months ago. It cost 14.5k for about 200sq ft. 2 very large Velex windows and 1 smaller window, stairs and a lot of storage space.

All the quotes I got were under 20k and I'm inthe Dublin area also.

Re: Attic Conversion Quote - SSIA effect?

Is your username is an indication of your address?

That figure is close to 30% of the cost of building a 3 bed semi.

Re: Attic Conversion Quote - SSIA effect?

We are just finishing a small developement and the builder is pre converting the attic for one of the buyers for 14K. This includes a walk in wardrobe and an en suite. The veluxes will be included but not the stairs which will be added by the buyer after closing.

Re: Legalities of Attic Conversions

This has moved on slightly... what do you think of this situation ?


Still not getting a direct answer from EA/Vendor about the supply of this infamous cert. Yet they are putting the pressure on to get moving with the deal. My problem is now this; I know that this certificate will be required so am I daft in proceeding with paying for my own structural survey on the rest of the property only for my surveyor to tell me "everything else looks ok but you'll need a cert of compliance for that attic job"... I'll have paid €450 for that yet if the vendor still fudges on the issue of supplying the cert I'll have no choice but to walk away - €450 down the drain.

I would prefer if things were the other way around, ie the vendor would begin process of obtaining certificate while I would then engage my surveyor. The same argument holds for getting a solicitor involved... don't want to do this unless there is going to be some movement on the certificate front. But am I caught in a catch 22 ? Do I have to get the solicitor involved to ensure that the cert is obtained ? Maybe for some people this wouldn't be a big issue... but I'm not someone who has access to a lot of money - a few 000's€ would take me a while to accumulate again..

I'm really not impressed with the attitude of the EA - blatantly/consistently ignoring my query and claiming that he can't contact the vendor. I know the EA is acting for the vendor and not for me but I wonder does he realise how close I am to walking away from the whole deal. (Although this may be cutting off my nose to spite my face...)

All thoughts are welcome...